Celebrity gay stuff: is homophobia OK if you have a famous gay friend?


Beachcomber

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A recent situation in the US has raised some awkward issues, including the question: "is homophobia OK if you have a famous gay friend?".

The situation arose after it was announced that Kevin Hart had been chosen to host the upcoming Oscar broadcast. Some people pointed out on social media that Hart had in the past made homophobic statements. In the past Hart has made homophobic remarks in standup comedy routines, in movies, in interviews and in tweets.

Once this all hit social media Hart "stepped down" from being the Oscar host.

However Hart's pal Ellen DeGeneres took to various outlets to defend Hart, saying that he should be given a second chance as he had apologized for his past homophobia remarks. DeGeneres pushed for Hart to be reinstated as Oscar host.

This led to a followup round of reaction on social media of 2 types:
1. people pointed out that Hart had never actually apologized for his past homophobia
2. DeGeneres was accused of double standards as she has in the past condemned at least 1 celebrity who made homophobic statements, with no similar request that the person be forgiven

For his part Hart appeared on DeGeneres's TV show and wallowed in self-pity, saying that he had apologized in the past (even though he hadn't) and didn't see why all of this needed to be brought up again. He even made the usual non-apology by saying that IF anyone was outraged by his past actions he was sorry about that. He just doesn't seem to get it.

He also went on to address those who have brought up his past homophobia again, saying that such people were just waiting to attack him at a point when it would cause him maximum damage.

The whole situation is very odd. Given the times that we live in, why was/is Hart being given a massive pass when it comes to his past behaviour, when other celebrities get hammered, and often lose their careers, for one incident?
 

the secretary

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I am getting fed up listening to the gay lobby.
Can you not just accept that you are the same as everyone else, take a joke from time to time as we all do and just f u c king get on with your lives.
 

Beachcomber

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I am getting fed up listening to the gay lobby.
Can you not just accept that you are the same as everyone else, take a joke from time to time as we all do and just f u c king get on with your lives.

What joke was there when Hart called another person a "fat fag"?

Hart has engaged in homophobic name-calling 100 times in tweets. There was no jokes involved - just infantile name calling.

As for his supposed on stage jokes where is the joke in saying:
"that if his son played with a doll house, he’d “break it over his head & say n my voice ‘stop that’s gay.’ ?
 

Fr Dougal

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#savethegerbils
 

Dame_Enda

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To be fair this was 8-10 years ago though. His homophobia was directed against men rather than lesbians, so perhaps it doesn't hit home as much for Ellen. It would be odd for the liberal Oscars to be represented by someone who has publicly said these things. Then again people can be educated and perhaps those are no longer his views.
 

cricket

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His failure to apologise rather than the sleazy "if anyone was offended" line is telling.
 

Beachcomber

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To be fair this was 8-10 years ago though. His homophobia was directed against men rather than lesbians, so perhaps it doesn't hit home as much for Ellen. It would be odd for the liberal Oscars to be represented by someone who has publicly said these things. Then again people can be educated and perhaps those are no longer his views.
He has been all over the place in terms of apologizing.

Right now his attitude is "poor me".

I don't think he has learned anything, other than to downplay his past.
 

Beachcomber

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His failure to apologise rather than the sleazy "if anyone was offended" line is telling.
He has recently issued both a direct apology, plus various other non-apologies (such as the one I quoted), which results in people not knowing whether he truly is sorry or not.
 

Beachcomber

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To be fair this was 8-10 years ago though. His homophobia was directed against men rather than lesbians, so perhaps it doesn't hit home as much for Ellen. It would be odd for the liberal Oscars to be represented by someone who has publicly said these things. Then again people can be educated and perhaps those are no longer his views.

So you agree with him that it was OK to be homophobic "back then"?

Wise up - 8-10 years isn't that long ago.
 

Sync

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He has recently issued both a direct apology, plus various other non-apologies (such as the one I quoted), which results in people not knowing whether he truly is sorry or not.
Yeah that’s the problem. You can deal with this stuff directly, it happens loads of sports stars who wrote dumb stuff at 17 and it comes out 6 years later.

I’m sorry, I was an immature idiot, I’ve grown up now and recognise the words of a dumb kid. I trust people will judge me for the man I am today, not the boy I used to be.

You say that and this goes away.
 

Beachcomber

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Yeah that’s the problem. You can deal with this stuff directly, it happens loads of sports stars who wrote dumb stuff at 17 and it comes out 6 years later.

I’m sorry, I was an immature idiot, I’ve grown up now and recognise the words of a dumb kid. I trust people will judge me for the man I am today, not the boy I used to be.

You say that and this goes away.

Correct.

Deal with it consistently and people will believe you. Over the years Hart has tried a mix of initially challenging the fact that it was homophobia at all (using the usual excuse of "hey, it's just comedy") to issuing non-apologies.

He's now playing the "why do these haters keep bringing this up?" card. On the basis that only trolls would go after someone for this.

No doubt he will play the race card at some point.
 

Sync

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He's now playing the "why do these haters keep bringing this up?" card. On the basis that only trolls would go after someone for this.
And that's the really objectionable bit to me, it's very similar to what Spacey was doing using his sexuality as an excuse for his ongoing behaviour. They're not trolls, they're not haters, they're judging you for things you said. They're not making stuff up.
 

the secretary

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What joke was there when Hart called another person a "fat fag"?

Hart has engaged in homophobic name-calling 100 times in tweets. There was no jokes involved - just infantile name calling.

As for his supposed on stage jokes where is the joke in saying:
"that if his son played with a doll house, he’d “break it over his head & say n my voice ‘stop that’s gay.’ ?
I have said worse in my day about gays, straights, travellers etc...
Just because he says these out loud doesn't mean that others mightnt be thinking the same thing.
Did people laugh?
Brendan O'Carroll called gays queers in one episode. It was a joke. Big deal.
 

the secretary

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What joke was there when Hart called another person a "fat fag"?

Hart has engaged in homophobic name-calling 100 times in tweets. There was no jokes involved - just infantile name calling.

As for his supposed on stage jokes where is the joke in saying:
"that if his son played with a doll house, he’d “break it over his head & say n my voice ‘stop that’s gay.’ ?
I have said worse in my day about gays, straights, travellers etc... and it was just for a laugh.
You need to accept that people say things, people find things funny, free speech cannot be censored because the gay community doesn't agree with it, people can't be pulled over the coals because of something they said years ago is now deemed offensive that just looks like a group of people are targeting others that don't agree with their point of view and therefore are rightly targets to be taken down.
Just because he says these out loud doesn't mean that others mightnt be thinking the same thing.
Did people laugh?
Brendan O'Carroll called gays queers in one episode. It was a joke. Big deal. He isn't homophobic. He is just poking fun outa it.

Mrs. Browns Boys - BBC One - YouTube
 

O'Sullivan Bere

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I have said worse in my day about gays, straights, travellers etc... and it was just for a laugh.
You need to accept that people say things, people find things funny, free speech cannot be censored because the gay community doesn't agree with it, people can't be pulled over the coals because of something they said years ago is now deemed offensive that just looks like a group of people are targeting others that don't agree with their point of view and therefore are rightly targets to be taken down.
Just because he says these out loud doesn't mean that others mightnt be thinking the same thing.
Did people laugh?
Brendan O'Carroll called gays queers in one episode. It was a joke. Big deal. He isn't homophobic. He is just poking fun outa it.

Mrs. Browns Boys - BBC One - YouTube
I've no time for PC gesture politics. That said, I've likewise no time for a-holes that falsely grievance-monger behind PC accusations because they feel superior and entitled to act the maggot regarding 'others' and cry and decry being held accountable for it.

It's one thing to laugh *with someone* and quite another to laugh *at someone* regarding ethnicity, religion, sexual orientation, etc...context is key.
 

O'Sullivan Bere

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To be fair this was 8-10 years ago though. His homophobia was directed against men rather than lesbians, so perhaps it doesn't hit home as much for Ellen. It would be odd for the liberal Oscars to be represented by someone who has publicly said these things. Then again people can be educated and perhaps those are no longer his views.
Well, let's also note that anti-LGBT men often don't 'count' XXX hot females-only porn, the porn or fantasy or reality of a FMF threesome with themselves the male in the midst, etc. Quite a convenient hypocrisy there.

No argument that LGBT issues have been an evolving issue in recent times. The question is whether or not he's evolved, and he's made the bed he's laying in, pardon the pun.
 

Mercurial

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I am getting fed up listening to the gay lobby.
Can you not just accept that you are the same as everyone else, take a joke from time to time as we all do and just f u c king get on with your lives.
Which comedians have routines about how awful it would be if their son turned out straight?
 

NYCKY

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What joke was there when Hart called another person a "fat fag"?

Hart has engaged in homophobic name-calling 100 times in tweets. There was no jokes involved - just infantile name calling.

As for his supposed on stage jokes where is the joke in saying:
"that if his son played with a doll house, he’d “break it over his head & say n my voice ‘stop that’s gay.’ ?
How long ago were these tweets?
 

Dame_Enda

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So you agree with him that it was OK to be homophobic "back then"?

Wise up - 8-10 years isn't that long ago.
No but the US has a long history of homophobia in some states. Remember during the Bush admin there were referendums in many states banning gay marriage including in liberal Oregon and California. Hart may have been reflecting the times.
 

The OD

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In a world where nobody plays a blind bit of interest in your sexual orientation, its possible that 'jokes' like his would be overlooked - like making fun of blondes or curly haired people or even left handers.

In a world where certain countries will kill you for your orientation, where people go around calling for 'fags' to be burned or hung, protest at their funerals saying they are burning in hell and equate certain orientations with criminal depravity then no, 'jokes' like this cannot be overlooked as they feed into a deeper, darker worldview that needs to be consigned to the litter bin of history.

Flip this one around - how forgiving would someone like Kevin Hart be of people like Michael Richards of Seinfeld fame?

As for 'Ellen', a utterly vacuous moron who seems to think having a successful TV show grants some deeper wisdom beyond the rest of us.

It doesn't and your show is sh1t love.
 
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