Coast Guard helicopter with four crew missing off west coast

Pabilito

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How in the name of God did they not see that rock in front of them. What was the other winchman doing at the time.
The Winch Operator did see it on his night vision FLIR display over half a kilometer away, told the commander that she needed to change course but she ploughed on straight ahead and crashed into it. It really is that simple however seems the optics of it don’t sit well with a lot of people.

What the other Winchman sitting on the opposite side of the helicopter was doing at the time is irrelevant as he had no displays or navigation equipment available to him.
 


buttercookie

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Its also the fact that the Captain was confused as to where she was and in that event thought there was nothing in her way so she would have been travelling fast. The whole incident is completely baffling.

The skipper of the boat has stated he didnt ask for medical evacuation, he rang for medical advice about a thumb injury.

How do you get from a call about medical advice to getting two helicopters out, one manned by a pilot who hadnt been in that area "in donkeys years", is there a rational explanation for this.
 

Pabilito

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Its also the fact that the Captain was confused as to where she was and in that event thought there was nothing in her way so she would have been travelling fast. The whole incident is completely baffling.

The skipper of the boat has stated he didnt ask for medical evacuation, he rang for medical advice about a thumb injury.

How do you get from a call about medical advice to getting two helicopters out, one manned by a pilot who hadnt been in that area "in donkeys years", is there a rational explanation for this.
The reason for the call out is irrelevant. SAR by definition are expected to operate in dangerous conditions and in unplanned circumstances however if a crew member says we’re heading straight for an obstacle and need to turn then the reaction should be to turn immediately. It is that simple.
 

buttercookie

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I dont think the reason for the callout is irrelevant.

You cant have people risking their lives heading from Dublin to the West of Ireland in the middle of winter for no good reason.

There was one person with an injured finger and the person in charge of that boat did not ring to have his staff member airlifted off the boat, it wasnt even a case of the boat coming ashore so the injured person could be met by an ambulance. it seemed to be a fairly minor injury that those on board could have dealt with after receiving advice over the phone. There was some communication issue and that needs to be clarified.

Imagine how the skipper and the person who injured their finger must have felt when they heard the helicopter crashed with the loss of all four on board.

SAR are expected to operate in dangerous conditions and unplanned circumstances but surely they should only be called out where there is a risk of loss of life, they arent a taxi service to the nearest hospital.

It was all so needless.
 

Baron von Biffo

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I dont think the reason for the callout is irrelevant.

You cant have people risking their lives heading from Dublin to the West of Ireland in the middle of winter for no good reason.

There was one person with an injured finger and the person in charge of that boat did not ring to have his staff member airlifted off the boat, it wasnt even a case of the boat coming ashore so the injured person could be met by an ambulance. it seemed to be a fairly minor injury that those on board could have dealt with after receiving advice over the phone. There was some communication issue and that needs to be clarified.

Imagine how the skipper and the person who injured their finger must have felt when they heard the helicopter crashed with the loss of all four on board.

SAR are expected to operate in dangerous conditions and unplanned circumstances but surely they should only be called out where there is a risk of loss of life, they arent a taxi service to the nearest hospital.

It was all so needless.
While it's important, it has no bearing on the crash.
 

buttercookie

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I disagree, its pretty important to make sure that lessons are learnt and in future care is taken to establish exactly what information is being sought when someone dials the emergency service. The skipper did not request an emergency evacuation and while two helicopters were rushing to that ship there could have been a genuine emergency somewhere else where lives were at immediate risk.

Was the helicopter sent out because it was thought the injury was life threatening, was the poor communication down to language difficulties.

The Sunday Times article reported that the pilots had worked sixteen and seventeen hour days and yet they flew that helicopter to a remote part of the West that they werent familiar with. I wouldnt like to be rescued with a sore finger knowing that the pilot of the plane wasnt familar with the area and if the STs article is true she may have worked seventeen hours before picking me up.
 

Sweet Darling

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I disagree, its pretty important to make sure that lessons are learnt and in future care is taken to establish exactly what information is being sought when someone dials the emergency service. The skipper did not request an emergency evacuation and while two helicopters were rushing to that ship there could have been a genuine emergency somewhere else where lives were at immediate risk.

Was the helicopter sent out because it was thought the injury was life threatening, was the poor communication down to language difficulties.

The Sunday Times article reported that the pilots had worked sixteen and seventeen hour days and yet they flew that helicopter to a remote part of the West that they werent familiar with. I wouldnt like to be rescued with a sore finger knowing that the pilot of the plane wasnt familar with the area and if the STs article is true she may have worked seventeen hours before picking me up.
Wonder was the call out taken by the company for commercial reasons?
Do they get paid per call out.
 

fat finger

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I disagree, its pretty important to make sure that lessons are learnt and in future care is taken to establish exactly what information is being sought when someone dials the emergency service. The skipper did not request an emergency evacuation and while two helicopters were rushing to that ship there could have been a genuine emergency somewhere else where lives were at immediate risk.

Was the helicopter sent out because it was thought the injury was life threatening, was the poor communication down to language difficulties.

The Sunday Times article reported that the pilots had worked sixteen and seventeen hour days and yet they flew that helicopter to a remote part of the West that they werent familiar with. I wouldnt like to be rescued with a sore finger knowing that the pilot of the plane wasnt familar with the area and if the STs article is true she may have worked seventeen hours before picking me up.

What about the Working Time Directive? Wouldn't that limit the hours crews have to work? Maybe the sixteen or seventeen hours was more about bunking down in the depot in case of a call out than actually working all those hours.
 

Pabilito

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What about the Working Time Directive? Wouldn't that limit the hours crews have to work? Maybe the sixteen or seventeen hours was more about bunking down in the depot in case of a call out than actually working all those hours.
From what I can see, the four coast guard helicopters spend around 90% of their time on the ground. For example at this moment according to the Marine Traffic App, all four have been on the ground for the last 12 to 15 hours. Presumably the crews are always on duty at the depot but would have adequate rest periods while the aircraft is on the ground.
 

Dedogs

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"One of the rear crew members was monitoring the camera image on his display screen. One pilot was monitoring the radar overlaid on his navigation display. The commander was monitoring another navigation display and the flight instruments."

How in the name of God did they not see that rock in front of them. What was the other winchman doing at the time.

My car has sensors to alert you to bumps on the road and the bumps are inches in height. How would a 20 million euro helicopter not alert the pilot that she was about to fly into a huge rock. I know I will be told I dont know what I am talking about but serously.!!!!!

The Sunday Times has mentioned fatigue, it very much sounds like that was one of the reasons.
the winchman saw it in fairness mate and he told her only she did nothin till itwas too late!!!!
 

Dedogs

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From what I can see, the four coast guard helicopters spend around 90% of their time on the ground. For example at this moment according to the Marine Traffic App, all four have been on the ground for the last 12 to 15 hours. Presumably the crews are always on duty at the depot but would have adequate rest periods while the aircraft is on the ground.
its the pilots job to say if shes too tired to fly id get no hop off of the cops if i said i fell asleep at the wheel pilots should be the same!!!!
 

Dedogs

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The Winch Operator did see it on his night vision FLIR display over half a kilometer away, told the commander that she needed to change course but she ploughed on straight ahead and crashed into it. It really is that simple however seems the optics of it don’t sit well with a lot of people.

What the other Winchman sitting on the opposite side of the helicopter was doing at the time is irrelevant as he had no displays or navigation equipment available to him.
she probably thought he was man splainin to her....
 

Betson

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Hopefully that Air crash investigation series that runs on the National geographic channel do a programme on this crash , they are normally very comprehensive and go to detail of exactly what happened.

It is mostly plane crashed they do but they have covered helicopter crashes as well , they covered the one that crashed in Scotland killing members of the NI security service and they also covered one that crashed while it was taking oil drill workers out to an offshore drilling station.
 


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