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Thread: Taoiseach visits our lads in the EU Army, somewhere in Africa

  1. #111
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    Leo left the female members of his group outside of a site he was visiting today because only men are allowed to enter it. That was a serious error of judgement and he should have declined to enter the place. It's all very well talking the talk about discrimination but it's only very recently in India or Pakistan were men were calling for the murder of some women who tried to enter a site that had been male only but which had been allowing women to enter. Lets be very honest here, this is all about Leo getting a vote for his bid for a seat on the UN Council. Throwing women under the bus to get it is fine with him when it suits him.

    Taoiseach forced to leave high ranking female officials to visit monastery in Ethiopia - Independent.ie

  2. #112
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lagertha View Post
    Leo left the female members of his group outside of a site he was visiting today because only men are allowed to enter it. That was a serious error of judgement and he should have declined to enter the place. It's all very well talking the talk about discrimination but it's only very recently in India or Pakistan were men were calling for the murder of some women who tried to enter a site that had been male only but which had been allowing women to enter. Lets be very honest here, this is all about Leo getting a vote for his bid for a seat on the UN Council. Throwing women under the bus to get it is fine with him when it suits him.

    Taoiseach forced to leave high ranking female officials to visit monastery in Ethiopia - Independent.ie
    I think complaining about " equality" is only allowed when bashing Trump in the US or creating makie uppie jobs for Eamon Gilmores wife or Ivana Bacik.

  3. #113
    Politics.ie Member Ireniall's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by recedite View Post
    When the US organises a mission to "restore order" (regime change) to places like Iraq or Afghanistan it will usually invite along a few others to give it the impression of an "international coalition". Georgia usually volunteers for these, because it is desperate to move away from the Russian sphere of influence and into the EU and Nato sphere. Also its military is funded by the US.
    So just because the likes of Georgia and Albania were invited along does not make this an international coalition.

    This is a mission conceived in Brussels, at the behest of the French, which follows along similar lines to what the French army has been doing solo in the region for many decades. Controlling which warlords are in power in the French sphere of influence.
    It is NOT a UN blue helmet peacekeeping mission, of the type Irish troops used to get involved in, when we were a neutral country.
    These activities in the French controlled Sahel region are not any of our business.
    Being members of the EU is totally incompatible with neutrality. It is even incompatible with being non-aligned. Being members of the EU means that we are very definitely aligned. Russia-our only likely antagonist-does not distinguish between the EU and Nato and , quite correctly, views membership of the EU as tantamount to being in Nato. Russia is not going to accept any EU countries notion that they are neutral.

    Russia would not dare to treat an EU country in the same manner that it treats Ukraine because they know that the likely response would be a war with both organisations. If this war did not materialise in the event of similar actions from Russia to what happened in Crimea and Donetsk then the credibility of the western alliance and the EU would be finished and every one, especially Russia, will know that. In contrast you can be sure that a Russian administration which felt confident enough to attempt actions like that in an EU country was cavalier about war with the west and would be most unlikely to change having had their aggression rewarded with inaction or inadequate actions( e.g.trade sanctions).

    It is imperative then that EU/Nato countries must stick together like glue and never allow the idea to gain ground that there might be any sort of division or equivocation about the response in the event of a member being attacked because it will be too late by that time to gain the full benefit of that solidarity. We do not want the solidarity to be expressed in the form of a war. We want the solidarity to be expressed before there is any war and allow no potential belligerent to operate under the illusion that there will be anything other than a united ,full on response to any aggression against a member state. When you are living in a free and open society the only way to portray that solidarity is to declare it regularly and to mean it.In a democracy you cannot 'pretend' to have a united front. You either have one or you don't. Political dissension is inevitable but that is understood and does not count unless the majority of the people agree and the particular country leaves the alliance.

    We are in such an alliance and if Russia invades some part of Latvia in the morning we will be at war with Russia the next day and if we are not then lets not worry about our neutrality. The EU and Nato will have had their bluff called and it will be the beginning of the end for them. Poland Sweden and Finland and what is left of the Baltic states will have to fend for themselves which will mean that they will have to develop their own nuclear deterrent if they can agree amongst themselves that it gets used at the first sign of troops out of uniform arriving on their territory-unlikely so perhaps a Polish nuclear deterrent might arise on its own and the Baltic states will be sacrificed while Finland and Sweden depend on their own conventional armed forces. If I was Finnish I would be nervous about that but the big picture is that you have replaced a stable and contained situation with a very unstable, threatening situation where no European state as far west as Germany could feel entirely safe and the nuclear rule book lying in shreds along with Nato and the rest of western unity.

    The EU could hardly continue in its present form in this scenario. Countries in the east setting up their own alliances and developing nuclear weapons would need the freedom to act in their own interests which might bring them into conflict with both EU and international law. They would likely begin to leave the EU in this case and a total breakdown would be a real possibility. In Ireland we would be back to something like the 1980s with the arses out of our trousers as western Europe has to restructure towards a shrinking and more protective economic environment.

    Clearly the attitude of the USA would be critical in this situation. I think that a US administration which valued the transatlantic links and was interested in it's role as a world power would prevent this scenario from developing in the first place. Plain clothes soldiers taking over parts of Latvia with Russian made tanks would be attacked and ejected immediately with US leadership. But if the great blowhard turns out to be the start of a trend in the US then this is where it gets hairy. To add to this we have Brexit where the closest European ally of the USA is leaving the EU. To me this must mean that France is now the primary European military power and the country to which America must turn from now on with the British having laughably removed themselves from this enviable position of influence.

    I believe that the French are strongly pro-EU despite the large ish opposition internally and they will pull Nato more and more into an EU scenario with the Brits as merely an add-on with various opt outs and the rest. EU leaders will naturally discuss and decide Nato actions in the same way as the Eurozone countries de facto decide EU actions. If this scenario develops then the two Anglo countries might be increasingly detached from European defence without Europe having fully evolved enough unity to replace it properly. If the cost of that unity is following France into Mali then I suggest that it is a small price to pay.

    While I'm blathering on I might as well add my concerns about Turkey and its position as a Nato member. Turkey is in a part of the world where unfortunately there is a lot of conflict and they are increasingly pro-active in engaging with it. They have also an on-going ,barely sub-conflict relationship with the various Kurd entities and are involved in situations in which the EU have no direct interests and indeed might well be more sympathetic to the other side. It is most inappropriate that Turkey might get us involved in a conflict in the Middle East through its membership of Nato-which of course imposes no responsibilities on the governments of members to ensure proper human rights and democratic norms. Yet on the other hand the dangers of not supporting a member state are very corrosive in my opinion for the reasons given above. In this way the gradual hand over to the EU might be a good thing in that it would eliminate non-democratic countries and might restrict the alliance to being a more defensive and strictly European organisation.

  4. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by ruman View Post
    I think complaining about " equality" is only allowed when bashing Trump in the US or creating makie uppie jobs for Eamon Gilmores wife or Ivana Bacik.
    Links?
    "So how are things at the Campaign for the Freedom of Information, by the way?" "Sorry, I can't talk about that"

  5. #115
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    Quote Originally Posted by hiding behind a poster View Post
    Links?
    Twas a throwaway comment referring to the faux outrage over Trump while our glorious leaders continue to have no problem mingling with leaders of countries where the treatment of women is 100 years behind that in the US.

    Ms Mna's recent antics being a prime example.

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    Politics.ie Member redneck's Avatar
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    It is good that Leo is visiting the troops, but it is not nice the way they are treated pay wise. FFg always show disdain for our Army- and praise the British army, or the Ulster army UDR.
    Also some of these African countries ban Gays, so how is that aspect playing?
    Lets keep Dublin litter free- Coinnigh Atha Cliatha glán

  7. #117
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    Was this the same oglaigh na heireann who failed their northern people in the troubles. They legged it.

  8. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by workhousejohnjoe View Post
    Was this the same oglaigh na heireann who failed their northern people in the troubles. They legged it.
    Is this the same Northern people who bottled it in 1916 and again in 1922 and left us to do all the fighting. Bunch of cowards
    It may be the reason both sides in the Treaty debate put The Oath of Allegiance ahead of Partition.?

  9. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by workhousejohnjoe View Post
    Was this the same oglaigh na heireann who failed their northern people in the troubles. They legged it.
    Would you be mixing them up with the I R an A way clowns by any chance.?

  10. #120
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    Quote Originally Posted by redneck View Post
    It is good that Leo is visiting the troops, but it is not nice the way they are treated pay wise. FFg always show disdain for our Army- and praise the British army, or the Ulster army UDR.
    Also some of these African countries ban Gays, so how is that aspect playing?
    Maybe the fountain of information, Kehoe, will fill us in on his return from vacation. Hopefully he will have the ability to speak clearly.
    Slán to Care. The Fine Gael way.

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