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Thread: Re-thinking Asylum

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    Politics.ie Member JacquesHughes's Avatar
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    Default Re-thinking Asylum

    Yesterday was an historic day for the EU- the first mass return of 'refugees' from the EU to a (hastily declared) 'safe' but unattractive country (Turkey) which has contracted a treaty with the EU to accept them, oiled along with inducements for the State of Turkey. The 202 returned had declined to make claims for asylum. 130 were from Pakistan, and others from Iraq, Iran, Morocco and other countries. Another 2800 asylum seekers have remained on Lesbos in order to pursue their claim individually through whatever process the Greek authorities can set up for such vast numbers (1 million last year).
    Migrants returned to Turkey from Greece under EU deal - BBC News

    In compensation the first selected Syrian refugees have been flown to Germany from refugee camps in Turkey- their number capped at 72000 per year.
    EU asylum laws have apparently not been changed, but the principles have been distorted. The only hope for 'success' of the policy is that a 'culture of expectation' is being changed throughout many Asian and African countries, so that millions are less confident that irregular travel to Europe will have a personally good outcome.

    Comment: It has been necessary 'in the end' (but actually, we're nowhere near the end) to recognise (as should have been done all along) the special position of the Syrian refugees; but much, much more should be done to stabilise huge populations in the Third World which see little reason to stay at home. Some of them are:

    - shelter in a European country should be temporary (for the duration of the crisis) not permanent
    - asylum should be for that presenting persecuted individual, not automatically for his entire family
    - university fees should not be 'paid' but funded as loans with an expectation of being repaid
    - legal challenges to a government decision to refuse asylum should be heard in a safe country outside europe

    - the countries producing bona fide refugees should be getting comprehensively thumped by smart sanctions
    - the countries producing economic migrants should be getting effective help to relocate economic activity eg agriculture from Europe to those countries
    - foreign policies (intervention etc) by European countries should consider their likely destabilising effect upon vulnerable populations
    ( I have not been able to think up a way to protect those vulnerable in our own society from direct competition for subsidised social housing. The concept of such housing probably needs rethought.)



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    Politics.ie Member nonpartyboy's Avatar
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    And yet we had 250 people a month mainly from the indian sub continent arriving from the uk to claim asylum last year, because we run a joke of a system. Then we have the fake brides and the fake students.

    Our immigration system is a shambles, plain and simple.

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    Politics.ie Member Kershaw's Avatar
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    The beaches and bazaars of Sharm El Sheikh used to be bustling with tourists enjoying the Egyptian sun.

    But after a decade of political turmoil and the downing of a Russian holiday jet last year, killing all 224 passengers, tourists are staying away and the Red Sea resort resembles a ghost town.

    Sharm El Sheikh appears little more than a ghost town after attack on Russia airliner | Daily Mail Online

    Could be a good location to shelter the migrants until the war is over and they can return home.

    Last year an Egyptian billionaire wanted to buy a Greek island to house the migrants. This mirrored Australia's policy which resulted in their asylum number claims drop like a rock.
    Egyptian billionaire approaches Greek island owners with offer to buy land for refugees | Europe | News | The Independent

    The latest news is Greece has halted deportations to Turkey after they all put in claims for asylum in Greece.
    Migrant crisis: Greece halts deportations to Turkey - BBC News
    Immigration Statistics - Ireland | 'Islam is the greatest threat to the secular value system in France' - Cynicist

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    Politics.ie Member Dame_Enda's Avatar
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    We will continue to have a shambles of an asylum system until we renegotiate or withdraw from the 1952 Refugee Convention which in no way takes into account the ease of international air travel and the freedom of movement in the EU.

    Let in:
    - people fleeing genocide, war, political persecution or natural disaster in a neighbouring country.

    Keep out:
    - Nationals of safe countries. This group should be summarily deported and not allowed apply for asylum. The Refugee Convention may be an obstacle here as it bans collective expulsions.

    - Sex offenders, drug dealers, weapons traffickers, bank robbers and violent criminals.
    Last edited by Dame_Enda; 6th April 2016 at 01:10 AM.
    "A great city is not to be confounded with a populous one." - Aristotle

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    Politics.ie Member Kershaw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nonpartyboy View Post
    And yet we had 250 people a month mainly from the indian sub continent arriving from the uk to claim asylum last year, because we run a joke of a system. Then we have the fake brides and the fake students.

    Our immigration system is a shambles, plain and simple.
    That's what I can't understand. Why aren't they applying Dublin rules and kicking them back to the UK? They're only coming here from there once there once their application is denied there.
    Immigration Statistics - Ireland | 'Islam is the greatest threat to the secular value system in France' - Cynicist

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    Looks like a bad PR stunt, run of the mill for the multicultists. There's no change and nobody could seriously believe there was any effort to stop the invasion.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dame_Enda View Post
    We will continue to have a shambles of an asylum system until we renegotiate or withdraw from the 1952 Refugee Convention which in no way takes into account the ease of international air travel and the freedom of movement in the EU.

    Let in:
    - people fleeing genocide, war, political persecution or natural disaster in a neighbouring country.

    Keep out:
    - Nationals of safe countries. This group should be summarily deported and not allowed apply for asylum. The Refugee Convention may be an obstacle here as it bans collective expulsions.

    - Sex offenders, drug dealers, weapons traffickers, bank robbers and violent criminals.
    The EU is lumbered with limp-wristed x-factor wannabes for leaders, who are unable to face the harsh reality that hundreds of thousands of migrants cannot be simply dumped into established societies without causing serious problems for the natives and for the migrants.
    The solo run by Merkel will yet establish her as one of the worst political leaders in Europe.
    And still, instead of a plan, we're now seeing a panicked reaction, as reality begins to dawn.

    An immigration policy should never be a matter of simply walking into a country, regardless of the numbers involved.

    The EU has never grown up and consequently it is facing collapse amid the ruins of its own childish, unbending 'principles'.

    A message for EU Leaders - "Grow tf up!"

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    Politics.ie Member JacquesHughes's Avatar
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    Default Austria is not waiting for the European Commission to solve this one.

    On 26 April the Austrian parliament passed 'tough' new asylum laws, establishing the government's power to close Austria's borders to many (possibly all; it's a bit unclear) asylum seekers during an influx 'emergency'.
    Migrant crisis: Austria passes controversial new asylum law - BBC News

    Outraged MEPs in the euro parliament seem to be focussing their opposition on the possibility of Austria building a fence around the Brenner pass entry point (from Italy) in anticipation of this summer's arrivals from Libya.
    MEPs urge Juncker to stand against Austria border fence – EurActiv.com

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    Politics.ie Member Fir Bolg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dame_Enda View Post
    We will continue to have a shambles of an asylum system until we renegotiate or withdraw from the 1952 Refugee Convention which in no way takes into account the ease of international air travel and the freedom of movement in the EU.

    Let in:
    - people fleeing genocide, war, political persecution or natural disaster in a neighbouring country.

    Keep out:
    - Nationals of safe countries. This group should be summarily deported and not allowed apply for asylum. The Refugee Convention may be an obstacle here as it bans collective expulsions.

    - Sex offenders, drug dealers, weapons traffickers, bank robbers and violent criminals.
    This is the only logical solution to the problem. The Geneva convention on refugees is completely out dated and was set up under different climate to accommodate displaced European people within Europe after WW2. It was never intended to import millions of people from different continents into Europe and the resulting chaos that ensues.

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    Politics.ie Member Analyzer's Avatar
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    The EU commisariat in Brussels is presided over by idiots like Big Fill, Jean Caude W@nker etc.

    Then you have Merkel + Hollande = Merde.

    The consequences are a series of disasters.
    Coveney's ambition is the be Ireland's next EU Commissar and Ireland will pay a price as he builds his CV to position himself sufficiently loyal to the nEU empire.

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