• Due to a glitch in the old vBulletin software, some users were "banned" when they tried to change their passwords at the end of February. This does not apply after the site was converted to Xenforo. If you were affected by this, please us viua the Contact us link in the footer.

Can Israel-lobby stop Hagel nomination?


Dame_Enda

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 14, 2011
Messages
52,243
Barred from running for a second term, Obama is no longer as beholden to Israel - or so one would have thought. All the evidence is Hagel is being tipped as Defence Secretary. Of course he would have to get through the Senate, and the Zionist lobby are opposing him for making remarks critical of Israel and the "Jewish lobby". The Zionist-owned Washington Post for example has come out against him, and Ira Foreman (head of Obama's Jewish outreach in the 2012 campaign) has said he would have grave concerns if Hagel got a "policy position". The neocons are against him as one of the remaining "realist" Republican's on foreign policy. Bill Kristol has villified him as anti-semitic. A number of Democrat Senators (the ones below are Jewish except Menendez) have expressed concerns about his remarks about how 'the Jewish lobby intimidates a lot of people' in Washington.
“Any comment that undermines our relationship [with Israel] concerns me,” said Bob Casey of Pennsylvania. Asked if the reference to the “Jewish lobby” is such a statement, Casey said, “Sure, yes.”Michigan’s Carl Levin said he does not agree with Hagel’s view.“I don’t think it’s an appropriate statement,” Levin said. And Barbara Boxer of California said she disagreed with the idea that there exists an intimidating "Jewish lobby" in Washington. “People can say whatever they want,” Boxer said. “I don’t agree with it.”
I hope he gets confirmed. The Zionist stranglehold on American foreign policy must be broken before justice can come to the Palestinians. Everyone know that this lobby does in fact exist.

Some of the supposed 'anti-semitic' (butactually not) remarks in the past from Chuck Hagel:
“The political reality is that … the Jewish lobby intimidates a lot of people up here.” (Hagel interviewed in Aaron David Miller’s 2008 book The Too Much Promised Land)
Hagel opposed Israel's 2006 war in Lebanon, calling it a "disaster", refused to vote for a resolution calling on the EU to declare Hezbollah a terrorist group, and supported talking with Hamas. Senate Republicans like Lindsey Graham are sounding hostile, while John McCain says he's never come across a "Jewish lobby" (sure), and Marco Rubio and John Kyl are not happy either.

Recording of Hagel's comments on Israel here:

[video=youtube;02E7JWqAFhw]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02E7JWqAFhw&feature=endscreen&NR=1[/video]Bill Kristol backed "The Israel Project" video opposing him:

[video=youtube;fU6c9H2IevE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=fU6c9H2IevE[/video]
 
Last edited:


eyelight

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 16, 2010
Messages
8,296
Chuck Hagel: An Unconventional Realist

Why the Israel lobby hates him — and why we need him at DoD

The knives are out:
“Send us Hagel and we will make sure every American knows he is an anti-Semite.”

That’s what a top Republican Senate aide told the Weekly Standard in response to the news that President Obama is likely to nominate former Republican Senator Chuck Hagel as his new Secretary of Defense. Normally, the Israel lobby would try to hide such viciousness, acting behind the scenes to go after their perceived enemies in ways that might repel bystanders: not this time, however.

It’s an indication of their diminished stature and power that they are openly going in for the kill, perhaps hoping they can pull a Bobby Ray Inman. Inman, you’ll recall, took himself out of the running for SecDef during the Clinton administration when Bill Safire, then Likudnik-in-chief among newspaper columnists, went after the respected former admiral and intelligence maven because he had sought to limit our sharing of intelligence with Israel. No sooner had the Inman appointment been announced then it was suddenly discovered he had failed to pay Social Security taxes to a baby sitter, among other “crimes.” Hagel, however, is made of tougher stuff, so it will have to be the President who blinks.


The Paranoid Style of the Israel Lobby

The anti-Hagel campaign reveals the psychopathology of radical Zionism

The campaign to demonize Chuck Hagel in the run up to his possible confirmation hearings as Secretary of Defense is going full swing. As I told my readers the other day, “get ready for a mudslide of smears and innuendo as the [Israel] Lobby homes in for the kill.” Twenty-four hours later, there are so many entrants into what appears to be a competition to see who can come up with the nastiest smears that one has a hard time deciding on a winner. After some deliberation, however, I have to give Bret Stephens, the Wall Street Journal’s foreign affairs editor, the prize.

As I predicted, the “Jewish lobby” comment has taken center stage in this manufactured controversy, and Stephens is quick to jump on it:

“Prejudice—like cooking, wine-tasting and other consummations—has an olfactory element. When Chuck Hagel, the former GOP senator from Nebraska who is now a front-runner to be the next secretary of Defense, carries on about how ‘the Jewish lobby intimidates a lot of people up here,’ the odor is especially ripe.

“Ripe because a “Jewish lobby,” as far as I’m aware, doesn’t exist. No lesser authorities on the subject than John Mearsheimer and Stephen Walt, authors of The Israel Lobby, have insisted the term Jewish lobby is ‘inaccurate and misleading, both because the [Israel] lobby includes non-Jews like Christian Zionists and because many Jewish Americans do not support the hard-line policies favored by its most powerful elements.’”


This has to be a first: a former editor of the Jerusalem Post citing Walt and Mearsheimer as an authority. Oddly, Walt’s endorsement of the Hagel nomination is proof enough for Bill Kristol and his band of neoconservative Orcs that Hagel is the second coming of Adolf Hitler — but never mind. Trying to discern an internal consistency in the hysterical ululations of this crowd is like searching for meaning in the squeals and squawks of chickens in the barnyard: it’s just a lot of noise, signifying nothing — nothing but pure malice, in Stephens’ case, with a good dose of paranoia thrown in for good measure.
 

owedtojoy

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 27, 2010
Messages
46,105
Apparently, Hagel's main offence is that he has made it clear that American interests are paramount, and Israel's come second.

You can understand AIPAC disagreeing with that, but it is scary to see US Senators and Congressmen disagreeing with Hagel.

Having lost on Susan Rice, the President cannot afford to lose this one.

Smearing Hagel, Ctd - The Dish | By Andrew Sullivan - The Daily Beast

Fisking The Washington Post - The Dish | By Andrew Sullivan - The Daily Beast

Andrew Sullivan is doing an ongoing piece on this.
 

NYCKY

Moderator
Joined
Apr 17, 2010
Messages
13,110
It's tough to call this one as there is no vacancy at Defense as current defense secretary Panetta hasn't given a timeline for his departure.

Hagel was a moderate Republican Senator and a Vietnam combat veteran. Former and current Senators tend to get easy rides when it comes to confirmation for posts in the Cabinet, ambassadorships etc. They know each other and typically owe each from old IOUs for various dealmakings over the years.

The fact that he is a Republican will also stand him in good stead. If he is nominated I expect that Hagel will be approved, albeit not unanimously but comfortably.
 

flavirostris

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 21, 2007
Messages
24,925
Chuck Hagel is one of the few Republicans who wouldn't make you want to throw up. I remember at the time of the Bush Iraq War, he poured scorn on neo-conservative chickenhawks like Richard Perle for their incessant war-mongering.

He said at the time; "I assume Mr Perle will want to be in the first wave invading Iraq".

Anybody who wants to understand the power of AIPAC and groups like ZOA ( Zionist Organisation of America ) should read the Mearsheimer & Walt classic "The Israel Lobby and US Foreign Policy".

Very few in Congress would dare to get on their bad side. Once you read the book, it's easier to understand why a nut like Netanyahu would get 3 standing ovations at his address to a joint session of House & Senate.
 

ManOfReason

Well-known member
Joined
May 24, 2007
Messages
4,328
MoR that was 18 yrs ago.
To be clear - 'That' was in 1998, which to any gay movers and shakers in the Democratic Party was at the time their community was at its most vulnerable. This is what he said:

“They are representing America,” Mr. Hagel said in an interview with The Omaha World-Herald. “They are representing our lifestyle, our values, our standards. And I think it is an inhibiting factor to be gay — openly, aggressively gay like Mr. Hormel — to do an effective job.”​
After that there here is no way he will ever hold any position in the Obama administration and you would have to wonder what game Obama is up to by floating his name at all. So it is not your fictional "all-powerful" Jewish lobby that will stop his nomination, because it was never going to happen in the first place.
 

Dame_Enda

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 14, 2011
Messages
52,243
A lot of Americans felt that way in 1998. As a gay person I don't hold it against him in 2012. Gingrich has just come out in favour of gay marriage, as have other conservatives like Glenn Beck and Lou Dobbs.
 

owedtojoy

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 27, 2010
Messages
46,105
To be clear - 'That' was in 1998, which to any gay movers and shakers in the Democratic Party was at the time their community was at its most vulnerable. This is what he said:

“They are representing America,” Mr. Hagel said in an interview with The Omaha World-Herald. “They are representing our lifestyle, our values, our standards. And I think it is an inhibiting factor to be gay — openly, aggressively gay like Mr. Hormel — to do an effective job.”​
After that there here is no way he will ever hold any position in the Obama administration and you would have to wonder what game Obama is up to by floating his name at all. So it is not your fictional "all-powerful" Jewish lobby that will stop his nomination, because it was never going to happen in the first place.
I don't think Richard Gates had a reputation as a bleeding heart when it came to gays, but few Democrats objected to him staying on Secretary of Defence 4 years ago.
 

Iphonista

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 6, 2012
Messages
4,200
Israel Israel Israel Israel Israel

Why is the weather better in Israel?
Do the Zionists control our climate?

I see Carlos the Twit started a thread claiming Jews were behind that school shooting in the USA and the fool who started this thread claims they financed Cromwell.

There's a time for debate and a time for some people to get a f---ing grip and go get their paranoias, bigotries and OCDs sorted.
 

Dame_Enda

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 14, 2011
Messages
52,243
Israel Israel Israel Israel Israel

Why is the weather better in Israel?
Do the Zionists control our climate?

I see Carlos the Twit started a thread claiming Jews were behind that school shooting in the USA and the fool who started this thread claims they financed Cromwell.

There's a time for debate and a time for some people to get a f---ing grip and go get their paranoias, bigotries and OCDs sorted.
They (including Amsterdam financier Menasseh Ben Israel) and Antonio Fernandes Carvajal did finance Cromwell and the readmission of the Jews to England in 1655 was the payback.
 
Last edited:

eyelight

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 16, 2010
Messages
8,296

Dame_Enda

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 14, 2011
Messages
52,243
That link says NOTHING about De Jooz financing Cromwell.

Authoritative link, please.
I didn't say all the Jews financed Cromwell. However the New Model Army was financed in part by Jewish financier Antonio Fernandez Carvajal.
Antonio Fernandez Carvajal (c.1590–November 10, 1659)—in Portuguese: António Fernandes Carvalhal—was a Portuguese-Jewish merchant, who became the first endenizened English Jew.

He was born about 1590, probably at Fundão, Portugal. He appears to have left Fundão on account of the persecution of the Inquisition and, proceeding to the Canary Islands, acquired much property there, made many commercial connections, which led him (about 1635) to London, where he settled in Leadenhall Street. In 1649 the council of state appointed him one among the five persons who received the army contract for corn. In 1653 Carvajal was reported as owning a number of ships trading to the East and West Indies, to Brazil, and to the Levant.

He dealt in all kinds of merchandise, including gunpowder, wine, hides, pictures, cochineal, and especially corn and silver, and is reported to have brought to England, on average, £100,000 worth of silver per annum.
 

Iphonista

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 6, 2012
Messages
4,200
I didn't say all the Jews financed Cromwell. However the New Model Army was financed in part by Jewish financier Antonio Fernandez Carvajal.
You said Zionists - plural - and all know you mean lots of Jews.

I'm just wondering if you can read. If someone wins a contract to supply an army with corn, they're making a profit from the army - they're not financing it.
 

Dame_Enda

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 14, 2011
Messages
52,243
You said Zionists - plural - and all know you mean lots of Jews.

I'm just wondering if you can read. If someone wins a contract to supply an army with corn, they're making a profit from the army - they're not financing it.
It also mentions vast quantities of silver. I am not tarring all Jews with the one brush but it is a fact that Zionists were lavishly providing for and financing Cromwell's army.
 

Iphonista

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 6, 2012
Messages
4,200
It also mentions vast quantities of silver. I am not tarring all Jews with the one brush but it is a fact that Zionists were lavishly providing for and financing Cromwell's army.
No, it isn't. I've caught you out twice in the lie.

Your apparent concern for Palestinians is a cover for the fact that you're a scummy, anti-Jewish bigot.
 

New Threads

Popular Threads

Most Replies

Top