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crosswind

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160

crosswind

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Oct 15, 2003
Messages
160
The Prime Time program last night was geniunely moving. It was presented with precision and compassion. It is difficult to still be looking at the severe failings in our mental health system and the way people with intelectual disabilities are treated in care. There are again promises of change but will it be different now. Funding has been announced to go to the Mental Health services in recent times before but ended up being spent elsewhere and that was in the time when spending was increasing quickly. There was also the proposal to ring fence all sales of land from the mental health sector which if implemented would show that the minister means business.
prime time
 

irish_bob

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Jul 9, 2008
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7,559
The Prime Time program last night was geniunely moving. It was presented with precision and compassion. It is difficult to still be looking at the severe failings in our mental health system and the way people with intelectual disabilities are treated in care. There are again promises of change but will it be different now. Funding has been announced to go to the Mental Health services in recent times before but ended up being spent elsewhere and that was in the time when spending was increasing quickly. There was also the proposal to ring fence all sales of land from the mental health sector which if implemented would show that the minister means business.
prime time
last nights primetime was full of cliched PC rhetoric ( mainly from miriam btw) and wooly liberal pull at the hert strings clap trap , not once was it suggested where theese people might be relocated to , i was left with the impression that they should be simply released into the community , we have an incredibly liberal policy in this country in relation to people who are not the full schilling , as someone who is related to someone who is not all in it , i know that you litterally have to kill someone before you are detained against your will , those people last night were inside from before the law changed , thier was a time when simply being an embarrasment to your family could land you in the big house , the pendelum has now completley swung to the other side
 

gallowglass

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444 people last year. It is particularly high among young men. Attempted suicides are particularly high among young women.
The official suicide figures are artificially low due to coroners decisions.

It is also incorrect to talk about the high number of "attempted suicides" among young women.
These are para-suicides and are,in reality, episodes of Deliberate Self harm.

Although traumatic to watch and,no doubt, to endure DSH is help seeking behaviour.
It is not an attempt to end a life.

The suicidal intent in this behaviour is very low.

When women want to end their own lives they are perfectly capable of doing so.

On this island suicide is a killer of men,mainly young men.

The medical model has no adequate explanation why this should be so.

Phil on The Right Hook, Newstalk Radio | Phil Mac Giolla Bhain
 

crosswind

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Oct 15, 2003
Messages
160
last nights primetime was full of cliched PC rhetoric ( mainly from miriam btw) and wooly liberal pull at the hert strings clap trap , not once was it suggested where theese people might be relocated to , i was left with the impression that they should be simply released into the community , we have an incredibly liberal policy in this country in relation to people who are not the full schilling , as someone who is related to someone who is not all in it , i know that you litterally have to kill someone before you are detained against your will , those people last night were inside from before the law changed , thier was a time when simply being an embarrasment to your family could land you in the big house , the pendelum has now completley swung to the other side
The general policy is to move people from the old institutions into community based settings A Vision for Change. Something closer to the warmth of a home. There have been reports before about what should happen, the problem has been implementing the reports. People have been talking about what the policy is for a while now with limited success, the focus on resourcing the actual implementation of policies is what interested people need to be reassured of now rather than talking up a good policy with wooly platitudes and being quiet on how it is coming through on the ground.
It's not good enough to leave people locked away for years living in very poor conditions. As bad if not worse keep people with intelectual disability in the wrong setting in mental health facilities. People deserve respect and dignity; it shouldn't have to be stated but some of the old institutions are still there. John Moloney, Minister with direct responsiblity for Mental Health is speaking about changing that in the not too distant future and that a vision for change is going to get a jump start.
Professionals make decisions on the extent to which someone is a danger to others or to themselves in the middle of an acute episode or on an ongoing basis. Nobody wants to make the wrong decision but tragically it happens in any system. The aim is prevention with proper resourcing of the mental health services so that where possible mental health difficulties are identified and tackled long before they become severe.
 

greenporcupine

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Oct 21, 2009
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I think people need not only to accept 'depression' or mental instability as part and parcel of being human.
It is my opinion that anyone who does not ever get depressed is lying,even very angry
with no outlet causes problems ,and there is plenty to be angry and frustrated about.

It is often idealisers who commit suicide,when they realise how tarnished the world is.
How filthy it is and how much the liberal camp can tolerate of disgustingness,and where as ,in the past a good family life protected the purer vulnerable ones ,now they are let lose on a materialistic,pornographic,drug ridden culture which thinks that to have as much sex,money as possible is the goal of life supported by the Irish [trash]Times and such.
Anyone who dares to question this is a ''..phobe, a 'nutjob', and so on.
It is no mystery,we are killing some of our potential best ,while the sh.... continues to thrive.

.
It is a total disgrace to a civilised society that in a popoulation so small so many young men think life is not worth living .
I will add to that that the Church needs to take this seriously.
They need to find ways not to condemn but show sympathy and warmth to those in need of it.
There is no question that the liberal [moral agenda] is hugely to blame ,by saying there are no rules in the universe ,therefore ,no hope of justice.
They are liars.
 

crosswind

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Oct 15, 2003
Messages
160
The official suicide figures are artificially low due to coroners decisions.

It is also incorrect to talk about the high number of "attempted suicides" among young women.
These are para-suicides and are,in reality, episodes of Deliberate Self harm.

Although traumatic to watch and,no doubt, to endure DSH is help seeking behaviour.
It is not an attempt to end a life.

The suicidal intent in this behaviour is very low.
The suicidal intent varies widely including minimal or zero and to repeat, it was a mistake to initially use the term attempted suicide as opposed to parasuicide back then. People who attempt suicide are not excluded, only people who die by suicide or who had no intention of hurting themselves in the first place are. It would be of use to be able to rely on a clear attempted suicide figure but there is very important work done on deliberate self-harm to cover what is a high risk group in terms of suicide.
Some worthwhile reading on the subject and suicide in general.
National Office for Suicide Prevention NSRF research bulletin National Suicide Reseach Foundation (all pdf)
NOSP2009 presentations presentation (powerpoint)
The 2008 figures are 11,700 seperate admissions for deliberate self harm by 9,218 people (up 6%). 223 per 100,000 for women, 180 per 100,000 for men.
 

gallowglass

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Feb 25, 2009
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The suicidal intent varies widely including minimal or zero and to repeat, it was a mistake to initially use the term attempted suicide as opposed to parasuicide back then. People who attempt suicide are not excluded, only people who die by suicide or who had no intention of hurting themselves in the first place are. It would be of use to be able to rely on a clear attempted suicide figure but there is very important work done on deliberate self-harm to cover what is a high risk group in terms of suicide.
Some worthwhile reading on the subject and suicide in general.
National Office for Suicide Prevention NSRF research bulletin National Suicide Reseach Foundation (all pdf)
NOSP2009 presentations presentation (powerpoint)
The 2008 figures are 11,700 seperate admissions for deliberate self harm by 9,218 people (up 6%). 223 per 100,000 for women, 180 per 100,000 for men.
Bringing DSH into the suicide analysis is an error-imo-it serves a femninist agenda that would rather we dont look too carefuly at why it is men-mainly young men who walk to the shed in Ireland in their hundreds every year.
 

crosswind

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Messages
160
Bringing DSH into the suicide analysis is an error-imo-it serves a femninist agenda that would rather we dont look too carefuly at why it is men-mainly young men who walk to the shed in Ireland in their hundreds every year.
People who deliberately self harm are a key risk group for suicide and offer information on the breakdown of people who have acted with various levels of suicidal intent to harm themselves. The majority of whom have overdosed on some kind of medication. It doesn't make sense to ignore it in this context. It would be even worse to ignore it when they come into contact with health services and it should be made sure that they get the appropriate treatment.
The loss of so many men to suicide is extremely troubling and the loss of both men and women to suicide doesn't get the attention it should. In the first half of last year there was a large increase in the number of people who died by suicide and there were also large numbers becoming unemployed (majority male) in the same time period. The growing number of people who die by suicide should be a matter of greater political importance but it is still not nearly as prominant as the road accident prevention campaigns.


Irish Times " 'Inhuman' psychiatric hospitals may face closure"
 

HYENA

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Jan 21, 2011
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2,998
Teenline requires 100k per year to keep children a line, just about the amount alleged by some newspapers to be sitting in the entertainment fund at SIPTU of public money. Keeping children alive is more important than the wineing and dineing conducted by Mr. Merrigan.
 

TheGMB

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Oct 13, 2013
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People who deliberately self harm are a key risk group for suicide and offer information on the breakdown of people who have acted with various levels of suicidal intent to harm themselves. The majority of whom have overdosed on some kind of medication. It doesn't make sense to ignore it in this context. It would be even worse to ignore it when they come into contact with health services and it should be made sure that they get the appropriate treatment.
The loss of so many men to suicide is extremely troubling and the loss of both men and women to suicide doesn't get the attention it should. In the first half of last year there was a large increase in the number of people who died by suicide and there were also large numbers becoming unemployed (majority male) in the same time period. The growing number of people who die by suicide should be a matter of greater political importance but it is still not nearly as prominant as the road accident prevention campaigns.


Irish Times " 'Inhuman' psychiatric hospitals may face closure"
many people who kkill themselves have had contact with health services in the days before they die.
 

Ardillaun

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Jun 4, 2010
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The assessment of suicide prevention programs is obviously a complex business, more so than cancer prevention, for example. It must be very difficult to rigorously isolate the beneficial effect of such programs from other factors - a statistical and sometimes ethical nightmare.

Many years ago, the issue of determining the manner of death as suicide used to be a big issue in places like Galway. The criteria are still debated in North America too, especially with drug overdoses.
 

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