Are pension cuts to the elderly a case of "you reap what you sow"?

Tom Red

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In college today, there was a heated debate in class where one section of the class claimed that the generation now availing of the old age pension have always been Fianna Fáils largest support base and after helping FF into power election after election, with pension cuts on the horizon, they are reaping what they have sown.

I listened but couldn't voice an opinion either way as I do not know who FF's largest support base has traditionally been. I'm trying to look up some info on the net about it but I'm finding it very hard to get the info I'm looking for.

Could anyone provide me with some links to this info if they know please or point me in the right direction to help my search?

Thank you.
 


ellie08

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In college today, there was a heated debate in class where one section of the class claimed that the generation now availing of the old age pension have always been Fianna Fáils largest support base and after helping FF into power election after election, with pension cuts on the horizon, they are reaping what they have sown.

I listened but couldn't voice an opinion either way as I do not know who FF's largest support base has traditionally been. I'm trying to look up some info on the net about it but I'm finding it very hard to get the info I'm looking for.

Could anyone provide me with some links to this info if they know please or point me in the right direction to help my search?

Thank you.
I'll tell you this much, I bet the over 65's worked much harder and had none of the luxuries most college students enjoy today. Even if they did vote FF, they worked their whole lives (most of them) and were free to exercise their democratic rights by voting for who they believed in and deserve to be looked after. I wonder how many of those criticizing the elderly FF (without evidence it seems - a sad sign if that's the standard), have paid their own registration fees, their digs, their meals etc.?
 

Oldira1

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Instead of all this tugging at the heartstrings ************************e about the salt of the earth older people can we have an ECONOMIC argument on why pensions should not be cut rather than an moral one?

If the IMF walked in you can be damn sure the pension would be cut.

People should stop being dishonest.

Its almost as if young people on the dole are being told to feck off abroad as we need our money to pay the pensions.
 

ellie08

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Instead of all this tugging at the heartstrings ************************e about the salt of the earth older people can we have an ECONOMIC argument on why pensions should not be cut rather than an moral one?

If the IMF walked in you can be damn sure the pension would be cut.

People should stop being dishonest.

Its almost as if young people on the dole are being told to feck off abroad as we need our money to pay the pensions.
The old age pension is very meagre. These people paid their taxes for 40 odd years. They paid for their pension. Young people have more opportunities, the elderly don't.
 

Tom Red

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After more searching, I have found a power point presentation of the exit polls from 2007 general election.

Exit Polls 2007 GE

Seems to be the only thing I can find with that kind of information at the moment. Can't find power point presentations or exit polls for other general election years.


*EDIT - just noticed the reply after I posted.

Before you work yourself up into a self righteous tirade, I was simply asking where I could find these facts to look at them myself and have not stated any position I may have on the subject. In general I'm sure the majority of people under 65 these days have more luxuries in life than the over 65s so can the horsesh*t.

I believe the argument in the class was that they freely used their democratic right (as you say) to vote FF into power and now FF are shafting them. There was no bloodlust or calls to hang the elderly out to dry.
 
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johnfás

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If they don't get a jobs strategy there will be nobody to pay the tax receipts which fund the old aged pension from current expenditure.
 

Squire Allworthy

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If they don't get a jobs strategy there will be nobody to pay the tax receipts which fund the old aged pension from current expenditure.
Indeed


The old age pension is very meagre. These people paid their taxes for 40 odd years. They paid for their pension. Young people have more opportunities, the elderly don't.
+1

A society that does not protect the frail is barbaric.

The elderly often find travel difficult, they feel the cold and spend much of the time at home. Their needs are generally simple enough. Many serve useful roles looking after grand children, doing voluntary work.
 

Clanrickard

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. Even if they did vote FF, they worked their whole lives (most of them) and were free to exercise their democratic rights by voting for who they believed in and deserve to be looked after.
It was the ignorance , narrow mindedness and me feinery of previous generations that kept us a peasant backwater for generations.
 

supermonkey

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Indeed




+1

A society that does not protect the frail is barbaric.

The elderly often find travel difficult, they feel the cold and spend much of the time at home. Their needs are generally simple enough. Many serve useful roles looking after grand children, doing voluntary work.
It isn't meagre. €220 a week. It isn't bad at all. The dole should be cut by much more than the pension but that's another story.
 

ellie08

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It was the ignorance , narrow mindedness and me feinery of previous generations that kept us a peasant backwater for generations.
No, it's just in the last few years we were truly bollixed, by greedy speculators and there were very few pensioners involved in the current mess. You'll have to look at the generation just below them for the current mess.
 

ellie08

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It was the ignorance , narrow mindedness and me feinery of previous generations that kept us a peasant backwater for generations.
People over 60 in this country hadn't half the opportunities that people have today. I'm glad I didn't grow up in those times, learning everything through Irish, having religion rammed down their throats, they had an awful time.
 

sport02

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Does anyone know in the recent very harsh British budget were old age pensions cut?
 

Broke

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In college today, there was a heated debate in class where one section of the class claimed that the generation now availing of the old age pension have always been Fianna Fáils largest support base and after helping FF into power election after election, with pension cuts on the horizon, they are reaping what they have sown.

I listened but couldn't voice an opinion either way as I do not know who FF's largest support base has traditionally been. I'm trying to look up some info on the net about it but I'm finding it very hard to get the info I'm looking for.

Could anyone provide me with some links to this info if they know please or point me in the right direction to help my search?

Thank you.
My mother always said FF look after the pensioner's and builder's.This goes back to when Charlie Haughey was the minister of finance in the 1960s.
 

afns1

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myksav

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clanrickard
It was the ignorance , narrow mindedness and me feinery of previous generations that kept us a peasant backwater for generations.

No, it's just in the last few years we were truly bollixed, by greedy speculators and there were very few pensioners involved in the current mess. You'll have to look at the generation just below them for the current mess.
Clan is actually correct in what he said. One of the Irish traits that I always found irritating is the "drag 'em down to our level' attitude that pervaded/s Irish society.
When all are kept (sociologically) at the same 'level', those who could do well are basically prevented doing so by thier own peers.
 

commonman

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a lot of pressure is been put onTDs by the old oweners nursings homes
 

Inda Kenny

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The country is in a mess thanks to a small few.
With deflation pensioners are better off than they have been.
Either everybody takes a cut or no one takes a cut
Pension reduce by €4 Dole by €6 Biffo from €228000 to €100000
Tds to €75000 max
 

Tom Red

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That's the one. I'll fix my link now, cheers. I can't really read the results myself. A bit out of my depth with these types of surveys.
It says 49% of 65+ years of age voted FF and 35% of 18-24 year olds voted FF.

But is it the same amount of 65+ and 18-24 Years asked?

After all, 20% of 100 18-24 year olds would be more than 50% of 10 65+ year olds (if that makes sense?).
 

Clanrickard

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The country is in a mess thanks to a small few.
With deflation pensioners are better off than they have been.
Either everybody takes a cut or no one takes a cut
Pension reduce by €4 Dole by €6 Biffo from €228000 to €100000
Tds to €75000 max
Exactly. So far there will be no cuts to the public sector pay bill. Now we have demands not to touch pensioners. Already that consists of2/3 of the budget off limits. In our predicament that is crazy stuff.
 

hmmm

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Pensioners truly have built this country and deserve their rewards. They have provided us with an unfunded pension system, 100% debt to GDP ratios, massive unemployment of the young, the legacy of the worlds largest property bubble, a political system that fosters gombeenism, Magdalene laundries, religious rape of children, a dead language and a social structure that discriminates against homosexuals, pregnant women and anyone who dares to challenge the status quo.

So yes, they keep telling us they built this country so they deserve to be rewarded appropriately.
 


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