Bloody Sunday Killings ''UNLAWFUL''


2lazy

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In the case of Ballymurphy some people were shot over 3 days during which there were ongoing gun battles between the PIRA and the security forces. They died in the crossfire.

Does a gun battle not count as being conflict-related?

Maybe it doesn't count in your mind because there are nationalist/republican casualties for you to use to make some shallow political point. You're dragging those dead people through the gutter.

On the day it is you who are the one firmly in the gutter.
 

Mickeymac

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For the last time......WTF has dissident violence, demonised by the Republican movement as "traitors" got to do with this thread so named.....

Bloody Sunday Killings ''UNLAWFUL''
 

2lazy

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Is see the usual apologists have turned up - Harper should be along soon
 

WTTR

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[B]Relatives 4 Justice[/B]‏ @[B]RelsForJustice[/B] 2 ="That is entirely dependent on whether or not you believe that the Civil Rights Movement was a part of the conflict, which is the narrative being spun by the British State and the Irish Government.
I do not think that you are correct in saying that the Civil Rights Movement was regarded as part of the conflict by the Irish government the time.

The next Civil Rights march after Bloody Sunday was called for Newry. A group of early twenty year olds, including myself, who were working in Dundalk at the time went on this march. We went on it, the first political action taken by any of us, in protest against what happened on Bloody Sunday.

I heard then Minister Patrick Hillary many years later on the radio talking about the efforts made by his Department of Foreign Affairs to insure, through their embassies abroad, that all TV stations of the world be notified of the Newry march. We had to walk from the border.

I remembered encountering the British army on two occasions: once, when a number of camouflaged soldiers hopped out of the fields and pulled barbed wire across the road in front of us and cocked their rifles (luckily, they did not shoot); the other when we were bodily search.

After that, we scampered across some back gardens to get to the beginning of the march, as it was past the 3.00pm start. We met a crowd of youths who asked us, as to where we came from. I replied Mayo, you could hear an excited voice echoing its way, as we were scaling the walls "their up from Mayo for the march". Another voice shouted "Did we know Frank Feely?" His mother used to give me a biscuit, whenever I called on my way home from the St Louis National School!
 
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LISTOWEL MAN

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soldier F has to answer for what he allegedly did on bloody sunday but the IRA get a pass ?

how many people did they murder ?
 

LISTOWEL MAN

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Brian Stack = Ferris threatens FF with "embarrassing information"

Jerry McCabe = witnesses intimidated to force a verdict of manslaughter

Jean McConville = Adams is innocent he's so innocent SF threatens the PSNi

Bloody Sunday = can't forget, never forget, have to prosecute
 

Beachcomber

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For the last time......WTF has dissident violence, demonised by the Republican movement as "traitors" got to do with this thread so named.....
The "Republican movement"? Do you mean the Provo Republican Movement there Mort?

The Provo RM sold out long ago, so now it is condemning behaviour that is exactly what they used to do during the Troubles.

If any people are traitors it is the Provo RM - they no longer believe in actual Irish Republicanism.
 

Beachcomber

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soldier F has to answer for what he allegedly did on bloody sunday but the IRA get a pass ?

how many people did they murder ?

Good post.

For Provo supporters it's one law for the PIRA and another rule for the British security forces.
 

Beachcomber

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I do not think that you are correct in saying that the Civil Rights Movement was regarded as part of the conflict by the Irish government the time.

The next Civil Rights march after Bloody Sunday was called for Newry. A group of early twenty year olds, including myself, who were working in Dundalk at the time went on this march. We went on it, the first political action taken by any of us, in protest against what happened on Bloody Sunday.

I heard then Minister Patrick Hillary many years later on the radio talking about the efforts made by his Department of Foreign Affairs to insure, through their embassies abroad, that all TV stations of the world be notified of the Newry march. We had to walk from the border.

I remembered encountering the British army on two occasions: once, when a number of camouflaged soldiers hopped out of the fields and pulled barbed wire across the road in front of us and cocked their rifles (luckily, they did not shoot); the other when we were bodily search.

After that, we scampered across some back gardens to get to the beginning of the march, as it was past the 3.00pm start. We met a crowd of youths who asked us, as to where we came from. I replied Mayo, you could hear an excited voice echoing its way, as we were scaling the walls "their up from Mayo for the march". Another voice shouted "Did we know Frank Feely?" His mother used to give me a biscuit, whenever I called on my way home from the St Louis National School!

"In November 2005, Feely and sixteen other nationalist councillors were jointly surcharged £10,000 and barred from public office for five years for refusing FAIR the use of Newtownhamilton Community Centre. "
 

Beachcomber

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Obviously you are oblivious to the existence of the Internationally recognised GFA endorsed by the US/Ireland/GB and lodged at the UN in New York, read up some pal if you wish to maintain at least some credibility on here.....end of, over and out now please FO.

I know all about the GFA Mort.

What does it have to do with what you posted?
 

LISTOWEL MAN

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Good post.

For Provo supporters it's one law for the PIRA and another rule for the British security forces.
the GFA was a clean slate for murderers

the IRA didn't want to answer for what they did

the brits didn't want to answer for what they did

that was a dream come true for evil people like Gerry Adams and Martin McGuinness
 

LISTOWEL MAN

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The "Republican movement"? Do you mean the Provo Republican Movement there Mort?

The Provo RM sold out long ago, so now it is condemning behaviour that is exactly what they used to do during the Troubles.

If any people are traitors it is the Provo RM - they no longer believe in actual Irish Republicanism.
ISIS + the Vatican = SF/IRA
 

Antóin Mac Comháin

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'Part of a war'

Gen Sir David Richards, a Northern Ireland veteran who rose to become the head of the UK's armed forces as chief of the defence staff, understands the pressures the paratroopers were under.

"Bloody Sunday was part of a war. These are warriors, soldiers who are going into a situation uncertain of what may happen next.

'Bloody Sunday has hung over Sergeant O as it has hung over victims' families, although for different reasons and with different emotions.

I pointed out that Lord Saville had said that all the victims were innocent.

"I don't care what Lord Saville said," he challenged. "He wasn't there."

I asked if in the light of the inquiry's findings, it was still his view that it was a job well done.

"Yes," he said.

Does he feel any guilt at what happened?

"No," he replied and said he would do exactly the same again.'
2 policemen were murdered by the PIRA 3 days before the events of BS. That led to the tension going in to the day. Do you think that PIRA action didn't impact the thinking of the security forces going into that Sunday? PIRA men were out in that march on the Sunday, and rioters had planned to riot on the Sunday after the march. Was that not part of the war?
I agree with Gen Sir David Richards view that there was a war in Ireland, but I can't see the connection between the events you are describing, nor the the organizations involved in either, which is consistent with the findings of the Saville Inquiry, which found that all of the victims of Bloody Sunday were innocent.

In the case of Ballymurphy some people were shot over 3 days during which there were ongoing gun battles between the PIRA and the security forces. They died in the crossfire.
The civilians killed during the Ballymurphy Massacre which began on the 9th of August were as follows:
  • Francis Quinn (19), shot while going to the aid of a wounded man.
  • Fr. Hugh Mullan (38), a Catholic priest, shot while going to the aid of a wounded man, while waving a white cloth to indicate his intentions.
  • Joan Connolly (50), shot as she stood opposite the army base, by three different soldiers. She might have survived had she been given medical attention sooner, but she lay injured in a field for several hours
  • Daniel Teggart (44), was shot fourteen times. Most of the bullets entered his back, as he lay injured on the ground.
  • Noel Phillips (20), shot as he stood opposite the army base.
  • Joseph Murphy (41), shot as he stood opposite the army base. Murphy was subsequently taken into army custody and after his release, as he was dying in hospital, he claimed that he had been beaten and shot again while in custody. When his body was exhumed in October 2015, a second bullet was discovered in his body, which corroborated his claim.
One civilian was shot on 10 August, and another four were shot on 11 August, these were:
  • Edward Doherty (28), shot while walking along Whiterock Road.
  • John Laverty (20) and Joseph Corr (43) were shot at separate points at the Top of the Whiterock Road. Laverty was shot twice, once in the back and once in the back of the leg. Corr was shot several times and died of his injuries on 27 August.
  • John McKerr (49), shot while standing outside a Catholic church, died of his injuries on 20 August.
  • Paddy McCarthy (44) suffered a heart attack after an empty gun was put in his mouth and the trigger was pulled. He died shortly afterwards.
In February 2015, the conviction of Terry Laverty, the younger brother of John Laverty, was quashed by the Criminal Cases Review Commission. He had been convicted of riotous behaviour and sentenced to six months on the eye-witness evidence of a private in the Parachute Regiment.

Does a gun battle not count as being conflict-related?
Yea, but I can't see the connection between a gun-battle and any of the murders carried out by the British Army during the Ballymurphy Massacre. Which civilians were killed in the crossfire?

Many of the victims of the PIRA weren't combatants either, but people like you routinely excuse the killing of those people on the basis that "there was a war on, and civilians die in all wars". Where has that theory gone now?

The civilians that died in Ballymurphy were hit by crossfire during days of gun battles in the area. The PIRA didn't give a toss that civilians were likely to die due to them starting gun battles, but the PIRA went ahead and attacked anyway.
I do believe that there was a war on, but I don't see the connection between that war, the Ballymurphy Massacre and the Civil Rights Movement. What is the connection between the PIRA, the Ballymurphy Massacre and Bloody Sunday?

Your opinions about Bloody Sunday don't tally with the findings of the Saville Inquiry, which is one reason why I suspect you keep repeating the same mantra and keep trying to link the marchers and the Civil Rights Movement with the 'conflict, 'troubles' or 'war.'

On the one hand you slyly suggest that the Bloody Sunday dead were linked to killing of Police Officers and were involved in rioting, and on the other, you claim that the 'victims weren't combatants either.'

Many of the victims of the PIRA weren't combatants either...
OK, but what has that got to do with the Ballymurphy Massacre and Bloody Sunday? Please be specific.
 

LISTOWEL MAN

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Ivan, it's all very well for you sitting pretty with your wee Westminster paycheck every week but marching's not gonna solve this thing
 

Beachcomber

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I agree with Gen Sir David Richards view that there was a war in Ireland, but I can't see the connection between the events you are describing, nor the the organizations involved in either, which is consistent with the findings of the Saville Inquiry, which found that all of the victims of Bloody Sunday were innocent.



The civilians killed during the Ballymurphy Massacre which began on the 9th of August were as follows:
  • Francis Quinn (19), shot while going to the aid of a wounded man.
  • Fr. Hugh Mullan (38), a Catholic priest, shot while going to the aid of a wounded man, while waving a white cloth to indicate his intentions.
  • Joan Connolly (50), shot as she stood opposite the army base, by three different soldiers. She might have survived had she been given medical attention sooner, but she lay injured in a field for several hours
  • Daniel Teggart (44), was shot fourteen times. Most of the bullets entered his back, as he lay injured on the ground.
  • Noel Phillips (20), shot as he stood opposite the army base.
  • Joseph Murphy (41), shot as he stood opposite the army base. Murphy was subsequently taken into army custody and after his release, as he was dying in hospital, he claimed that he had been beaten and shot again while in custody. When his body was exhumed in October 2015, a second bullet was discovered in his body, which corroborated his claim.
One civilian was shot on 10 August, and another four were shot on 11 August, these were:
  • Edward Doherty (28), shot while walking along Whiterock Road.
  • John Laverty (20) and Joseph Corr (43) were shot at separate points at the Top of the Whiterock Road. Laverty was shot twice, once in the back and once in the back of the leg. Corr was shot several times and died of his injuries on 27 August.
  • John McKerr (49), shot while standing outside a Catholic church, died of his injuries on 20 August.
  • Paddy McCarthy (44) suffered a heart attack after an empty gun was put in his mouth and the trigger was pulled. He died shortly afterwards.
In February 2015, the conviction of Terry Laverty, the younger brother of John Laverty, was quashed by the Criminal Cases Review Commission. He had been convicted of riotous behaviour and sentenced to six months on the eye-witness evidence of a private in the Parachute Regiment.



Yea, but I can't see the connection between a gun-battle and any of the murders carried out by the British Army during the Ballymurphy Massacre. Which civilians were killed in the crossfire?



I do believe that there was a war on, but I don't see the connection between that war, the Ballymurphy Massacre and the Civil Rights Movement. What is the connection between the PIRA, the Ballymurphy Massacre and Bloody Sunday?

Your opinions about Bloody Sunday don't tally with the findings of the Saville Inquiry, which is one reason why I suspect you keep repeating the same mantra and keep trying to link the marchers and the Civil Rights Movement with the 'conflict, 'troubles' or 'war.'

On the one hand you slyly suggest that the Bloody Sunday dead were linked to killing of Police Officers and were involved in rioting, and on the other, you claim that the 'victims weren't combatants either.'



OK, but what has that got to do with the Ballymurphy Massacre and Bloody Sunday? Please be specific.

Why were civilians standing about outside a British Army base while gun battles were going on?
 

WTTR

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"In November 2005, Feely and sixteen other nationalist councillors were jointly surcharged £10,000 and barred from public office for five years for refusing FAIR the use of Newtownhamilton Community Centre. "
All, out of step!

He was a member of the SDLP and ex mayor of Newry.

I remember him as a teenager.

Ironically, I met Paddy O'Hanlon and Paddy Devlin, but not Frank in his political years.
 
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