Being an Irish Patriot/Supporting Fianna Fail: Two Mutually Exclusive Positions

bprob

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Jun 8, 2009
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bizarrely, i still come across people who are absolutely insistent that FF are the party to lead ireland out of recession.

FF have forfeited the republic. Their acts were little short of treasonous, and they continue this treason through their denials and lies now

I feel that anyone who still supports FF cannot call themselves an irish patriot.

the republican party has become the repossession party

it is time for decent FF cumann members to do the only decent thing left to them: please resign your membership and allow FF to fall into the mire and rot.

let us move on to a new political landscape, where FG and Labour can form a national government to reform the political and business landscape, before they hold a fresh election following which ireland can follow a normal right-left political divide.

this would allow a natural policing and control of the natural excesses of each political philosophy, rather than our continuing the root cause of our current disaster: we let FF become a permanent party of government.

opinions?
 


Mondo

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Oct 1, 2010
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They have strip-mined the country, layer upon layer of instability from years of corruption and cronyism.

They ask for calm on the surface while they cart away our wealth from below.

They continue not taking responsibility for any of it. If they won't go then they must be removed.
 

readytogo

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let us move on to a new political landscape, where FG and Labour can form a national government to reform the political and business landscape
Don't get me wrong, I dislike this government as much as anyone but I seriously doubt FG-Lab would have acted any differently. At this stage it really doesn't matter who wins the election - they'll still have to dance to the IMF's tune and make huge cuts in spending.

a fresh election following which ireland can follow a normal right-left political divide.
Will never happen so long as we have PR. Instead of a mutually antagonistic right-left divide we have a multiplicity of parties that gravitate to the centre. Because of our electoral system, parties almost always need to form coalitions - reinforcing the push for consensus and populism.
 
D

Dylan2010

At least FF have brought the pretence to an end. Patriotism is for dreamers. There are only opressors and oppressed, and the oppressors tend to wrap themselves in flags.
 

Dreaded_Estate

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Don't get me wrong, I dislike this government as much as anyone but I seriously doubt FG-Lab would have acted any differently. At this stage it really doesn't matter who wins the election - they'll still have to dance to the IMF's tune and make huge cuts in spending.

Will never happen so long as we have PR. Instead of a mutually antagonistic right-left divide we have a multiplicity of parties that gravitate to the centre. Because of our electoral system, parties almost always need to form coalitions - reinforcing the push for consensus and populism.
The reality is we will never know how it would have worked out under different leadership. But it is pretty much impossible for it to have worked out by any worse.
 

truepatriot

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I WAS LISTENING TO A WOMAN FROM KERRY ON THE JOE DUFFY AND SHE TOLD US SHE WAS BLACK f.f. YOU COULDNT MAKE IT UP.
 

bprob

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Don't get me wrong, I dislike this government as much as anyone but I seriously doubt FG-Lab would have acted any differently. At this stage it really doesn't matter who wins the election - they'll still have to dance to the IMF's tune and make huge cuts in spending.
after virtually everything that has happened, it is very hard not to take you up wrongly! :)
that is the ultimate excuse for FF, and to be honest, it doesn't wash. their defence is basically: "who knows what the others would have done?" you could apply that argument to any event in history to try and justify what happened.
they use it because they feel there is no good argument against a hypothetical, and because if they stage an argument based on fact, they get annihilated

anyway, back to the debate!:

i acknowledge the IMF will be calling the financial tune, but as you can see i specifically mentioned areas of ethics, which the new government can address without referring to IMF/EU.

there is no point fixing the financial mess if we leave the broken political system, and weak anti-fraud legislation in place, as we will be condemned to repeat our mistakes at some point in the future

i would include our PR system in that: it has promoted parish pump politics. pandering to the likes of jackie and lowry is part of our problem here. it is time for a list system for national politics.
local issues can be addressed by streamlining local politics but giving local councillors more powers (and local taxation)
 

MPB

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Everything these people have is down to FF or so they have been made to believe.

It is how the parasites operate. Do not worry the IMF will deal with that.
 

brigg

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I WAS LISTENING TO A WOMAN FROM KERRY ON THE JOE DUFFY AND SHE TOLD US SHE WAS BLACK f.f. YOU COULDNT MAKE IT UP.
Im pretty sure I heard her on Liveline some months back too. Duffy probably knew she was a safe bet to help drum up support for the party.
 

Miserable eFFer

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May 4, 2010
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From the Fianna Fáil web site. A FAILED FIANNA FÁIL entity

CONSTITUTION OF FIANNA FÁIL
1. Fianna Fáil is a National Movement. Its aims are:-
(i) To secure in peace and agreement the unity of Ireland and its people. FAILED
(ii) To develop a distinctive national life in accordance with the diverse traditions and ideals of the Irish people as part of a broader European culture, and to restore and promote the Irish language as a living language of the people. FAILED
(iii) To guarantee religious and civil liberty, and equal rights, equal treatment and equal opportunities for all the people of Ireland. FAILED
(iv) To develop the resources and wealth of Ireland to their full potential, while making them subservient to the needs and welfare of all the people of Ireland, so as to provide the maximum sustainable employment, based on fostering a spirit of enterprise and self-reliance and on social partnership. FAILED
(v) To protect the natural environment and heritage of Ireland and to ensure a balance between town and country and between the regions, and to maintain as many families as practicable on the land. FAILED
(vi) To promote the family, and a wider sense of social responsibility, and to uphold the rule of law in the interest of the welfare and safety of the public. FAILED
(vii) To maintain the status of Ireland as a sovereign State, as a full member of the European Union and the United Nations, contributing to peace, disarmament and development on the basis of Ireland’s independent foreign policy tradition. FAILED
(viii) To reform the laws and institutions of State, to make them efficient, humane, caring and responsive to the needs of the citizen. FAILED
 

bprob

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Jun 8, 2009
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678
From the Fianna Fáil web site. A FAILED FIANNA FÁIL entity

CONSTITUTION OF FIANNA FÁIL
1. Fianna Fáil is a National Movement. Its aims are:-
(i) To secure in peace and agreement the unity of Ireland and its people. FAILED
(ii) To develop a distinctive national life in accordance with the diverse traditions and ideals of the Irish people as part of a broader European culture, and to restore and promote the Irish language as a living language of the people. FAILED
(iii) To guarantee religious and civil liberty, and equal rights, equal treatment and equal opportunities for all the people of Ireland. FAILED
(iv) To develop the resources and wealth of Ireland to their full potential, while making them subservient to the needs and welfare of all the people of Ireland, so as to provide the maximum sustainable employment, based on fostering a spirit of enterprise and self-reliance and on social partnership. FAILED
(v) To protect the natural environment and heritage of Ireland and to ensure a balance between town and country and between the regions, and to maintain as many families as practicable on the land. FAILED
(vi) To promote the family, and a wider sense of social responsibility, and to uphold the rule of law in the interest of the welfare and safety of the public. FAILED
(vii) To maintain the status of Ireland as a sovereign State, as a full member of the European Union and the United Nations, contributing to peace, disarmament and development on the basis of Ireland’s independent foreign policy tradition. FAILED
(viii) To reform the laws and institutions of State, to make them efficient, humane, caring and responsive to the needs of the citizen. FAILED
thats exactly my point
if you had a business that had failed its customers so badly, it would be liquidated. FF members should realise their party is a failed entity which has created a failed state.
 


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