Castlepollard Exclusion From Commission on Mother and Baby Homes INQUIRY. (Second Thread)

Lumpy Talbot

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Starry, sorry to get across the bottom of this above post on International Day of the Disappeared but I thought you'd want to know about this article which is a feature piece published on the BBC front page today.


Apart from some absolutely heart-breaking accounts of lives distorted by the vile mentality of certain priests, nuns and the appalling abandonment by the state of children to the care of a cult from the early uncertain days of the modern state itself, there is quite an interesting passage in there about some of the orders in default of their share of the redress bill.

Substantial mention of the forced and unpaid labour carried out by children and the regime they withstood.

Be warned. There are some rather upsetting accounts in there of their lives as they tried to pull some kind of existence together after their very damaging experiences.

First mention too of the strokes pulled by state agencies in trying to limit redress liabilities, and the failure to prosecute paedophile and sadistic clergy arising from the Ryan Report, which of course was 'fixed' by the state to supply false names of the clerics involved and of course the failure to bring forward prosecution by the state of crimes detailed in that report.

And of course the moves to seal records for 75 years, which to my mind is not an attempt to protect survivors but inevitably with the Irish state is still stuck in 'cover-up' mode for these wretched cultists.

No wonder the average cleric and nun remaining are elderly for the most part and secondly why they suddenly decided that civilian clothes were the way to go and have largely abandoned that dirty uniform.
 


Catahualpa

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International Day of the Disappeared ~ 30 August 2019


*Irish Council for Civil Liberties (ICCL) Press Release*


ICCL REITERATE CALL FOR GOVERNMENT TO RATIFY THE UN CONVENTION ON ENFORCED DISAPPEARANCES (CED)




ICCL calls for action on disappeared children

Dublin, 30 August 2019

On the International Day of the Disappeared, the Irish Council for Civil Liberties (ICCL) has reiterated our call for the government to ratify the UN Convention on Enforced Disappearances (CED). It is essential that government appropriately address the potential enforced disappearance of hundreds, if not thousands, of children from mother and baby homes and the ongoing legacy of harm caused by this.

In particular, we point to the failure to locate the burial site of 836 children at the Bessborough Mother and Baby Home and the failure to exhume the burial place of 796 children at Tuam as two examples of practices that could constitute enforced disappearances in this country.


LittlesAnglesPlotBessboroughBlackrock_large.jpg

'Little Angels plot, Bessborough Mother and Baby Home'



A roadmap to deal with Enforced Disappearances

The CED provides a roadmap for dealing with enforced disappearances. In its failure to implement this treaty, the government is missing an opportunity to follow international best practice in dealing with these gravest of human rights violations. Most worryingly, in continuing to pursue a policy of secrecy and even censorship of survivors, Ireland risks failing to ever bring the perpetrators of these rights violations to justice.

Obligation to Investigate


If it ratified CED, the State would be obliged to locate the remains of the 836 children who are missing from the Bessborough Home. It would also be obliged to prevent the withholding of information and to impose sanctions on those who have information and do not share it. The Mother and Baby Homes Commission has said they believe information was withheld from them, and indeed that Church bodies provided information which was “speculative, inaccurate and misleading”.

CED would require investigators to have the necessary powers and resources to conduct the investigation effectively. Through its continuing failure to compel witnesses to give evidence to processes of investigation, the State is helping to hide the truth and ensuring families of the disappeared remain in the dark.

Criminal Accountability for Perpetrators


If it ratified CED, the State would also be obliged to hold the perpetrators of these human rights violations criminally accountable. ICCL is concerned that the government’s current strategy of investigation is hindering future access to evidence, and thereby preventing prosecutions, by prioritising secrecy over transparency.

Evidence to be sealed for 75 years

We are particularly concerned that the Retention of Records Bill, which is currently passing through the Oireachtas, will seal all evidence given to the Mother and Baby Homes Commission for 75 years. This is particularly worrying given that An Garda Síochána could not carry out prosecutions stemming from the Ryan report because of the Commission’s similar terms of reference. In 2016, when the UN Committee Against Torture demanded to know why there had been no prosecutions, the State reported that the perpetrators identified in that report could not be named.







Illegal adoptions and possible Child Trafficking

This approach to potential evidence of criminal wrongdoing is inexcusable, particularly given all that has come to light over the past year, including the falsification of adoption certificates, the possibility that the state was complicit in what could be considered child trafficking, and the ongoing struggle of adoptees to access their basic information, including birth certificates. ICCL has repeatedly called for information to be provided to those who were illegally or forcibly adopted in Ireland during the twentieth century but the State has yet to respond appropriately.



AdoptionAds_large.jpg

'
Adoption ads appeared in the classified sections of the national newspapers in the 1950s and 60s'


Despite numerous apologies and gestures towards restorative justice for survivors of the cruel and inhumane system of institutionalisation of the most vulnerable in this country, the State is still not living up to its obligations to survivors or families of victims. It must act to properly address the ongoing legacy and harm caused by the range of human rights violations that occurred in these institutions.

ENDS/


Notes for editors:

The government has signed but not ratified the CED. This means it has signalled its intent to comply with the treaty but is not yet legally bound by it. ICCL has previously called for government to ratify CED.

Full text of CED: OHCHR | Convention CED

For media queries:

Sinéad Nolan: sinead.nolan@iccl.ie 087 4157162

Filed Under: 2019, Human Rights, Information & Privacy Rights, Justice, Monitoring Human Rights, News, Press Release, Press Releases, Promoting Justice Tagged With: Adoption rights, bessborough mother and baby home, illegal adoptons, institutional abuse, mother and baby homes, tuam, UN Convention on Enforced Disappearance


__________________


'Lost In Traffick'

Bodger at 11:41 am August 30, 2019




"This morning.​
"Today is International Day of the Disappeared.​
"The Irish Council for Civil Liberties (ICCL) has reiterated its call for the Government to ratify the UN Convention on Enforced Disappearances (CED).​
'Adoption ads appeared in the classified sections of the national newspapers in the 1950s and 60s'

And what happens to unwanted children in this more enlightened age?

Their lives are terminated when still inside their mothers' womb!


At least back they got the chance to be born and live their lives...
 

StarryPlough01

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Lumpy, Thank you for the article. William Gorry's story is horrific. I didn't know about his younger brother Thomas Gorry, one of the "disappeared."



Brilliant feature article ~

'Ireland's hidden survivors'


By Leanna Byrne


Starry:
Two young brothers William and Thomas Gorry were sent to Mount Carmel Industrial School in Moate, Co Westmeath, run by the Sisters of Mercy for the Midland Health Board.

William Gorry was aged 10 years and his brother Thomas only 6 years old. *They had to witness each other being sexually abused by two priests.*

The younger brother Thomas had brittle bone disease and William is visually impaired.

Thomas was 11 years old in May 1983 when he was taken on a pilgrimage to Lourdes by the local Order of Malta and clergy. Thomas was returned home in a coffin. The family never got to see Thomas to say goodbye.


'Offaly man speaks out about sickening abuse suffered in local residential home'

By Justin Kelly 4 Apr 2017




"I was sexually abused by a Parish Priest and another local priest in their home. I was also abused by men who were care staff at the homes," William told us. William recalled numerous instances of sexual abuse, each one more horrifying than the next.


'Offaly man says abused brother's death is a mystery 36 years on'
'Thomas would have been 48 years old today, Thursday, May 30'

By Justin Kelly 30 May 2019




Starry: ^^^ In the above article dated 30 May 2019, William Gorry says his brother Thomas is one of the "disappeared." "He was a citizen of this state, in the care of the state as a child and a victim of institutional abuse,…." William is seeking answers to his brother's "disappearance" and closure for all his family.
 

StarryPlough01

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"London Irish: Appeal for mourners as native son returns to rest"

" The late Joseph Tuohy ‘symbolic of a hidden suffering - we should never forget our people’ "

about an hour ago

By Sarah Slater


Brian Boylan - a former Columban Fathers priest - who knew Joseph Tuohy for 40 years:

"Speaking from London, Mr Boylan, who runs St Gabriel’s Homeless Centre, said his friend, who died in a nursing home in Islington, had borne the scars of an upbringing in Ireland during the 1930s that was “very different” from today.​
“His mother became pregnant while working in New York. She was alone and abandoned but managed to return home to Ireland. *He told me they had a special bond he never forgot.* She was a loving mother who worked very hard on various farms cooking,” said Mr Boylan.“But Ireland of that time was not a place to be an unmarried mother, and the various authorities were just waiting for a slip-up by her so he could be put into care.” :mad: ….​
“From the age of 14 to 16 Joe worked as a tailor in the St Joseph’s Industrial School in Clonmel, Co Tipperary. He was only one of two boys there who passed the then Primary Cert. A lay teacher asked the religious order if Joe could sit the Post Office exams, but they refused. :mad:
....
A funeral Mass is to be held for Joseph on Friday 27 September at 10.00 am in St Joseph’s Church, Glasthule, Co Dublin.

RIP
 

Andrew49

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I wonder how many have committed suicide, or had their lives blighted by issues stemming from abuse.
In 2005, Anthony Delaney, a former resident of St Joseph's Industrial School in Letterfrack, visited a drop-in centre run by the National Office for Victims of Abuse (NOVA) on the day he died. He thought to have thrown himself into the river at the city's quays at noon on Tuesday after emerging from a nearby solicitors' offices. Link
 

StarryPlough01

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This case is around George Pell's convicted friend - deviant abomination *Gerald Ridsdale,* a defrocked priest

Pell has known Gerald Ridsdale since 1973 when Ridsdale and he shared accommodation together at St Alipius Parish House, Ballarat.

Ridsdale is presently sharing accommodation with Pell in the same prison


The plaintiff in this case was raped as a child in a confessional box by notorious Fr Gerald Ridsdale. Ridsdale was convicted of abuse and indecent assault of 54 children and later pleaded guilty to a further charge of abusing 11 children:


'Compensation floodgates open for victims of clergy abuse after church admits liability'

September 6 2019 - 1:20 PM


By Andrew Thomson


Four defendants served their defences to an amended statement of claim:


"In those defences Bishop Bird, on behalf of the estate of the late Bishop Mulkearns, admitted that Bishop Mulkearns breached his duty of care to the victim because the bishop knew in 1975 about a complaint of Ridsdale sexually abusing a child at Inglewood.​
"The Diocese of Ballarat also admits that they failed to take any reasonable steps to protect the victim from Ridsdale after they knew about the Inglewood complaint.​
"A story published in the mid-1990s proved Bishop Mulkearns knew about complaints from Inglewood after a police officer became involved and informed the bishop of the complaint against Ridsdale.​




"2001 Pell is appointed archbishop of Sydney, where he now oversees the Towards Healing program.​
"The commission later finds that during this period Pell and the Sydney archdiocese spent more than $1m fighting a legal claim by an abuse victim, John Ellis, to discourage others from attempting the same. Read David Marr’s analysis of the Ellis case here [see following article].​


Important to read this article to the end ~

 

StarryPlough01

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'Possible to collect Tuam DNA samples before legislation - report'

Updated / Wednesday, 11 Sep 2019 20:10


By Joe Little

The Cabinet has been told that it should be possible to develop a voluntary scheme to allow for the collection of biological samples from survivors and others connected to Tuam's mother-and-baby home in advance of a law being enacted to underpin the process.​
Minister for Children Katherine Zappone has said a report by family law expert Geoffrey Shannon gives her "strong hope" that that it will be possible to develop an administrative scheme in the coming months to allow for the collection of samples.​
….​
The department has already told RTÉ News that the heads of a bill for that legislation should be ready by the end of October, but observers agree that it could take a long time to enact the legislation.​
Legal sources said that administrative schemes have been used here in key areas before, for example to underpin direct provision for asylum seekers. *** No new legislation is required to implement them.****

REPORT ON THE COLLECTION OF TUAM SURVIVORS’ DNA

15/04 / 2 0 1 9

Dr. Geoffrey Shannon





‘Family-tree’ websites could be model for Tuam DNA database

Geoffrey Shannon says commercial tests show how easily DNA can be gathered





By Brian Hutton


Dr Geoffrey Shannon 98 page report:


“There are a number of such providers which advertise and promote the ability to ‘uncover ethnic origins’ and ‘find new relatives’. This includes myheritage.com, findmypast.ie, ancestry.com and easydna.ie.”​
The companies send out simple saliva tests in the post – a small tube for the collection of a sample – which customers mail back. The DNA of the sample is then assessed at a laboratory.​
Mr Shannon points out the tests “uncover family origins – not only geographically – but also by linking with relatives online, often distant cousins”.​
….​
“There appears to be a compelling justification to establish an appropriate administrative scheme rendering it permissible to collect Tuam survivors’ DNA samples on a voluntary basis once privacy and GDPR concerns are addressed,” he added.​
 

Catahualpa

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'Possible to collect Tuam DNA samples before legislation - report'

Updated / Wednesday, 11 Sep 2019 20:10


By Joe Little

The Cabinet has been told that it should be possible to develop a voluntary scheme to allow for the collection of biological samples from survivors and others connected to Tuam's mother-and-baby home in advance of a law being enacted to underpin the process.​
Minister for Children Katherine Zappone has said a report by family law expert Geoffrey Shannon gives her "strong hope" that that it will be possible to develop an administrative scheme in the coming months to allow for the collection of samples.​
….​
The department has already told RTÉ News that the heads of a bill for that legislation should be ready by the end of October, but observers agree that it could take a long time to enact the legislation.​
Legal sources said that administrative schemes have been used here in key areas before, for example to underpin direct provision for asylum seekers. *** No new legislation is required to implement them.****

REPORT ON THE COLLECTION OF TUAM SURVIVORS’ DNA

15/04 / 2 0 1 9

Dr. Geoffrey Shannon





‘Family-tree’ websites could be model for Tuam DNA database

Geoffrey Shannon says commercial tests show how easily DNA can be gathered





By Brian Hutton


Dr Geoffrey Shannon 98 page report:


“There are a number of such providers which advertise and promote the ability to ‘uncover ethnic origins’ and ‘find new relatives’. This includes myheritage.com, findmypast.ie, ancestry.com and easydna.ie.”​
The companies send out simple saliva tests in the post – a small tube for the collection of a sample – which customers mail back. The DNA of the sample is then assessed at a laboratory.​
Mr Shannon points out the tests “uncover family origins – not only geographically – but also by linking with relatives online, often distant cousins”.​
….​
“There appears to be a compelling justification to establish an appropriate administrative scheme rendering it permissible to collect Tuam survivors’ DNA samples on a voluntary basis once privacy and GDPR concerns are addressed,” he added.​
Shannon is not exactly an unbiased source now is he?
 

StarryPlough01

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Cat, They are getting ready… Read below:

'Tuam survivors ‘pleased’ they can offer their DNA samples can be taken'

Thursday 12 September 2019


By Conall Ó Fátharta Irish Examiner Reporter


Breeda Murphy PRO for Tuam Mother and Baby Home Alliance stated:

... the group was “pleased” that Dr Shannon had proposed the collection of DNA samples via an administrative scheme.​
“It is comforting to note that no DNA profiles can be constructed arising out of the samples until legislation is in place and we are assured it is possible to generate DNA from the remains of the lost children,” she said.​
“The DNA is being collected for that sole purpose. The safe storage of DNA is paramount and we are provided with an assurance it will not be available or used for any purpose other than matching. If the possibility is not there to match for any reason, then the DNA will be destroyed. It is valuable data and must be treated as such,” she said.​
Ms Murphy also expressed gratitude to Dr Shannon for looking favourably on the “request to begin the process of banking DNA from concerned family members and survivors without the necessity of awaiting a lengthy legislation process”.​



Thursday, September 12, 2019 - 06:10 AM


By Conall Ó Fátharta Irish Examiner Reporter


Mr Shannon found that while the current Criminal Justice (Forensic Evidence and DNA Database System) Act 2014 may not be suitable for the collection of such samples, it could be done by way of a voluntary administrative scheme and without the need for new legislation.

The report states that although the introduction of bespoke legislation “has certain advantages”, there is “no reason, in principle, why an appropriate administrative scheme could not be established on the basis of other legal instruments”.

The report says that the Government has the power to establish such schemes to implement desired policy objectives and has done so in the past. Dr Shannon said many of these schemes operated with no statutory basis and specifically highlighted the example of the direct provision system as an example.

It is likely that a similar scheme could be applied to in the case of any other institution where infant remains are discovered found.

 

StarryPlough01

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Its pretty obvious he's as Gay a Day! 🤪

Back on point...

Cat,

The official government line is that Minister Zappone asked Dr Geoffrey Shannon to look into what might be possible under existing laws to collect *VOLUNTARY* DNA from family members in view of the age and health status of these survivors. Of course this doesn't make any sense. *If people want to voluntarily give their DNA, what is to stop them?*

The purpose of the DNA bank is to later compare these samples with any DNA profiles from the human remains found at Tuam site once the unnecessary "new" legislation is in place.

I agree with Tuam Home Survivors Network (read their press release below) that it did not require independent legal expert Dr Geoffrey Shannon to write a report confirming that it is legal. It's part of the North Galway coroner's service to carry this out.



Press Release - Tuam Home Survivors Response Regarding Press Release From D.C.Y.A. On Dr. Geoffrey Shannon's "Report on the Collection of Tuam Survivors' DNA"
11/09/2019​
….
It did not require the second Report to confirm that the voluntary provision of DNA by family members of those lying in the Tuam pit is unquestionably legal.​
In countries with a properly functioning Justice system, incorporating a Coroners Service performing its statutory duty, the use of DNA is part of the day to day work of such bodies.​
Only a duly convened inquest into the death of each child who died in the Tuam institution, to determine the cause of death of each child, will meet the requirements of the law and humanity.​
The continued failure of the Coroner for North Galway and successive Attorneys General to perform their duty is staggering and indefensible.​
 

Lumpy Talbot

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Notice as well the comment about Zappone carefully pointing to a legislative arrangement that 'could take a long time to implement'.

Sure, sure. Can't use the existing systems of course which should come into play when bodies are discovered.

Nice long time during which remaining survivors who are mostly elderly die off. Which has been the central plank of successive Irish government's response to anything involving the degeneracy of the cult in Ireland.

I wouldn't say because there is any great desire to cover up for the cult as Pandora threw open the lid of her own box on that one, but of course to limit the spectre of state liability for repeated failure to inspect and regulate such institutions, despite a clear duty to do so under UN obligations as a UN member state.

Of course it would still be unthinkable for a government which is quite comfortable with the utilising of vulture funds to chase down mortgage defaulters, but seems incapable of collecting the money these religious orders still owe the taxpayer. For redress payments which an Ahern govt, led by a man who worked as an unqualified accounts clerk for the Sisters of Mercy in his early career, arranged in such a way as to provide a discount at taxpayers' expense for these orders.

Not sure how many other governments around Europe would be so keen to pay damages and liabilities in redress for privately owned organisations and allow itself whimperingly to fail to collect that money from the private organisations involved.

Successive Irish Governments have failed miserably and unaccountably to hold these orders to account for their legal liabilities, and present government is making a further mistake which the social history books will remember, in allowing a situation to develop where these decrepit and ethically degenerate organisations will pass ownership of capital in the form of buildings and land to trusts which will effectively end up being absentee landlords administered by cult lawyers.

Still bent, after all these years. And Zappone and the Irish Government's careful avoidance of existing legal processes in favour of constructing a new process more under government control is yet another attempt at defrauding victims and their families of both justice and redress.
 

StarryPlough01

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Notice as well the comment about Zappone carefully pointing to a legislative arrangement that 'could take a long time to implement'.

Sure, sure. Can't use the existing systems of course which should come into play when bodies are discovered.

Nice long time during which remaining survivors who are mostly elderly die off. Which has been the central plank of successive Irish government's response to anything involving the degeneracy of the cult in Ireland.

I wouldn't say because there is any great desire to cover up for the cult as Pandora threw open the lid of her own box on that one, but of course to limit the spectre of state liability for repeated failure to inspect and regulate such institutions, despite a clear duty to do so under UN obligations as a UN member state.

Of course it would still be unthinkable for a government which is quite comfortable with the utilising of vulture funds to chase down mortgage defaulters, but seems incapable of collecting the money these religious orders still owe the taxpayer. For redress payments which an Ahern govt, led by a man who worked as an unqualified accounts clerk for the Sisters of Mercy in his early career, arranged in such a way as to provide a discount at taxpayers' expense for these orders.

Not sure how many other governments around Europe would be so keen to pay damages and liabilities in redress for privately owned organisations and allow itself whimperingly to fail to collect that money from the private organisations involved.

Successive Irish Governments have failed miserably and unaccountably to hold these orders to account for their legal liabilities, and present government is making a further mistake which the social history books will remember, in allowing a situation to develop where these decrepit and ethically degenerate organisations will pass ownership of capital in the form of buildings and land to trusts which will effectively end up being absentee landlords administered by cult lawyers.

Still bent, after all these years. And Zappone and the Irish Government's careful avoidance of existing legal processes in favour of constructing a new process more under government control is yet another attempt at defrauding victims and their families of both justice and redress.

Lumpy,

Yes.

By Digital Desk staff
Saturday, March 16, 2019 - 03:05 PM

The excavation of the Tuam site is expected to begin later this year as long as the Government passes the necessary legislation required to allow it.

Starry: FF Spokesperson for Children and Youth Affairs Anne Rabbitte said on the Keith Finnegan Show back in April that legislation will be needed in the final quarter to ensure excavation work, and jobs that could be done would need to be brought forward; and it is not in their 2019 summer selection of new legislation. She said it's the cabinet who decide the legislation programme.

Well, Anne Rabbitte is correct - nothing to see here - Legislation Programme Summer Session 2019 ~


Ms Catherine Corless was also a guest on the show with Ms Rabbitte. Ms Corless said "coincidentally" Minister Zappone had rung her prior to the show!! Corless had asked the Minister about the new legislation and Ms Zappone "gave indication that the excavation will be going forward this year. "And hopefully they will get legislation through asap."


^^^ They will create a pretext completely out of whole cloth and expect noone will recognise exactly how feeble the pretence, and how pathetic their motivation.


Activist solicitor Kevin Higgins said on Broadsheet on the Telly Episode 86 - the new legislation is only to bypass existing law in regard to coroners and inquests. He stated the existing law is the only legal mechanism which can place on public record the cause of death of each of those children.

In my view, under the existing law it was illegal for the Bon Secours congregation - who were in charge of the Tuam Home - to discard children and adults in a cesspit. These acts were criminal. Statutory authority Galway County Council owned the building and in my view had knowledge, if not fully complicit.



#593 - Why they want to change the law

 

StarryPlough01

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Conall Ó Fátharta‏ @ococonuts


I see the Dept of Education has confirmed the @irishexaminer story this morning that the Christian Brothers have made the first (€1.8m) of four installments to finalise a €6.3m payment promised to the Caranua redress Fund for abuse survivors



Press Release



06 September, 2019 – Minister McHugh welcomes plan to complete Christian Brothers Contribution to Redress Fund
The Department of Education and Skills has been formally notified by the Congregation of Christian Brothers of its plan for the completion of the Congregation’s voluntary pledge to the Residential Institutions Statutory Fund.​
The Congregation has confirmed to the Department that it will complete the pledge through a series of monthly cash transfers between September and December of this year.​
The total to be transferred will amount to €6.8 million.​
Minister for Education and Skills Joe Mc Hugh T.D. said: “I welcome the clear confirmation from the Christian Brothers of its plan to complete its pledge. I particularly welcome the fact that this plan has now been put into operation, with the first tranche of €1.8 million having been transferred this week.​
“This confirmation provides both funding and much needed clarity for Caranua to allow it to continue its supports for survivors.”​
Ends​
Notes for Editors​
For more information on the Residential Institutions Statutory Fund please see the following link:​
Under the provisions of the Residential Institutions Statutory Fund Act 2002, any amount in excess of €110 million in the fund is to go to the funding of the National Children’s Hospital.​
Of the remainder of the Congregation’s pledge:​
€6,371,089.99 is to be paid to the Fund.​
€428,910.01 is to be paid over to the National Children’s Hospital.​
When the current plan is completed, the Congregation of Christian Brothers will have contributed €30 million to the Residential Institutions Statutory Fund.​
 


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