Bertie Ahern and the €98901 pension - News: he is giving it up

He3

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Bertie Ahern is claiming €98901 in pension payments yearly on top of his TD salary of approx €100,000 plus benefits.

He has also secured recognition as an artist from the Revenue Commissioners so he does not have to pay tax on his I did it my way book sales.

What arguments or methods can we marshal to explain to him and his party colleagues the error of his ways?

Full list of sitting TDs claiming Ministerial pensions, and not, here -

On the take

Bertie Ahern is in the Ace of Spades position in that deck.
 
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yehbut_nobut

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What I can't understand is why a minister for finance can;t introduce a punitive tax on such income.

Say a special tax rate of 115% on these "double income" pensions? I'd say that would have a few of them running to forgo the benefit.
 

Bismarck

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To be fair a number of his colleagues from what I understand have already agreed to not draw their pension.

Its time for Cowen to be decisive on the matter although I suspect he will try to sort things out behind the scenes.
As far as I know a number of former FG and Labour ministers still draw pensions but I am happy to stand corrected. This seems to be a disease of the political class rather than just Fianna Fáil.
 

LeDroit

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Re: Bertie Ahern and the €98901 pension

yehbut_nobut said:
What I can't understand is why a minister for finance can;t introduce a punitive tax on such income.

Say a special tax rate of 115% on these "double income" pensions? I'd say that would have a few of them running to forgo the benefit.
Because this isn't Venezuela and the tax system should not be abused to punish fellow citizens just because you're envious of their financial circumstances.
 

Raketemensch

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Bertie and his kind do not know the difference between their own property and that belonging to the country.

You would not be able to explain it to him because he thinks that everything belongs to him, didn't he single handedly create the celtic tiger?

OK, a tiger that is well on the way to destroying far more weath than it created but you could not explain that to him either because he is permanently in 2004-land and has not read a newspaper since.

He thinks everything is grand. It is in a way... for him and that is all that matters. To him.
 

dresden8

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Because this isn't Venezuela and the tax system should not be abused to punish fellow citizens just because you're envious of their financial circumstances.
But of course you can introduce levies to punish fellow citizens just because you're envious of their financial circumstances, like normal public servants trying to earn a living, just not the senior ones or the judges.
 

MPB

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Our politicians want Michael Fingleton to pay back the 1 million bonus he paid himself for staying on past his retirement date, in order to complete the ruination of his Bank.

Yet none have called on our former Taoiseach to hand back the pension he recieves for his years of service as head of the most economically inept and morally corrupt Govt in the history of the State.

And considering the standards set by previous Govts in our short history, that takes some doing.
 
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he is permanently in 2004-land and has not read a newspaper since.

He thinks everything is grand. It is in a way... for him and that is all that matters. To him.
He couldn't string a sentence together that made any sense, let alone make a speech but people pay him speaking fees...
 

Gadfly

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What I can't understand is why a minister for finance can;t introduce a punitive tax on such income.

Say a special tax rate of 115% on these "double income" pensions? I'd say that would have a few of them running to forgo the benefit.
There is a simpler and more equitable strategy. Put in an income cap - a means test if you like. The greater the claimant's other income, the lower the pension payout. And why should these particular pensions be payable before age 65?

If the claim that you can't change these things retrospectively stands up - and I'd like to hear independent legal opinion on that - so be it; change things as of the date of adoption of a fair system that isn't a rip off of the taxpayer to feather the insiders' nests.

Too much to hope that the opposition parties will make a commitment to do this?
 

Raketemensch

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He couldn't string a sentence together that made any sense, let alone make a speech but people pay him speaking fees...
It is true that he has absolutely nothing of interest to say therefore the only conclusion must be that he is bringing people along to these talks somehow and someone else must be paying for them. As they say, follow the money. Is there any way that Irish/EU taxpayers money could be subsiding these talks somehow?
 

He3

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The arguments put forward by various government Ministers about why MGQ should give up her pensions apply equally to Bertie Ahern.

So why are we waiting to hear from them on his continued cashing of the monthly cheque?

Aristodemus on another thread suggests if his pension was touched he would quit his seat. Well let's test that theory.
 

kevmac

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What I can't understand is why a minister for finance can;t introduce a punitive tax on such income.

Say a special tax rate of 115% on these "double income" pensions? I'd say that would have a few of them running to forgo the benefit.
Several reasons, a because that is not constitutional as it a) affects property rigths and b) targets a specific group. Unless you would like to target all widowers who recieve a widows pension and also a state pension or work pension?

Let's leave Bertie alone he clearly is a fool who still believes this mess is nothing to do with him, he won the money on the hourses and he will be elected to both the mayor of Dublin and president. He really is a characture and no more. I speak as one of the electorate in his constituancy, funny I've never seen him round here in the seven years of living here.
 

The OD

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And considering the standards set by previous Govts in our short history, that takes some doing.
We have had some spectacularly bad politicians in the past, but Da Bert takes the biscuit.
 

laidback

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Why not treat politicians like all other public servants re pensions - you need 40 years to get the full pension which is 50% of retiring salary (pro rata if service is less) and you get the pension at 65.

Normally you have to retire at 65 and so should politicians. there is nothing to stop them being active in community affairs on a voluntary basis after they retire at 65 with their ample pensions.

There are provisions for certain public servants to retire before 65 like garda and teachers. I believe the reason for this is 'burnout' because of the demands of those careers. Whether burnout applies to politicians I am not sure. In any case I think politicians should be limited to 2 terms, then have to take a break in the real world before thay can stand again.
 

DCon

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There is a simpler and more equitable strategy. Put in an income cap - a means test if you like. The greater the claimant's other income, the lower the pension payout. And why should these particular pensions be payable before age 65?
I agree. If a pension is to be paid before the age of 65, it should guarantee a certain minimum income, say EUR 50K. If the retired Minister/Taoiseach earns less than this, he/she receives a top-up. If they earn nothing, they get a 50K pension. If, like De Bert, they earn a few hundred grand, they get no pension.
 

waterford

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Our politicians want Michael Fingleton to pay back the 1 million bonus he paid himself for staying on past his retirement date, in order to complete the ruination of his Bank.

Yet none have called on our former Taoiseach to hand back the pension he recieves for his years of service as head of the most economically inept and morally corrupt Govt in the history of the State.

And considering the standards set by previous Govts in our short history, that takes some doing.
+100..
I would also like to see CAB chasing the money from the Haughy years. Bertie was after all the man who handled the dosh, also the Flynn family & a few other very fat cats.:) Some chance
 


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