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Alliance set to scupper Unionist 'plan C' over cenotaph Union flag.


theloner

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A proposal to have the union flag fly over the cenotaph in the grounds of Belfast City Hall is set to be rejected on equality grounds. Alliance has the power to pass it, if they supported the DUP motion introduced by councillor Lee Reynolds. A recent Tele poll concluded Alliance Party activists are overwhelmingly united in support of its policy on designated flying days for the Union flag in Belfast. It seems this will continue in relation to the cenotaph flag.

Unionist 'plan B' was to attempt force a review into extending the number of days the union flag is flown over Stormont's parliament building. Alliance, SF & the SDLP all boycotted the meeting to discuss it, citing it as political games.

On December 3 last year, Alliance councillors amended a nationalist motion to stop flying the Union flag on City Hall so that it would instead fly 17 days a year. This resulted in riots, road blocks, criminal records, jail terms and red faces.

Although in the immediate aftermath of unionist protests it seemed Alliance would back the Union flag to fly over the cenotaph 365, it has rightly taken the same advice that was given over flying the union flag every day at city hall. Alliance must be congratulated for its brave and principled stance and not giving in to a gaggle of knuckledraggers who have brought embarrassment and negative headlines to NI since December 3rd.

BBC News - Cenotaph flag plans at Belfast City Hall need Alliance support
 

DavidCaldwell

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At the risk of stating the obvious, it would be best to find a solution that everybody finds acceptable. The Cenotaph suggestion might not be suitable, but the thinking behind it seems to be heading in the right direction.
 

InsideImDancing

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At the risk of stating the obvious, it would be best to find a solution that everybody finds acceptable. The Cenotaph suggestion might not be suitable, but the thinking behind it seems to be heading in the right direction.
Flying it at the cenotaph is just sectarian territory marking.

If they do it Nationalists will dump it altogether when they get the majority.
 

theloner

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At the risk of stating the obvious, it would be best to find a solution that everybody finds acceptable. The Cenotaph suggestion might not be suitable, but the thinking behind it seems to be heading in the right direction.
Agreed, but don't you think it sullies the memory of the dead remembered on the cenotaph, as putting a flag there 365 was a knee-jerk reaction at 'righting the perceived wrong' in the eyes of unionist politicians in Belfast. Effectively turning the cenotaph into, at best a political tool and at worst, the setting of a political game?
 

DavidCaldwell

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Agreed, but don't you think it sullies the memory of the dead remembered on the cenotaph, as putting a flag there 365 was a knee-jerk reaction at 'righting the perceived wrong' in the eyes of unionist politicians in Belfast. Effectively turning the cenotaph into, at best a political tool and at worst, the setting of a political game?
Yes, I would agree that the Cenotaph suggestion was not suitable, particularly since it commemorates people from both sides of the community, including some who, while they were prepared to wear a British uniform while fighting Nazism, would otherwise have prefered the Tricolour to the Union Jack.

I think we need a flag for Northern Ireland.
 

Republic32

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Whatever your opinions on the Union flag over Belfast City Hall argument,the fact that a contingent within the two main Unionist parties are using the War Memorial at Belfast City Hall as ammunition for their petty point scoring is pathetic and as low as it gets. I'm sure many unionist posters here would agree with me on that.
 

DavidCaldwell

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Whatever your opinions on the Union flag over Belfast City Hall argument,the fact that a contingent within the two main Unionist parties are using the War Memorial at Belfast City Hall as ammunition for their petty point scoring is pathetic and as low as it gets. I'm sure many unionist posters here would agree with me on that.
I would draw the opposite conclusion - that they see the flag not as petty point scoring but as having similar significance to a War Memorial.
 

McSlaggart

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I would draw the opposite conclusion - that they see the flag not as petty point scoring but as having similar significance to a War Memorial.
They do see them the same I agree. It is very sad. Turning a world war 1 "war memorial" into a place that people who even fought for the British Army would not go to takes some doing.
 

DavidCaldwell

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They do see them the same I agree. It is very sad. Turning a world war 1 "war memorial" into a place that people who even fought for the British Army would not go to takes some doing.
I think the answer is for this to be discussed and pointed out to them. I would image that the Unionist politicians aren't intending to drag the Cenotaph into controversy - that their suggestion was made in good faith.
 

McSlaggart

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I would image that the Unionist politicians aren't intending to drag the Cenotaph into controversy - that their suggestion was made in good faith.
I remember a British Army RC Chaplin years ago explain to me how aggressive how found a DUP person was with him. The DUP man at the time had great trouble getting it into his head that the British Army had RC Chaplin in their ranks.

BTW: (I am sure the DUP knew in theory they had them {ie WW1}but the reality of meeting one must have freaked him out.)
 

cmca1

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Yes because 365 days a year is completely different at the Cenotaph beside city hall than 365 days a year AT City Hall...creative thinking by our flag-obsessed, scraping the bottom of the barrel unionist councillors.

Fair play again to Alliance!
 
C

Castle Ray

The Unionist nobheads in City Hall might have been better to ask the RBL if they thought it was a good idea first, because apparently the RBL does not support a 365-flying at the cenotaph.
 

DavidCaldwell

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In your opinions, which of the following possible compromises would be acceptable?

Perhaps answer for you yourself, for your "side", and for the other "side" - so Y, Y, N means that you and most people of your side would be OK with the idea, but you think that the other side of the community would not be so happy.

1) Flying both the Union Jack and the Tricolour

2) Flying both the Union Jack and a flag for the island of Ireland

3) Flying a new flag for Belfast

4) Flying a new flag for Belfast that incorporates a small Union Jack and elements of an all Ireland flag (e.g. from the Presidential standard).

5) Flying a new flag for Belfast that incorporates a small Union Jack and a small Tricolour.

6) Flying a new flag for Belfast that incorporates a sickle, a skull and a swastika.
 
Last edited:

Glaucon

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I have little time for the British Army, but the dead are dead and deserve the respect of our silence, if nothing else. The crass using of their memories as political bait in the DUP's war with Nationalism is rather pathetic.

Nationalists should do all they legally can to attempt to stop this going through.
 

InsideImDancing

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In your opinions, which of the following possible compromises would be acceptable?

Perhaps answer for you yourself, for your "side", and for the other "side" - so Y, Y, N means that you and most people of your side would be OK with the idea, but you think that the other side of the community would not be so happy.

1) Flying both the Union Jack and the Tricolour

2) Flying both the Union Jack and a flag for the island of Ireland

3) Flying a new flag for Belfast

4) Flying a new flag for Belfast that incorporates a small Union Jack and elements of an all Ireland flag (e.g. from the Presidential standard).

5) Flying a new flag for Belfast that incorporates a small Union Jack and a small Tricolour.

6) Flying the Skull and Cross-bones.
Fly no flags, a Belfast civic flag, or the Skull and Cross-bones

Although I think most CNRs would be happy with two flags, I'm not so sure.
 

Glaucon

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1) Flying both the Union Jack and the Tricolour - Yes.

2) Flying both the Union Jack and a flag for the island of Ireland - Yes.

3) Flying a new flag for Belfast - Yes.

4) Flying a new flag for Belfast that incorporates a small Union Jack and elements of an all Ireland flag (e.g. from the Presidential standard). - I'd have to see the look of it; the flag of Australia, for instance, incorporates a UJ in the canton and looks awful.

5) Flying a new flag for Belfast that incorporates a small Union Jack and a small Tricolour. Yes

6) Flying the Skull and Cross-bones. Absolutely!
 

InsideImDancing

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I have little time for the British Army, but the dead are dead and deserve the respect of our silence, if nothing else. The crass using of their memories as political bait in the DUP's war with Nationalism is rather pathetic.

Nationalists should do all they legally can to attempt to stop this going through.
And if they can't they'll just sit back and wait for the majority, which looks a certainty in the next few years.
 
C

Castle Ray

I have little time for the British Army, but the dead are dead and deserve the respect of our silence, if nothing else. The crass using of their memories as political bait in the DUP's war with Nationalism is rather pathetic.
I agree.

Nationalists should do all they legally can to attempt to stop this going through.
Why? Would they not be better leaving it alone?
 
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