Can any Garda summons be trusted due to the extraordinary level of lies that has been exposed?

venusian

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With the extraordinary level of lies the Gardai have engaged in and now publicly exposed can any Garda summons be trusted? Even Garda homicide figures can not be trusted
Publication of crime stats delayed again as review into 89 missing homicides continues
Publication of crime stats delayed again as review into 89 missing homicides continues

One of the easiest items for a Gardai to lie about and send a summons are traffic offences e.g. so called speeding offences, supposed use of a mobile, running a red light etc. I personally know individuals that rather than have the hassle of attending court and as its the normal course of events, being abused by a joke judge that would prefer to accept a Garda's testimony rather than accepting a citizen's with the resultant increase of their fine and penalty, and the same judge telling them they are liars, they have stumped up and took a hit in the wallet.

Time for an amnesty for penalty points until the current Garda management are sacked and confidence restored in the Gardai?
 


Ardillaun

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With the extraordinary level of lies the Gardai have engaged in and now publicly exposed can any Garda summons be trusted? Even Garda homicide figures can not be trusted
Publication of crime stats delayed again as review into 89 missing homicides continues
Publication of crime stats delayed again as review into 89 missing homicides continues

?
As I understand it, this long-term issue of the 'missing homicides' depends on the definition of what is included as a homicide and has in no way affected the investigation of these deaths. It's a technical matter and sounds worse than it is.
 

greengoose2

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As I understand it, this long-term issue of the 'missing homicides' depends on the definition of what is included as a homicide and has in no way affected the investigation of these deaths. It's a technical matter and sounds worse than it is.
Thank God for that! Now what about the other technical imatters? Adding zeros and other benign stuff like that?

Oh lest we forget; the Freddy Morris Roadshow was a wow as well. Nothing to see, move along!
 

Happycamping

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Genuinely can't see how confidence will be restored. Not without a complete overhaul and there simply is no appetite for that. There is no party that will do what is necessary.
 

'orebel

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Genuinely can't see how confidence will be restored. Not without a complete overhaul and there simply is no appetite for that. There is no party that will do what is necessary.
More than just an over haul is need. Criminal proceedings and large scale sackings would also be required to provide any degree of confidence.
 

Toland

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The current police force has been thoroughly discredited over the last couple of years.

This may not be good news to many, but it should be welcomed. The first step in curing a disease is discovering there is a problem. A surprising number of people were apparently entirely unaware of such a problem in the Guards until very recently.

That's changed. And that's good.

However, we still haven't got to the stage where there's a proper, generally accepted diagnosis, never mind prognosis and treatment.

No more than a bit of ointment to ease the visible rash.
 

RasherHash

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More than just an over haul is need. Criminal proceedings and large scale sackings would also be required to provide any degree of confidence.
Exactly, there have to be consequences whereas at the moment there are NONE.

The only honest cop is the one most abused in our tragic "system of justice".
 

Analyzer

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What an absolute shambles.

Fitzgerald is more responsible than any government minister. And she has been shoved into the background.
 

*EPIC SUCCESS*

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Genuinely can't see how confidence will be restored. Not without a complete overhaul and there simply is no appetite for that. There is no party that will do what is necessary.
They will just bull through this issue until we forget. That is the modus operandi of successive governments.

The reality though is that peoples lives are being put at risk, not just with us believing we are protected from drunk drivers by 'large majority of decent Gardai' but with criminals knowing this corruption is causing such a distraction from them doing their jobs to impressionable kids growing up thinking gangsters are some sort cultural icons and what are their teachers, parents or other figures of influence in their lives supposed to say? Trust AGS?

How can they? It's beyond, as Callinan would say 'disgusting'. He is the one who should be thoroughly investigated but will he? Not likely.

Worst of all, we have, without a shadow of a doubt, the most spineless coward in the history of the state serving as Taoiseach.

Fine Gael can never again claim the mantle of the part of 'Law & Order'. They aren't and by what we seen over successive years, they never were.

How many of these reports will sit on a shelf and how much will they be ignored if the likes of Martin, another blowhard with no real substance, ever gets into power (God help us all).
 

Toland

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What an absolute shambles.

Fitzgerald is more responsible than any government minister. And she has been shoved into the background.
To be fair, every minister for justice since the foundation of the state is responsible the appalling state of AGS.

Having said that, Fine Gael have simply sat on this issue since 2011. Something badly needs to shift and be seen to have shifted.
 

GJG

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More than just an over haul is need. Criminal proceedings and large scale sackings would also be required to provide any degree of confidence.
Let's leave aside for a moment criminal or employment sanctions against gardaí who forged their work records, and in at least some cases are clearly guilty of criminal conduct.

Instead, let's look at a throwaway line at the end of a report from today's Irish Times:





Just think about that for a moment. Leading gardaí are openly advocating that widespread, systemic fraud should go unpunished, not just in criminal terms, but also by the employer.

What do you think would happen with, say, a Tesco manager who advocated that store staff should not be sanctioned in any way for widespread, systematic thieft from the employer? You can be sure that any employer in that situation would make sure that the manager's ass would be kicked to the dole queue right behind the thieves.

The Garda Síochána is so corrupt, and we have become so innured to that corruption, that it is viewed as normal and acceptable for somone to advocate against even basic sanctions for massive misconduct, and nobody even thinks of regarding that as misconduct in itself.
 

Toland

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It needs a Commissioner from outside Ireland and that won't happen
It certainly needs a Commissioner from well outside the guards, and well outside its immediate circle of influence. Someone with a big stick.

I'd love the gig, by the way, if you should happen to find yourself on the interview panel. I favour well-polished knobbly blackthorn.
 

Aindriu

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What is needed is a Patten type reform.

1/ Disband the AGS.
2/ Create a new police force - preferably called Police in some way.
3/ Appoint a commissioner from outside the state.
4/ Make all serving garda reapply for their jobs.
5/ Use 4 above to get rid off all the useless, the lying, the corrupt etc.
6/ Make the new force permanently armed like the rest of Europe.
 

milipod

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I would not use word force rather service.
 

Toland

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What is needed is a Patten type reform.

1/ Disband the AGS.
2/ Create a new police force - preferably called Police in some way.
3/ Appoint a commissioner from outside the state.
4/ Make all serving garda reapply for their jobs.
5/ Use 4 above to get rid off all the useless, the lying, the corrupt etc.
6/ Make the new force permanently armed like the rest of Europe.
I disagree with 6/.

I'm very glad most Gardaí aren't armed at the moment, given the competence and discipline problems the force has from top to bottom. I'd have to be very sure the new body was completely free of old habits before I armed them routinely.

4/ and 5/ will be impossible to achieve in full, sadly.
 

*EPIC SUCCESS*

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I disagree with 6/.

I'm very glad most Gardaí aren't armed at the moment, given the competence and discipline problems the force has from top to bottom. I'd have to be very sure the new body was completely free of old habits before I armed them routinely.

4/ and 5/ will be impossible to achieve in full, sadly.
Sadly, like most problems, the solution is beyond simple.

Any Garda found guilty of certain crimes is automatically sacked, end of story.

If that so happens to mean all those who perverted the course of justice through manufactured drink driving test stats, so be it.

How many people have died due to drink driving while they say there playing on their phones eating donuts?
 


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