Can Fine Gael lead a patriotic Irish charge against Europe and the Goverment?

sport02

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It is obvious that the budget and the bailout are inextricably linked, we have been told by FG that Fianna Fail have no legitimacy and got us a bad deal in the bailout.
We have also been told by Michael Noonan as far as he is concerned the IMF have been more friendlier to us than europe, we have received a penal interest rate of 6.7% when you subtract the IMF rate, we were forced to throw the mortgage deeds and car keys into the bailout pot. Our pension reserves are on the verge of slipping into the quicksand of Irish banks.

Yesterdays Red C poll clearly shows FF have no right to put forward a budget, or force a bailout without a vote in the Dail, coupled that with Mary Hanifins arrogant comments, that she feels the Irish people would want to repay all our debts "including the ones we are not responsible for, the bondholers"

FG must show real leadership next week, as it is void in FF, and not just abstain, but vote no to this budget, and no to this bailout, and stop this lunacy once and for all.
 


Cabbage/Turnip

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dont hink they will go against it though they are very similar to FF just have not been questioned as hard..
 
M

MrFunkyBoogaloo

No they won't. FG subscribe to the four year plan. They have already spoken to the IMF about using the NPRF and monies from the sale of state assets, with conditions to be attached later by the same bank, to fund their particular budget strategy.

They are toeing the EU/IMF line to the letter and playing to the crowd. More nonsense from diet FF.
 

The OD

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Considering they cheer leaded in Lisbon, I doubt they can resort to patriotism now, even if they are scoundrels.
 

Collegebhoy

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I very much doubt the could lead a charge, never mind a patriotic one, never mind one against Europe. From what I can make out they are making no effort to oust this government before they do any more damage, will vote for the budget and as mentioned earlier in the thread they're going to tow the line with IMF/EU. FF Lite indeed!
 

Holy Cow

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Easy question, the answer is a big fat NO

FG = Diet FF.
 

MPB

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If they do not, they will be left behind.

There has already been a massive swing to the left, based on nothing more than a promise to rip up the IMF deal and burn bank bondholders.

If FG do not promise to do the same things from a right of centre point of view, they will be drowned out by a new far right political movement.

History shows us that when a nation is forced to burden reparations, there is a swing to the left. This automatically is counter manded by the creation of a far right.

I suppose it is hard to learn from history when you have your head stuck up the hole of the bank bondholders.

Remember the Germans hatred for the Jews stemmed from the Nazis portrayal of the Jews as the Banker class.
 

keeptalking

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no, need to get rid of whatshisname first. No one will vote for them or have any confidence in them until they elect a new leader. End of story
 

sport02

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If they do not, they will be left behind.

There has already been a massive swing to the left, based on nothing more than a promise to rip up the IMF deal and burn bank bondholders.

If FG do not promise to do the same things from a right of centre point of view, they will be drowned out by a new far right political movement.

History shows us that when a nation is forced to burden reparations, there is a swing to the left. This automatically is counter manded by the creation of a far right.

I suppose it is hard to learn from history when you have your head stuck up the hole of the bank bondholders.

Remember the Germans hatred for the Jews stemmed from the Nazis portrayal of the Jews as the Banker class.

I tend to agree with your point, but is there a part of FG that feel, that Labours vote is getting squeezed by Sinn Fein and the new left alliance, I was intending voting FG, but after listening to Eamon Dunphy this morning on Newstalk, he made a good point, if FG and Labour don't vote aganist the budget they don't deserve his vote, and I feel they don't deserve mine either.

Give me a real alternative to FG and I will vote for them.
 

Maureen Murphy 1234

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fine gael patriotic gov/

The answer is yes. Their record is there to prove it. WT Cosgrqve is the founder of the State- the first leader after the deaths of collins and Griffith. Fine Gael has the gene of patriotism within its makeup.
 

MPB

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I tend to agree with your point, but is there a part of FG that feel, that Labours vote is getting squeezed by Sinn Fein and the new left alliance, I was intending voting FG, but after listening to Eamon Dunphy this morning on Newstalk, he made a good point, if FG and Labour don't vote aganist the budget they don't deserve his vote, and I feel they don't deserve mine either.

Give me a real alternative to FG and I will vote for them.
Well they cannot vote for the budget now as they have just released their own 4 year plan which contradicts a lot of what will be in a FF/Green budget.

If they abstain they will be accused of being cowards and could possibly end up being a minority coalition partner.

I will be voting for whoever promises to default on the Banks bondholders and renegotiate the EU/IMF deal.
 

pinemartin

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It is obvious that the budget and the bailout are inextricably linked, we have been told by FG that Fianna Fail have no legitimacy and got us a bad deal in the bailout.
We have also been told by Michael Noonan as far as he is concerned the IMF have been more friendlier to us than europe, we have received a penal interest rate of 6.7% when you subtract the IMF rate, we were forced to throw the mortgage deeds and car keys into the bailout pot. Our pension reserves are on the verge of slipping into the quicksand of Irish banks.

Yesterdays Red C poll clearly shows FF have no right to put forward a budget, or force a bailout without a vote in the Dail, coupled that with Mary Hanifins arrogant comments, that she feels the Irish people would want to repay all our debts "including the ones we are not responsible for, the bondholers"

FG must show real leadership next week, as it is void in FF, and not just abstain, but vote no to this budget, and no to this bailout, and stop this lunacy once and for all.
The answer is clearly NO. FG are not in the business of radical departures from their or FF current political orthodoxies. They will continue with the same policies that FF would have if they were in government. FG are a right wing conservative political party led by a Mayo school teacher, I dont expect and new ideas from that quarter. They are now split down the middle over their leader yet to scared to do anything this close to the election, they are caught in a state of political stasis of their own making. they should be hoovering up votes and be able finally slay the FF dragon but they are stagnant and divided, some of their members seem more concerned with the internal schism than fighting for power . I believe that they will not reach their true level of support until Kenny is jettisoned, he is a big liability for them, particularly in Dublin( would love to see a poll from dublin based on the most recent figures, I think it would show a wipe out for FF but with little FG gain).They are stuck at the mid to low 30% but should form part of the next government. They will support the budget I believe.
 
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ivnryn

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he made a good point, if FG and Labour don't vote aganist the budget they don't deserve his vote, and I feel they don't deserve mine either.
Exactly, anyone who isn't present and voting against the budget might as well just join FF and be done with it.
 

westie12

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Well they cannot vote for the budget now as they have just released their own 4 year plan which contradicts a lot of what will be in a FF/Green budget.

If they abstain they will be accused of being cowards and could possibly end up being a minority coalition partner.

I will be voting for whoever promises to default on the Banks bondholders and renegotiate the EU/IMF deal.
Ditto, At this stage, I don't care which party gets my vote as long as they promise to default on the bank bondholders.
As for FG, I think they are best summed up by a quote I saw recently on P.ie,
that "FG and FF are two cheeks of the same arse"!
 

cathal201

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The answer is yes. Their record is there to prove it. WT Cosgrqve is the founder of the State- the first leader after the deaths of collins and Griffith. Fine Gael has the gene of patriotism within its makeup.
Correct, well said.

Fine Gael are of course able and capable to lead the country, they are the most patriotic party, because its blatently obvious that Fianna Fail dont give a damn about patriotism, for them its about me fein.

And your right. there is a gene of patriotism there. And with that comes honesty with the people of Ireland. Collins fought for this state, won the war of independence, and then Devs side shot him. Collins negotiated the treaty and has the balls to do it, while De velera sat on his arse not wanting to be humilated, and that gene has most definatley remained in Fianna Fail

Collins said it was "a stepping stone to freedom" and that freedom was confirmed when the Fine Gael led government of 1948-1951 cut the last ties with the Brits.

So FG were true to their word and that remains today. And of course we can lead a patriotic Irish charge because we are a party that puts the people first and wants the best for the people of Ireland.
 


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