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Pompey

New member
Joined
Jul 26, 2005
Messages
4
DaveDublin,

Sorry I never came bac to your posts but work gets in the way from time to time and I dont even have time to reply in full now. But firstly you are seriously misguided and uninformed if you think Cowen has never been effective as a Minister and completly at odds with his reputation around Leinster House, even his opponents who dislike his policies would argue that he is often too effective and civil servants fail to stand up to him.

As it happens I too was involved like yourself at the time he was Minister for Transport and communications in the area, and your views are completly at odds with Union and government officials from the time.

Health, well I did not re-write the nurses strike, but it was clear that it was unavoidable. It had to happen and like it or not it was a brutal strike and could destroy any minister, also like it or not the Nurses lost badly they probably could have cut the same deal at the beginning without any strike as they got in the end. Partially the reason Cowen did have to move on because relations with Nursing Unions were always going to be difficult after that. But it mmust be seen as a success.

Like I said earlier, Finance all we have to go on is what industry and the likes of IBEC and the officials in the Department say and so far the reports are good but it is the next budget that will be the test.

I disagree that the media have been easy on him, the fact is he has given them precious little that they have been able to attack him on because mistakes in any post have been non-esistent so the media have done the next best thing, cut him out. After all we all know that good news and success in Government doesnt shift copy. Fact of life and one FF need to accept.

oh and finally as for me being a Cowen Fan, well thats just your assumption isnt it? Might sound like it but you would be very surprised you know.......simple fact is I call it as I see it and there is no point saying he is not an effective leader or that anyone could compete with him for leadership at the moment. Its just my analysis not necessarily my beliefs
 

Ernie

Member
Joined
May 20, 2005
Messages
9
thought Cowen was woeful at Govt. Press conference yesterday (Oct 20). Very poor attack o the opposition and was minced by pol.corrs. Much more expected of the Bullish Finance Minister. Many openly talking of Mary Hanafin now. It just might never happen for the man from the Midlands. :( :(
 

powderfinger

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Joined
Jun 13, 2007
Messages
3,350
Re: Trust me

Pompey said:
Interesting Debate, well I can assure you that this is about the only lace you will hear question marks about Cowen. Shoe in for leader no contest, some backbenchers are surrounding Dermot Ahern but its not even considered by them to be likely. Noel Dempsey is the key to leadership believe it or not, who ever he backs will be leader as he is a master of working the party. Dempey will support COwen, Country and Western set to return and are far to strong for new wing Martin/Ahern. But Dermot Ahern has certainly surpassed Martina t this stage according to the backbenchers. As for those who have been saying COwen is having no impact, emmmm I think IBEC and trade unions an anyone involved in finance would disagree, just because you are not in the headlines doesnt mean you are not making waves. Headlines are for those who are doing something wrong. 8)[/quote A pretty accurate prediction Pompey.If Cowen is to reassign the Health portfolio I'd reckon that Dermot is a shoe-in.
 

gatsbygirl20

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Joined
Dec 1, 2008
Messages
22,551
All talk of a leadership challenge at the moment is not really relevant. A couple of months ago if we were having a thread on the future leadership of FF then Michael Martin would have been amongst the front runners. So I agree with you that in 6 years a lot can happen. Just also like to say that when you say Cowen is grumpy what do you base that on? do you expect him to sit smiling and joking with his political opponents on tv, the fact is you couldnt meet a sounder person. Your one sentence analysis of Cowens ministerial record is pathetic. Cowens record speaks for itself and the fact that he has been promoted time and again is no coinsidence. Also Cowen is 45 years old and whatever happens in 6 years Cowen will still be a prominent member of the FF front bench. I would be amazed if Bertie stayed on as leader of the opposition should the other parties manage to form an inter-party gvt.
Indeed, "a lot can happen in 6 years"....and not just to Cowen.....

Great reading these old threads...no real sense of the catastrophe to come.....
 

jpc

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Joined
Jun 14, 2007
Messages
4,252
Indeed, "a lot can happen in 6 years"....and not just to Cowen.....

Great reading these old threads...no real sense of the catastrophe to come.....
Think a lot of people were quiet prescient when it came to his ability and career outcome
 

hammer

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Jul 6, 2009
Messages
58,180
Brian Cowen couldn`t even manage his own appearance. Why did people believe he was the chosen one :(
 

jo9jo

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Mar 25, 2011
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4,833
Brian Cowen couldn`t even manage his own appearance. Why did people believe he was the chosen one :(
well he was great aul craic for a start.
Wan of the lads, wan of the baiis.
A great mimic.
The country was booming - nothing could go wrong.
 

Tomas Mor

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Feb 22, 2010
Messages
10,351
well he was great aul craic for a start.
Wan of the lads, wan of the baiis.
A great mimic.
The country was booming - nothing could go wrong.
and the media types like Jody Corcoran and Harry McGee told all and sundry he was a master of his brief, a heavy hitter who pulled no punches.
 

dresden8

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Feb 5, 2009
Messages
14,619
SO - still there seems to be agreement that Cowen's star is on the wane.

Whatever about him being the pal of backbench TDs - an election for leader will be a pragmatic event with people choosing the person who will deliver votes for the party not pints and laughs in the bar.IN terms of policy he has done so little in any Dept. - in FInance I have not heard him once defend or put forward an alternative to decentralisation. Nor has he made any effort to defend his Party from the value for money/rip-off attacks.
Dave you were so right about so much but so wrong about this one thing. Going on the piss was the one requisite a FF leader needed.
 

Marcos the black

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Feb 3, 2009
Messages
21,063
Cowen is still a dead cert for the FF leadership - even though he has vanished off the political map in recent months.

Mainly due to the fact that his one-time-rival, Micheal Martin, has been shown up as an incompetent, surly and even childish Minister - who could well be even more unpopular with the voters than Bertie is at the moment (some acheivement!).

When the other choices are bumbling idiots like Noel Dempsey and Dermot Ahern, pompous windbags like Dick Roche, and preachy know-it-alls like Mary Hanafin, then Cowen is laughing all the way to the bank
Quote of the century.... And it was written in 2005!! all hail Barry W. We're not worthy!
 

anewbeginning

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Jan 20, 2009
Messages
4,616
It was the medical card issue that set in train the events that took down Cowens government and ultimately to the sad demise of a once great party.
I disagree..it was the fact Cowen was a hopeless leader who waltzed into power on the coat-tails of Bertie Ahern that set in train the demise of the country and FF.

FF have survived though thick and thin the last 80 years, but lost 75% of their seats under Cowen, some achievement.

And it didn't have to be that way.

If he addressed the people while sober in a state of the nation address and showed up on TV and radio sober every so often, everything might have been fine.

If he had actually lead, everything might have been fine.

And it's completely inaccurate to call him a leader anyways, for two and half years, this country was leaderless.
 

oggy

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Oct 28, 2009
Messages
8,903
Two lucky breaks for this country, FF kept FG and Labour from ever becoming a single party government and Brian Cowen and Brian Lenihan were at the helm when this country ended its biggest ever boom with its biggest ever bust. If FG and Labour had been in government in 2008 there would be blood pouring in the streets since ! Thank you so much FF
 

jpc

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Joined
Jun 14, 2007
Messages
4,252
Two lucky breaks for this country, FF kept FG and Labour from ever becoming a single party government and Brian Cowen and Brian Lenihan were at the helm when this country ended its biggest ever boom with its biggest ever bust. If FG and Labour had been in government in 2008 there would be blood pouring in the streets since ! Thank you so much FF
Would you recap what caused the bust you mention.
Keeping in mind FF being in power all of that time bar 95-97.
Over to you
 

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