Brexit fishing battle: Britain and Ireland 'to clash over ownership of tiny rock'



benroe

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BREXIT could flare up tensions between Britain and Ireland over the ownership of an isolated islet in the north Atlantic, unearthed reports suggest.



Spain won't be too pleased either, given that they have a much bigger quota up there than we do.
 

McTell

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BREXIT could flare up tensions between Britain and Ireland over the ownership of an isolated islet in the north Atlantic, unearthed reports suggest.
//

Slags, you're mixing up a sea rock with fishing quotas?

We've got a huge marine resource area already agreed, done and dusted ...

We call this ‘The Real Map of Ireland’ as you can see that Ireland’s marine territory extends far beyond our coastline up to 220 million acres (approx. 880,000km2) , an area more than 10 times our land mass.


 

benroe

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Strange behavior by the Royal Navy off the coast of Donegal.

An Air Corps maritime patrol aircraft was dispatched and two Irish naval ships placed on standby after the skipper of the Killybegs-based fishing vessel, the Marliona, reported that a UK frigate ordered him to leave the area where he was fishing 60 miles off the Irish coast.
Irish trawler 'given order to move on' by Royal Navy frigate
 

McTell

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So lads, this clash, when and where?
 

lostexpectation

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Strange behavior by the Royal Navy off the coast of Donegal.


Irish trawler 'given order to move on' by Royal Navy frigate
"I was alerted immediately they had no right whatsoever to do this," said Sean O'Donoghue, chief executive of the KFO. "I reported it to the Department of Foreign Affairs and Defence but I haven't heard what happened yet.


"I have been involved in the fishing industry for 40 years and have never seen this happen before. For the UK vessel to radio a trawler and tell him to get out of the area is totally unacceptable.


"This is a sovereignty issue, this is a breach of Irish sovereignty," he added.
Does the CEO of the KFO not know the definition of sovereignty? 60 miles versus 12 nautical miles, not even close.
 
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benroe

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Does the CEO of the KFO not know the definition of sovereignty? 60 miles versus 12 nautical miles, not even close.
It's not really a question of sovereignty, more of authority, what right do the British navy have to stop an Irish vessel from fishing there. These are not Irish waters, but there not British either.
 

Nebuchadnezzar

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Does the CEO of the KFO not know the definition of sovereignty? 60 miles versus 12 nautical miles, not even close.
Well....sounds like it was in international waters but within the Irish EEZ(Exclusive Economic Zone). I don’t think any foreign warship can order an Irish trawler where and when it can operate within EU EEZ waters.

The British have a submarine exercise area which does extend into our EEZ but AFAIK that doesn’t give them the right to order ships out of the area.

According to this link(UK Maritime and Coastguard Agency) the purpose of the FVSS(Fishing Vessel Safety Ship), which I guess is the role that HMS Lancaster was carrying out, is....

“a) provide assistance to the participating submarine to compile its plot of fishing vessel activity in order to minimise the risk of hazardous incidents.
(b) make fishing vessels aware of submarine exercise activity in their vicinity and to provide a source of information and advice to minimise the risk of hazardous incidents.
6.3. All exercise participants(submarines) are required to support the FVSS by providing information of fishing activity in their vicinity, warning any FV(fishing vessel)detected approaching the area that antisubmarine exercises are being conducted in the vicinity, and warning the submarine of any FV within 6000 yards (3 nautical miles) of the warship.”

https://assets.publishing.service.g...els_Operating_in_Submarine_Exercise_Areas.pdf
 

lostexpectation

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lostexpectation

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It's not really a question of sovereignty, more of authority, what right do the British navy have to stop an Irish vessel from fishing there. These are not Irish waters, but there not British either.
depends what they actually said to the boat, I won't take the word of somebody who misuses the word sovereignty.
 
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Lumpy Talbot

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No
Wouldn't there have to be ship's log and communication records. I doubt a RN frigate would be operating without those records and of course there would be verification of what was said to the fishing boat because officers junior to the Captain would have been aware of what instructions were given.
 

benroe

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Wouldn't there have to be ship's log and communication records. I doubt a RN frigate would be operating without those records and of course there would be verification of what was said to the fishing boat because officers junior to the Captain would have been aware of what instructions were given.
A Royal navy sub dragged an Irish fishing boat the "Karen" from Ardglass backwards and very nearly sank her, it took them years to admit it, there was also another vessel sunk by British sub, the "Sharalga" from Clougherhead, again they wouldn't admit it till photos of the damaged sub were published.
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
Yes, been aware that there have been numerous incidents attributed to submarines around the north west coast and east to Scotland. I believe there are a few cases of missing trawlers that are suspicious in that regard as well.

Amazing really. These things are supposed to be chock full of electronic scanning equipment and yet they do seem to have a few navigation issues and appear remarkably unaware that there are hazards right overhead or things like big rocks which are actually marked on maps and what have you. That's when the crew aren't trying to off each other or murder visitors or whatever else is popular in the submariner community these days.

Maybe the Russians and Chinese should just build a rowboat quietly alongside these subs and put to sea alongside them or just overhead on the surface on their maiden voyages. The submarine officers would never know they were there...
 

lostexpectation

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British Navy's dangerous disregard for Irish sovereignty displays arrogance of the highest order -
@johnbradysf
"We have an outrageous scenario of a foreign power ordering an Irish vessel out of Irish waters. This cannot be be swept under the carpet." https://sinnfein.ie/contents/57528
https://twitter.com/sinnfeinireland/status/1287428263057534978/photo/1
https://twitter.com/sinnfeinireland/status/1287428263057534978/photo/1
it was reported to be 60 miles off the Donegal coast so not in Irish waters
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
The last thing the UK needs now is territorial disputes with EU nations. The UK still needs to avoid a veto from any one of 26 countries on its proposed trade deal with the EU.

So stirring up issues around Gibraltar (Spain), Cyprus (Turkish-Greek dispute), or faffing around annoying fish near Rockall probably isn't a good idea. But then again I've been watching Westminster wilfully misreading the runes now for a few years so almost anything is possible.

There have been signs of poor discipline and some rather bizarre stuff from the senior service in the UK in recent years. Captains removed, affairs, murders, suicides, leaving brand new super-duper stealth submarines stuck on rocks that are marked on maps of the Faslane routes to sea while every satellite China and Russia had were taking snapshots all day long for days. There seems to be some sort of meter arrangement on the new aircraft carrier and the meter keeps running out of shillings at awkward moments.

Given the demands placed on the defence forces in the UK which has to for reputation reasons to pretend it has global reach while the mandarins have been hacking away at their budgets for years, I think the Navy is certainly showing signs of strain.

Must be spending billions out of their budget basically for nostalgia reasons.
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
There could be acres of fun to be had out of that sea-gull beshatten graceless rock in the Atlantic. Just send the odd fishing boat out there from time to time, allowing dark rumours of an Irish government funded expedition to Rockall out through the university conference system connections or something. They'd be forced to station a destroyer or couple of frigates out there in the balmy Atlantic.

They are so sensitive to any notion of a loss of sovereignty even over a sea-gull toilet that you can wind them up into spending loads of resources collecting sea-gull shyte.

Even better if they feel they have to station troops there. Just make a feint at Rockall every now and then and you can basically open up a new little notebook for taking down the numbers on the side of Royal Navy frigates and destroyers.

We could have a digital channel to monitor the crisis and can turn the heat up or down on it as we please. Long as we aren't spending money trying to ward off anyone from this Atlantic rock I wouldn't care.
 


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