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Are some FGers proud of their Blueshirt roots?


Kerrygold

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I'm not out to stir the pot here.

I'm genuinely interested to know if some FG people are actually proud of the fact that the Blueshirts make up part of their history.

The thought struck me when I came across this from Dan Neville TD's website: Blueshirts 1934 : Dan Neville T.D.

This photo shows a uniformed man by the name of Tom Neville who I can only assume is a relation of Dan's and the source of some pride for him. This was taken at some wedding back in the 30's.



The next photo taken at the same wedding shows the party receiving the now infamous Nazi salute.



On his website Neville says :
it was an association forced into existence by the circumstance that after the 1932 election the men who had establised the new Irish state and who had goverened Ireland for the previous ten years were denied freedon of speech by the mob violence of the IRA and Fianna Fáil supporters.
So are there others in Fine Gael, like Dan Neville, who are proud of the Blueshirts?
 

rockofcashel

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In fairness to the FGers, it is a little disingenuous to refer to the salute as "the now infamous Nazi" salute... it's easy to look back in hindsight and try to smear the Blueshirts with the worst crimes of the Nazi's, but I imagine the vast majority of "Blueshirts" would have been as appalled with how the Nazi regime turned out as everyone else was.

The salute was a fascist salute.. but fascism was very much in vogue at the time.. so again, condemning in hindsight is unfair...

And I know many FG supporters who are proud of their Blueshirt past... and right they should be.. just as I am proud of my relations IRA past...
 

diaspora-mick

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In fairness to the FGers, it is a little disingenuous to refer to the salute as "the now infamous Nazi" salute...
The salute was a fascist salute.. but fascism was very much in vogue at the time.. so again, condemning in hindsight is unfair...
Quite right.

I think Roman salute is a better term.
Of course it has been tainted by association with the Nazis but they didn't have a monopoly on it.
 

friendlyfire

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look at the weasel words yesterday,the blueshirts helped in forming and maintaining a dysfunctional State and after all these years what have we got.......a deeply dysfunctional State!
 

zakalwe1

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my grandfather was a CNaG man.
he was maths teacher who became a school principal in the west of ireland.
was never involved in military matters, neither revolutionary nor civil war...
hence, no involvement or dealings with the ACA although he did maintain that the ACA in their St Patrick's blue uniform provided security from IRA thugs who were disrupting CNaG rallies.
no offense ROC, it was a minority of anti-democrats in the IRA who were carrying this out, so i suspect your family had no involvement.
 

zakalwe1

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look at the weasel words yesterday,the blueshirts helped in forming and maintaining a dysfunctional State and after all these years what have we got.......a deeply dysfunctional State!
well to be fair, the soldiers of destiny have only been in power pretty much from 1930s to 2011....but feel free to blame it on FG
 

carruthers

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I'm proud we obeyed the democratic will of the people in 1932 and handed over power without resorting to the gun.
 

Kerrygold

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ROC, that is why I said "the now infamous" salute. I thought that was clear enough.
 

White Horse

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Very proud of the defence of democracy though embarrassed by the subsequent actions of O'Duffy following his dismissal.

While not a Blueshirt per se, the anti Semitic rumblings of Oliver J Flanagan are stomach churning.
 

Niall996

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Long long ago, long before people understood where Facism, Communism, National Socialism and all the other 'ism's' that were struggling to assert themselves in a new post monarchy, post Empire universe were leading to. A different time, a different world. If I was a FG'er (which I most certainly am not) this blueshirt business wouldn't register with me at all. It's completely irrelevant.
 

Analyzer

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What I find amazing is that the authoritarian streak in some FG people is very evident in arguments on this site. They literally have big problems dealing with dissent.

They start by being patronizing, and then escalate it to a frenzy.

Unlike FF and the pre-Frank Ross LP they simply do not like dissent.

Another aspect is their inbuilt assumption that the population need to be controlled for some purpose.

Yeah, I would say the legacy of the blueshirt mentality in FG, is the inability to take criticism or dissenting opinions.
 

Ramon Mercadar

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Long long ago, long before people understood where Facism, Communism, National Socialism and all the other 'ism's' that were struggling to assert themselves in a new post monarchy, post Empire universe were leading to. A different time, a different world. If I was a FG'er (which I most certainly am not) this blueshirt business wouldn't register with me at all. It's completely irrelevant.
Its relevant still, the portraits of nazi lovers and anti Semites still hang in FG HQ. Costello never apologised for supporting Hitler, Flanagan never apologised for his anti Semitism.

"Mr. Belton: I wish we had a Hitler here." Dail, 25/7/1935

"The Minister gave extracts from various laws on the Continent, but he carefully refrained from drawing attention to the fact that the Blackshirts were victorious in Italy and that the Hitler Shirts were victorious in Germany, as, assuredly, in spite of this Bill and in spite of the Public Safety Act, the Blueshirts will be victorious in the Irish Free State. "
John Costello 28/2/1934

"Dr. O'Higgins: I should like it to be more intelligible. However, Mussolini, I think in the opinion of all is a very great man. He has fulfilled a number [1932] of functions and held a number of positions during his life" Dail 28/5/1935

"As an Irishman and as a Catholic—a humble one, I must say—I will oppose this Bill, because I will not agree to the application of sanctions against Italy, who is going out to civilise and to Christianise a pagan race. I sincerely hope that the Italian race, and Mussolini, the great leader of the Italian people, and defender of our faith in Italy, will be successful in this war." Mr Kent, Dail (supporting Mussolinis invasion of Ethiopia)

"Mr. Morrissey: A great many people in this country think Mussolini a most intelligent man, and probably a great many people think the same of Hitler." Dail 27/5/1937

"By our action here to-day we have curried no favour except the favour that will come from Communists, from Jews and Freemasons. We have alienated Christian Catholic support in this supposed Christian Catholic Chamber." Belton Dail 19 February, 1937 speaking on the Spanish Civil War (Non-Intervention) Bill, 1937

"How is it that we do not see any of these [Emergency Powers] Acts directed against the Jews, who crucified Our Saviour nineteen hundred years ago, and who are crucifying us every day in the week? How is it that we do not see them directed against the Masonic Order? How is it that the I.R.A. is considered an illegal organisation while the Masonic Order is not considered an illegal organisation? [...] There is one thing that Germany did, and that was to rout the Jews out of their country. Until we rout the Jews out of this country it does not matter a hair's breadth what orders you make. Where the bees are there is the honey, and where the Jews are there is the money."
- Oliver J. Flanagan, Fine Gael TD, Dáil Éireann, 9 July 1943.
 

cb1979

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Near Podcasts » The History Show Episode Seven

This episode is about the Blueshirts and Fine Gael.

Interviews with Dr. Fearghal McGarry of Queen’s University Belfast and Dr. Brian Hanley from the University of Liverpool.

Dr Fearghal McGarry is a senior lecturer in Modern History at Queens University Belfast. He has written a series of books on Irish republicanism including; Irish Politics and the Spanish Civil War, Frank Ryan, Eoin O’Duffy a Self Made Hero and The Rising, Ireland Easter 1916 and edited the collection, Republicanism in Modern Ireland. His latest book is Rebels.

Dr. Brian Hanley is the author of The IRA – A documentary History, 1919 – 2005; The IRA, 1926 – 1936; and with Scott Millar, The Lost Revolution, The Story of the Official IRA and the Workers’ Party. He lectures in the University of Liverpool.
 

former wesleyan

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That salute and its connotations are now lauded by " da Left " when Hizbollah do it. What goes around comes around.
 

Astral Peaks

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Its relevant still, the portraits of nazi lovers and anti Semites still hang in FG HQ. Costello never apologised for supporting Hitler, Flanagan never apologised for his anti Semitism.
Utter rubbish.

Tarring people now with the sins of '35 is frankly risible.
 

harshreality

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I have no connections with them and have my roots in 'the other side of the house' so to speak but I would assume that most adherents would want nothing to do with the cloud cuckoo land style politics that O'Duffy espoused.
 

Franzoni

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What I find amazing is that the authoritarian streak in some FG people is very evident in arguments on this site. They literally have big problems dealing with dissent.

They start by being patronizing, and then escalate it to a frenzy.

Unlike FF and the pre-Frank Ross LP they simply do not like dissent.

Another aspect is their inbuilt assumption that the population need to be controlled for some purpose.

Yeah, I would say the legacy of the blueshirt mentality in FG, is the inability to take criticism or dissenting opinions.

Yeah i've noticed that too...

One poster in particular is quick enough to report people but resorts to abuse when and if the moods takes him........

The conservative/maintain the status quo at all costs is starting to wear very thin now.... and the gimps who voted for them and never bothered reading a history book or stopping to think there was a reason Fine Gael have been kept out of power for long periods are staring to realise the mistake they have made....

The bullsh1te idealology of these clowns is going to cost us all in the long run unless we do something about it soon.........
 

Victor Meldrew

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Very proud of the defence of democracy though embarrassed by the subsequent actions of O'Duffy following his dismissal.
Exactly.

O'Duffy really was an aberration and had no following of any merit. Even Franco did not want him. Yet the troll of his actions persists.
 
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