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Austria, The Anschluss, Role In WW2 And Post WW2.


General Urko

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I joked with my friends that it was nice to play the poor much trampled on Austrians on the 75th anniversary of the Anschluss (union with the German Reich in 1938)! Actually ironically Austrian soccer boasted the wunderteam prior to "unification" with the Reich, which was regarded as the best in the world and during the subsequent years Austrian clubs did very well in the Unified football league (Schalke also stood out!), which continued through most of the war!
My questions are 1 How genuine was the unification with the Reich and it was of course headed by an Austrian in Hitler, who spoke/ranted in a provincial Austrian accent? 2 What was its role in WW2, if it can be singled out? and 3 Why was it allowed to portray itself as a victim like the constituents of Czechoslovakia and Yougoslavia were, when it seems to have been quite culpable? I saw the great monument to the Soviet soldiers in Vienna (a must visit city!) and it seems that prior to Afghanistan it was the only place they ever left!

Anschluss - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 


Frank Galton

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Over a quiet Easter one thing that makes for an interesting read is the life of Ludwig Wittgenstein and his time in Ireland while the aforementioned events were going on --

Ludwig Wittgenstein - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Somehow post-war Austria was able to carry off a nostalgia for the imperial days that Germany couldn't. In part, its more intertwined history with its eastern neighbours maybe gave it a partial alibi.
 

NYCKY

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I was travelling in central Europe a few years ago and on a drive from Budapest to Vienna, I wondered how the powers that be (powers that were) decided on the carve up of Europe after WW2. Hungary had been for a long time part of the Austro Hungarian Empire and Austria had rolled over and let the Nazis in under Anschluss, yet Austria was not put under Soviet domination but Hungary was.

I agree with the OP that Vienna is a must visit city but Budapest is better, a real hidden gem.
 

hiding behind a poster

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I was in an Irish pub in Vienna a couple of years ago, and got chatting with the owner, a guy from Dun Laoghaire. I mentioned to him that it was unusual to see that in Vienna, unlike most other European cities, there seemed to be no evidence of World War 2 - in memorials, statues, museums, or anything. In response, he made the simple but chilling point, that of all the countries the Nazis invaded, Austria was the only one where the natives democratically invited them in. Hence, they tend not to talk about it.
 

Boy M5

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I was travelling in central Europe a few years ago and on a drive from Budapest to Vienna, I wondered how the powers that be (powers that were) decided on the carve up of Europe after WW2. Hungary had been for a long time part of the Austro Hungarian Empire and Austria had rolled over and let the Nazis in under Anschluss, yet Austria was not put under Soviet domination but Hungary was.

I agree with the OP that Vienna is a must visit city but Budapest is better, a real hidden gem.
Partly where the allies ended up. Partly horse trading over spheres of interest.
 

ruserious

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It's an interesting one.
Similar to ourselves, a public vote under the threat of terror was held which solidified the new State.
The Austrian State was subdued but the people were either in favour or too weak to even democratically stop it.
I think the victim-hood theory is a means of retrospectively looking at the war and putting blame on someone else to build up a new national spirit once Austria was a State once more.
Victims of Nazism certainly but it appears they wanted to be victims.
 

General Urko

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I was travelling in central Europe a few years ago and on a drive from Budapest to Vienna, I wondered how the powers that be (powers that were) decided on the carve up of Europe after WW2. Hungary had been for a long time part of the Austro Hungarian Empire and Austria had rolled over and let the Nazis in under Anschluss, yet Austria was not put under Soviet domination but Hungary was.

I agree with the OP that Vienna is a must visit city but Budapest is better, a real hidden gem.
Budapest would be a really great city if it wasn't for the Hungarians in all my travels apart from 1 psychotic babushka in a museum in Lithuania, they were the most horrible people, I have ever encountered ! Kind of like the way Paddy peasants react to some of their own, Yes I have been in Cork and Dublin also!:oops:
Actually, Hungarians have a reputation among other Eastern Europeans as being very suspicious people!
Also and I suppose it's a throwback to being the 2nd most privileged race in the old Austro-Hungarian empire and coming despite considering themselves to be a mediteranean people under a Germanic influence, that they wait for that shagging pedestrian light to turn green before crossing the road even if there is no car anywhere on the road! This is a bad sign in a people, especially a non Germanic race!:mad: It's a trend I am also beginning to see it here also, but we have allowed the Germanics to control us!:mad::mad:
 

borntorum

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I didn't know until fairly recently than Vienna was divided in the same way as Berlin was until the 1950a. Why did the Soviets agree to relinquish their sector in Austria when they refused to do so in Germany?
 

General Urko

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I didn't know until fairly recently than Vienna was divided in the same way as Berlin was until the 1950a. Why did the Soviets agree to relinquish their sector in Austria when they refused to do so in Germany?
Despite Stallin's extreme paranoia, the Soviets did not regard Austria as big a potential threat as Germany! One of the stipulations was that it become a neutral nation (like ourselves :roll:).
It also serves a purpose for totalitarian states to have a "get out" Clause/state nearby ala Switzerland for the old Reich!
 

dresden8

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Budapest would be a really great city if it wasn't for the Hungarians in all my travels apart from 1 psychotic babushka in a museum in Lithuania, they were the most horrible people, I have ever encountered ! Kind of like the way Paddy peasants react to some of their own, Yes I have been in Cork and Dublin also!:oops:
Actually, Hungarians have a reputation among other Eastern Europeans as being very suspicious people!
Also and I suppose it's a throwback to being the 2nd most privileged race in the old Austro-Hungarian empire and coming despite considering themselves to be a mediteranean people under a Germanic influence, that they wait for that shagging pedestrian light to turn green before crossing the road even if there is no car anywhere on the road! This is a bad sign in a people, especially a non Germanic race!:mad: It's a trend I am also beginning to see it here also, but we have allowed the Germanics to control us!:mad::mad:
I found the Hungarians to be lovely people.
 

Boy M5

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Despite Stallin's extreme paranoia, the Soviets did not regard Austria as big a potential threat as Germany! One of the stipulations was that it become a neutral nation (like ourselves :roll:).
It also serves a purpose for totalitarian states to have a "get out" Clause/state nearby ala Switzerland for the old Reich!
It was Finlandisation. Both Finland and Austria outside of the agreed Russian area but beligerants against the Soviets had very restricted foreign policy. Our neutrality wasn't imposed in this way but developed over time.
 

owedtojoy

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I joked with my friends that it was nice to play the poor much trampled on Austrians on the 75th anniversary of the Anschluss (union with the German Reich in 1938)! Actually ironically Austrian soccer boasted the wunderteam prior to "unification" with the Reich, which was regarded as the best in the world and during the subsequent years Austrian clubs did very well in the Unified football league (Schalke also stood out!), which continued through most of the war!
My questions are 1 How genuine was the unification with the Reich and it was of course headed by an Austrian in Hitler, who spoke/ranted in a provincial Austrian accent? 2 What was its role in WW2, if it can be singled out? and 3 Why was it allowed to portray itself as a victim like the constituents of Czechoslovakia and Yougoslavia were, when it seems to have been quite culpable? I saw the great monument to the Soviet soldiers in Vienna (a must visit city!) and it seems that prior to Afghanistan it was the only place they ever left!

Anschluss - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
It is said that Hitler cured Austrians for ever from the desire to be considered German.

Austria tried its best to outdo Germans in anti-semitism and Nazi ardour. In summary, their record in 1938-1945 is one of shame and disgrace.

And it cannot be sugar-coated.
 

Boy M5

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I've always found Hungarians to be very gracious people and the females can be quite physiclly alluring.

I have a pal who's Austrian Jewish parents were Kindertransported out of Austria in time. They receive an Austrian Pension, not of McNeice proportions, but still recognition of guilt / recompense.
 

Carl Claudius

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I joked with my friends that it was nice to play the poor much trampled on Austrians on the 75th anniversary of the Anschluss (union with the German Reich in 1938)! Actually ironically Austrian soccer boasted the wunderteam prior to "unification" with the Reich, which was regarded as the best in the world and during the subsequent years Austrian clubs did very well in the Unified football league (Schalke also stood out!), which continued through most of the war!
My questions are 1 How genuine was the unification with the Reich and it was of course headed by an Austrian in Hitler, who spoke/ranted in a provincial Austrian accent? 2 What was its role in WW2, if it can be singled out? and 3 Why was it allowed to portray itself as a victim like the constituents of Czechoslovakia and Yougoslavia were, when it seems to have been quite culpable? I saw the great monument to the Soviet soldiers in Vienna (a must visit city!) and it seems that prior to Afghanistan it was the only place they ever left!

Anschluss - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
austria was recognised as a victim as far back as 1943. Austrians rejected calls to fight the Nazis apart from the Carinthians.
 

Carl Claudius

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I didn't know until fairly recently than Vienna was divided in the same way as Berlin was until the 1950a. Why did the Soviets agree to relinquish their sector in Austria when they refused to do so in Germany?
Austria was liberated in 1955.
it was handy to have a neutral state between NATO and WArsaw PAct.
 

Hitch 22

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It's an interesting one.
Similar to ourselves, a public vote under the threat of terror was held which solidified the new State.
The Austrian State was subdued but the people were either in favour or too weak to even democratically stop it.
I think the victim-hood theory is a means of retrospectively looking at the war and putting blame on someone else to build up a new national spirit once Austria was a State once more.
Victims of Nazism certainly but it appears they wanted to be victims.
Look at a who's who of the Nazi war criminals and Austrians figure prominently.
 

Carl Claudius

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I was in an Irish pub in Vienna a couple of years ago, and got chatting with the owner, a guy from Dun Laoghaire. I mentioned to him that it was unusual to see that in Vienna, unlike most other European cities, there seemed to be no evidence of World War 2 - in memorials, statues, museums, or anything. In response, he made the simple but chilling point, that of all the countries the Nazis invaded, Austria was the only one where the natives democratically invited them in. Hence, they tend not to talk about it.
there is plenty from the war in Vienna. check out the military history museum or the bunker complex. how did you miss the flak towers?

BTW Austria was without friends in 1938. If the Brits were about to invade us and we had no support what would we do?
 

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