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Cardinal calls for new not-for-profit finance bodies

SPN

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It's good to see that someone shares my belief that we should set up our financial instutions so that they serve the needs of society rather than the needs of vested interests.

The current system, which most people don't seem to understand, is based on making profits for shareholders - hence the recent decision by Irish Permanent to increase their margins.

We can also expect to see Insurance Premiums rising for the forseeable future as the Insurance Companies seek to offset losses on stock market with increases in premium income.

Any such new instutions will need robust constitutions though - INBS was a mutual, and we saw how Fingers Fingleton was able to turn that institution into a personal fiefdom run for the benefit of Fingers Fingleton.


Cardinal calls for new not-for-profit finance bodieshttp://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2009/0815/1224252587114.html
CATHOLIC PRIMATE Cardinal Seán Brady has suggested that with confidence in commercial banks declining, the time may have come for responsible Catholic economists to take the lead in developing credit union-type institutions.

These would focus on systems of lending, saving and insurance built on an ethic of authentic human development, the cardinal stated at the opening of the national novena in Knock shrine, Co Mayo, on Thursday.

In a major homily, Cardinal Brady, dwelling at length on the current economic slump, said “it would be tragic if nothing was learned from the recession”.

Addressing thousands of pilgrims on the theme “Seeds of Hope”, the cardinal said it was probably an understatement to say that confidence in many commercial banks was declining and that disillusionment was setting in.

He asked: “Has the time not come for responsible Catholic economists to take the lead in developing some not-for-profit systems of lending, saving and insurance, built on an ethic of authentic human development?
 


Cael

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Its a pity the Catholic church didnt say this BEFORE the horse had bolted. Well, better late than never I suppose.
 

CookieMonster

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Well that's never going to happen.
 

Cael

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CookieMonster

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Not if the likes of you have their way.
True. But also because any such effort will need capital to begin with and they're not going to get it if they're not making a profit.

But you're a bit blinkered, which is fine because as a commie that's what I'd expect from you, but there are numerous non-profit based financial organisations out there. The one I am involved with is Kiva - Loans that change lives. I've contributed thousands to them todate and will continue to.

But continue with your weird ass presocution complex and distorted view of everybody who isn't a commie.
 

cunningstunt

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Whilst the Cardinal mentioned credit unions and the Knights of Columbus, he failed to mention Islamiic banking -Shariah which is practised throughout the Muslim world.

The basic principle of Islamic banking is the sharing of profit and loss and the prohibition usury or charging interest on loans.

But again they are not christain so must be not be copied.
 

disgruntledcitizen

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well the Roman Catholic church is one of the wealthiest organizations in existence, could they not (for once) practice what they preach and actually set same up rather than expecting others to do it for them ?

they've done a lot of damage to society and suffered a lot of negative PR, actually doing something constructive even at a low level could benefit both them and the community they claim to serve...
 

Nipper

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I wonder if he will give me a loan!

He could always convert to Islam as they don't don't allow interest as far as I know

I wonder do the church accept interest from the bank on the cash the swindle out of people at mass?
 

CookieMonster

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Whilst the Cardinal mentioned credit unions and the Knights of Columbus, he failed to mention Islamiic banking -Shariah which is practised throughout the Muslim world.

The basic principle of Islamic banking is the sharing of profit and loss and the prohibition usury or charging interest on loans.

But again they are not christain so must be not be copied.
Well that's not entirely true, infact they said pretty much that a few months ago:

Vatican Says Islamic Finance May Help Western Banks in Crisis - Bloomberg.com
 

liamfoley

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well the Roman Catholic church is one of the wealthiest organizations in existence, could they not (for once) practice what they preach and actually set same up rather than expecting others to do it for them ?

they've done a lot of damage to society and suffered a lot of negative PR, actually doing something constructive even at a low level could benefit both them and the community they claim to serve...
Largest charitable organisation in te world, more money flows through Church organizations to those in need than any country, and they are a lot more efficient. The do ind practice what they preach. I have no quibble with your second point.
 

Cael

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True. But also because any such effort will need capital to begin with and they're not going to get it if they're not making a profit.

But you're a bit blinkered, which is fine because as a commie that's what I'd expect from you, but there are numerous non-profit based financial organisations out there. The one I am involved with is Kiva - Loans that change lives. I've contributed thousands to them todate and will continue to.

But continue with your weird ass presocution complex and distorted view of everybody who isn't a commie.
The only sane thing to do is for states to own the banks and run them for the good of society.
 

CookieMonster

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The only sane thing to do is for states to own the banks and run them for the good of society.
I'm sorry but no. Because your idea of state and my idea of state are very different. Yours is a communist state with people's committees and so on and so on which would result in endless beaurocracy and sharing of deminishing resources. Not going to happen.

My state belongs to people directly - not collectively, trading and interacting to get what they need. A bank owned by shareholders, providing a service for customers, at a profit is perfectlt fine with me.

If somebody wants to set up a bank on islamic banking principles and people want to bank there so be it.

If somebody wants to set up a microfinancing organisation to help people in LA or Lagos then more power too them.
 

Clanrickard

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Whilst the Cardinal mentioned credit unions and the Knights of Columbus, he failed to mention Islamiic banking -Shariah which is practised throughout the Muslim world.

The basic principle of Islamic banking is the sharing of profit and loss and the prohibition usury or charging interest on loans.

But again they are not christain so must be not be copied.
Shariah banking is a cod. There is no such thing as Islamic banking. It was concocted by the Muslim Brotherhood. It should not be allowed because it means money being diverted to questionable ends all at the behest of the Imams who are consulted about what is allowed and what is not.
 

Clanrickard

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Well that's never going to happen.
It would be a pity. I think main stream banks like AIB and BofI could be nationalized and made not for profit. Merchant banking could be a separate idea.
 

CookieMonster

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It would be a pity. I think main stream banks like AIB and BofI could be nationalized and made not for profit. Merchant banking could be a separate idea.
Not a hope. You let those useless ****s in AIB and BOI loose with my money at tell them they don't need to make a profit?

If any of the banks are fully nastionalised I'd be expecting record profits to beat the band.
 

Cael

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I'm sorry but no. Because your idea of state and my idea of state are very different. Yours is a communist state with people's committees and so on and so on which would result in endless beaurocracy and sharing of deminishing resources. Not going to happen.

My state belongs to people directly - not collectively, trading and interacting to get what they need. A bank owned by shareholders, providing a service for customers, at a profit is perfectlt fine with me.

If somebody wants to set up a bank on islamic banking principles and people want to bank there so be it.

If somebody wants to set up a microfinancing organisation to help people in LA or Lagos then more power too them.
Yes, my idea involves sharing, and yours involves a small group of people owning everything directly. I couldnt have put it better myself.
 

Cael

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Not a hope. You let those useless ****s in AIB and BOI loose with my money at tell them they don't need to make a profit?

If any of the banks are fully nastionalised I'd be expecting record profits to beat the band.

But you already did let those useless fvcks in AIB et al have your money and they didnt make a profit - they made a staggering loss. How could civil servants be worse than that? If the state is so rubbish at doing things and the privateers so much better, then why are the privateers begging the state for bail outs?
 

CookieMonster

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Yes, my idea involves sharing, and yours involves a small group of people owning everything directly. I couldnt have put it better myself.
Banking involves risk - with or without profit. I'm already exposed to BOI, AIB, Anglo, NAMA and god knows what else though no choice of my own. I don't want any more thanks.

I don't want to share that risk. If I did I'd buy shares.

I need a bank I open an account. I get a service, they get a profit. No risk to me. Hunky dory.

I want to make some money - I invest. In doing so I voluntarily take on the risk. Hunky dory.

You can spin words to make your commie ideas look nobel and lovely but that doesn't hide exactly what they are, commie ideas. The only one you're fooling is yourself.
 

CookieMonster

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But you already did let those useless fvcks in AIB et al have your money and they didnt make a profit - they made a staggering loss. How could civil servants be worse than that?
Did you really ask that question?


If the state is so rubbish at doing things and the privateers so much better, then why are the privateers begging the state for bail outs?
Because the state will give it to them! The state shouldn't, the firms should go bankrupt. That's how it should work.
 


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