Backstop Compromise or No Deal

cytex

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You mean like Schrodinger's Nordie, both inside the EU and outside it, at the same time.
No, the EU was never going to allow that.
It was only ever a Shinner's fantasy.
Nope the EU offered this it was turned down by the DUP and the British government. So the current itteration of the backstop was made as a compromise.
 


Newrybhoy

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Have you ever noticed that when the Brexiteers promote Brexit they use emotive language.
Brexit is going to make Britain great again.
"re-energising" ,"making the greatest place" all emotive language. Brexiteers don't use facts, they don't use numbers , they use aspiration.

Remainers are much more practical. They actually work out the costs , 250,000 jobs lost, £50,000,000,000(thats fifty billions) lost. You can examine and dispute Remainer assertions, but, Brexiteer assertions are too vague! They don't do evaluations, or risk assessment they just do dreams.
That's £50bn paid to the EU and 250,000 jobs lost to cheap EU Labour you're talking about?
 

yosef shompeter

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Allied Irish share-price took a nose-dive today. Shades of 2008/2009?
Bank of Ireland didn't have a good day either. Is this to do with Boris telling the EU to call him once they are prepared to re-negotiate the backstop? Or is it this plus something else ?
 

yosef shompeter

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RTE news website had a very interesting article on Boris & Brexit on the weekend (Tony conolly was it?)
It was pointed out that he is using "unpredictability" to unnerve the EU camp.
Will he go full monty with no deal. Will he renege on the 39 Billion Euro that Britain owes the EU? In this he has taken a page from his Orange strawberry blond fellow nationalist conservative Donald Trump whose word can be relied on for the next five minutes (maybe), or Vladimir Putin, a nationalist who is also noted for his unpredictability.
Nevertheless I don't think that the EU can afford to adopt a strategy like that. Noblesse Oblige and such, they have to stick to their ideals of uniting Europe as best it goes, honestly and peacefully.
 

pedagogus

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You mean like Schrodinger's Nordie, both inside the EU and outside it, at the same time.
No, the EU was never going to allow that.
It was only ever a Shinner's fantasy.
Mrs May did negotiate a N.I. only backstop only for it to be shot down by the DUP parliamentary party and was then forced to ask for the current version.
First and last the Backstops were a British idea to square the circle created by Mrs. May's red lines.
 

Pyewacket

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Mrs May did negotiate a N.I. only backstop only for it to be shot by the DUP parliamentary party and was then forced to ask for the current version.
First and last the Backstops were a British idea to square the circle created by Mrs. May's red lines.
Three things you need to know about the backstop/

1. The EU cannot allow a state which has left the Union to have a corridor in which goods and people can pass with no taxes, or checks.

2. The UK signed up to a part of its own territory in which the citizens can identify as citizens of one EU state or another which is leaving the EU.

3. No ****er can police the Border.

That is all on the UK. :)
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
Having some small ambitions still to be regarded in the fullness of time as the Albert Speer of Ireland, I have not been idle.

It occurs to me that we could combine two major national projects, reunification and cultural leapings forward. Why don't we combine the Massive Bronze Badger with the Clockwork Moving Ears project and a sort of digital trade detector.

One could station civil servants, two to start with in case a meeting is required on anything they observe from up there in the Clockwork Moving Observation Ear. They could lower the minutes of the meeting following their observations once a day on a rope and a Garda car could take it to Dublin where there could be a whole Department ready to write letters far and wide on matters pertaining.

I knew the MBBCME project was ahead of its time. As I have just demonstrated. QED.
 

yosef shompeter

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It's not economic suicide.

The EU won't exist in 20 years and it would be best to leave and adjust to being outside the EU rather than falling out haphazardly.

The euro, as a currency, is fundamentally broken. We know that. How much longer can we afford to ignore that fact, that's the real question.
I can see you are a pessimist as regards things European.
A pertinent question is of course, who is "Nexit" i.e. next to leave after the Brits.
I would have said Italy, but......... Uncomfortable thought: It could very well be us, here in Saorstát Eireann.
Particularly if (for instance ) if the Jarmins -- soft-hearted bunch towards the Brits, cave in to their demands and renegotiate the Withdrawal Agreement so that long story short, rep of Ireland is landed with the cost of policing the hard border and the Troubles make a comeback, then comes tax harmonization and then the large-scale anti-Racist drive, i.e. fair redistribution of all the Africans and Arabs who want to relocate here. It could be that we leave the EU and have to go knocking on England's door again.
As for the Euro, well recall the eighties when the speculators used to have a field day working the "Snake" where governments were obliged to keep the value of their respective currency within a certain spread.
Not good for the small volatile economies like the Punt or even the Italian lira. OK for the Swiss and their Franc... or of course the mighty D-mark.
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
Well I look at it this way. For once we are not in the seat reserved for those about to be asked to make concessions.

So none should be made.
 

recedite

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Well I look at it this way. For once we are not in the seat reserved for those about to be asked to make concessions.
So none should be made.
I wouldn't be so sure of that. Merkel and Macron may well be thinking about issuing new instructions to Varadkar.
But we'll see over the next little while.
 

ruserious

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Boris thinks this is all a game of chicken and we will cave. I say we plough on and crash firmly into them head on. We will remain supported by the EU26 and have a real chance of securing the North in No deal. No backstop will be a capitulation.
 

Pyewacket

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I wouldn't be so sure of that. Merkel and Macron may well be thinking about issuing new instructions to Varadkar.
But we'll see over the next little while.
Umm, what instructions?

If the UK cannot stand by an international treaty it signed under no duress, they cannot abide by anything.

That is why the pound is on the floor and Boris looks as if he has pissed himself. Permananent damp grin. :)
 

milipod

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I wouldn't be so sure of that. Merkel and Macron may well be thinking about issuing new instructions to Varadkar.
But we'll see over the next little while.
Boris checking his phone for instructions from Trump?
 

Pyewacket

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Boris checking his phone for instructions from Trump?
Or his latest squeeze. The one who kicked him out and then took him back, when the neighbours called the police.

Brits have finally got a soap opera PM. Like Emmerdale or some such shit.
 

bactrian

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I can see you are a pessimist as regards things European.
A pertinent question is of course, who is "Nexit" i.e. next to leave after the Brits.
I would have said Italy, but......... Uncomfortable thought: It could very well be us, here in Saorstát Eireann.
Particularly if (for instance ) if the Jarmins -- soft-hearted bunch towards the Brits, cave in to their demands and renegotiate the Withdrawal Agreement so that long story short, rep of Ireland is landed with the cost of policing the hard border and the Troubles make a comeback, then comes tax harmonization and then the large-scale anti-Racist drive, i.e. fair redistribution of all the Africans and Arabs who want to relocate here. It could be that we leave the EU and have to go knocking on England's door again.
As for the Euro, well recall the eighties when the speculators used to have a field day working the "Snake" where governments were obliged to keep the value of their respective currency within a certain spread.
Not good for the small volatile economies like the Punt or even the Italian lira. OK for the Swiss and their Franc... or of course the mighty D-mark.

The Brexiteers have been wittering on about "The Next Country To Leave"(TNCTL) for three years but TNCTL has yet to appear on the horizon. Maybe TNCTL has looked at the chaos of Brexit and decided NFW (No F***ing Way)
 

Pyewacket

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The Brexiteers have been wittering on about "The Next Country To Leave"(TNCTL) for three years but TNCTL has yet to appear on the horizon. Maybe TNCTL has looked at the chaos of Brexit and decided NFW (No F***ing Way)
Well that is the limit of Social Media.

They were all SO ****ING SURE they were in the vanguard of the Revolution.

The UK is ****ed, and I wonder how many Social Media warriors will stand by them?
 

WayOutWest

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We should ask how long can Boris continue to claim he’ll leave with no deal, a week, a day before the deadline . If he was so confident that a no deal was good for the country he would call an election with a no deal manifesto.
 

Pyewacket

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We should ask how long can Boris continue to claim he’ll leave with no deal, a week, a day before the deadline . If he was so confident that a no deal was good for the country he would call an election with a no deal manifesto.
Yup. Is Boris the Man?

He is a ****ing fearful clown.

The UK will have to deal with him, and they will end up hanging each other on lamp posts.

I couldn't give a ****, because I KNOW they can't police the Border. :)
 

mickterry

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Mr Varadkar was not elected by the Irish people. He has very little mandate. For a lot of his career in Fine Gael he has "worshipped at the altar of Queen Arlene Foster" and now at a late hour has decided to stop being so craven. Maybe if he had stood up to Britain before now there would be more respect.
No Irish Taoiseach has ever been elected by the people. They are elected by the Dail. Read the constitution
 


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