Cath Cluain Tarbh/Battle of Clontarf 1014 AD

Riadach

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Catalpa said:
Riadach said:
Catalpa said:
Riadach said:
pocleary said:
[quote="Riadach":2y8ubxs9]Anything new?
no,same score as last time,
though one imagines if the Irish had not destroyed the power of the Danes/Norse in 1014, the battles in 1066 for kingship of england may have been different, the Battle of Stanford Bridge I reckon would have gone to the Danes, and perhaps the Normans would have faired differently,
In fairness, some have it that the Irish didn't win at all.
Who said that? :shock:
I think it was an analysis based on Njall's Saga, not so much the Irish lost, but that it was a draw. It was certainly a pyrrhic victory.
Yeah some draw - the Northmen were left floating in Dublin Bay face down. :cool: [/quote:2y8ubxs9]

They gained their inheritance one could say.

Sure they fought well but but they picked a lousy position to fight the battle on - with their backs to the sea.
Indeed, no manoeuvrability there in fairness, though they were probably considering that they were invulnerable to any flanking manoeuvre. They probably adopted a shield wall, which they felt was impenetrable. As the man said, good defensive war, but poor aggressive one. Perhaps they were overconfidant in their abilities, one rout and they would be destroyed. No room for a covered retreat either.
 


William

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How come you all talk about Danes,
didn't most Vikings in Ireland come from Norway + Hebrides(Norse-Gael)?
I know Ivar Boneless was from Denmark, but that seems to be about it.
Bit like saying the Portuguese conquered the Inca Empire.

Just had to ask.
 

Catalpa

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William said:
How come you all talk about Danes,
didn't most Vikings in Ireland come from Norway + Hebrides(Norse-Gael)?
I know Ivar Boneless was from Denmark, but that seems to be about it.
Bit like saying the Portuguese conquered the Inca Empire.

Just had to ask.
Jury is still out on this one though its generally accepted that the first sets of Vikings to raid Ireland circa 795 AD were from Norway – the Northmen, and from the archaeological evidence it is possible to state that they probably originated from the area of Stavanger.

While the early raids were devastating to their victims it was only with the passing of the decades of the early 9th Century that the Vikings established permanent settlements. Some of these developed from small base camps (Long Phorts) into fortified towns like Limerick, Cork, Waterford and Wexford. Their most lasting legacy was of course the founding of Dublin in 841 AD when they wintered over for the first time here instead of sailing for home at the end of campaigning season.

From the Annals of Ulster:

U841.4
There was a naval camp at Linn Duachaill from which the peoples and churches of Tethba were plundered. There was a naval camp at Duiblinn from which the Laigin and the Uí Néill were plundered, both states and churches, as far as Sliab Bladma.

U842.0
Kalends of January
[...]
. AD 841.
U842.1
Muiredach son of Cernach, steward of Ard Macha, dies.
U842.2
The heathens still at Duiblinn.


However by circa 850 AD the ‘Black Heathens’ i.e. the Danes (the Ostmen) started to replace them. These two factions fell out on occasions and thus weakened the overall impact of their forces here. In addition the Danes were heavily involved in Warfare in England and dispatched expeditions from Dublin to increase their hold over the English.

The new arrivals were incorporated into the Viking settlements here, esp Dublin (Dubh Linn - the Black Pool) and Dublin developed under the Vikings into an important commercial centre for the trade in goods between the Irish and the outside world.

It also became a major player in the Slave Trade. For instance in 871 Olaf and Ivar, joint Kings of Dublin, returned to Dublin with 200 shiploads of English, Britons and Pictish prisoners for the Slave market in the City.
 

Catalpa

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Fexbolt said:
Shankill Browser said:
Riadach said:
Anything new?
Only for me cause I didn't know the story.

ie It wasn't an Irish v The Vikings battle

It was an Irish & Vikings v Irish & Vikings battle.

Also didn't know that Boru was/is considered to be Ireland's greatest ever king.
In 1002 Brian Boru of North Munster declard himself King of Ireland. Maolmordha, King of Leinster refused to acknowledge him. The Vikings' who retained the Kingship of Dublin, sided with Maolmordha.

The battle did not drive the Vikings out of Ireland as is the common perception in romantic Irish history. It did put an end to the Viking wars.

Sitric Silkenbeard, the Viking King of Dublin remained in control until 1036 and far from being a pagan ogre was in fact a devout Christian. He founded Christchurch Cathedral and went on pilgrimage to Rome. He ended his days as a monk on the island of Iona.

Brian Boru was married to Gormflaith sister of Maolmordha and mother of King Sitric of Dublin. King Sitric in turn was married to Brian's daughter. Both the Irish and the Vikings practiced bigamy.
And so did the Kings of England - Henry II kept a classy bit on the side called Rosamund Clifford while keeping his wife Queen Eleanor locked up for years. :oops:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosamund_Clifford
 


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