Cork .. Spontaneous Combustion Capital of Ireland .. or is it? Happens elsewhere?

robut

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*** I dont want this thread to go off on one about RELIGION or the dark history of this building here, thats for another time. ***

Last night a huge fire consumed the derelict listed building that was St Annes, St Kevins - Our ladys hospital in Cork City on the lee road. It has had a dark past as an Asylum and is known to all in Cork city and its past.

LOCATION: Parallel / opposite to the Carrigrohane / Straight Road where the Cork County hall is ( 17-storey office block ) & the Kingsley Hotel. Over other side of the lee fields and river.

Regardless of history it was a fine building of itself but was left to rot as many others and ended up as many others in Cork City too .. burned to the ground







I dont want this thread to go off on one about RELIGION or the dark history of this building here, thats for another time.

This is not the first iconic building ( regardless of history ) to have been burned down in Cork city, nor probably amywhere else in the country?

Here are a few more in Cork anyway .. others might mention buildings elsewhere in Ireland that get similar treatment:

- Good Shepard Convent
- Vernon mount
- John BarleyCorn
- Sunbeam
- R & H Hall

All fine buildings, some managed by HSE or Council but left neglected. All torched. And could have been developed for housing or as tourist centres ( facing its past, yes ) .. and at least something good coming from bad past.

Blame apportioned to YOUNGSTERS in this most recent case and The good Shepards and Vernon mount ( Cork ). Of course others are more cynical .. plough the field and make way for developers w/o need to care for listed buildings type stuff. Others again fear we have a serial arsonists.

Maybe its in our DNA going back in history? Many fine mansions, estates and buildings were burned down by our own during the civil war .. because they were english buildings. Cut nose off spite ones face? Never thought of future and that these would eventually end up owned by state for tourism etc. Small minded?

So is this burning of Iconic / Derelict / Listed buildings peculiar to Cork OR is it happening across the country?
 
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robut

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Questions now being asked of the city council and THE DERELICT SITES ACT.

Apparently this building was added to a list only last february ..
 

Lumpy Talbot

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Have the fire brigade made any formal announcement as to the cause of the fire? It would seem a bit soon...
 

robut

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Have the fire brigade made any formal announcement as to the cause of the fire? It would seem a bit soon...
Discussing that on 96fm now:

https://www.96fm.ie/player/

Squarely blaming "Youngsters" at the mo. And unaccountable parents. It seems that messages by alledged perps boasting on snapchat were seen.

I suppose, if this is the case, one could also ask were they put up to it by others??
 

Lumpy Talbot

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Suppose it is pointless asking Garda Joe to sharpen his pencil and ask the age-old question 'cui bono?' and start from there.

If they have a wrap they have a wrap. They are a bit like Spielberg that way. It will be interesting for the rest of us to see how fast this site sells now and to whom.
 

'orebel

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Leaving buildings like this lying idle for years is an invitation for trouble.

Btw, there are many people alive who couldn't give a flying fúck about the demise of the building given what used to go on in there.
 

robut

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Suppose it is pointless asking Garda Joe to sharpen his pencil and ask the age-old question 'cui bono?' and start from there.

If they have a wrap they have a wrap. They are a bit like Spielberg that way. It will be interesting for the rest of us to see how fast this site sells now and to whom.
Yip - exactly what happened to the Good shepards convent up by the Old Cork City Gaol in Sundays Well ( which is now a thriving tourist site ). The Good shepards got recently burned down - 2012 I think and is now bought by developers for Student appartments apparently.

Look at the similarities:

[video=youtube;XTb7PDvE_hc]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTb7PDvE_hc[/video]

Good Shepherd Convent purchased | Irish Examiner

A Dundalk firm whose directors are linked to major Northern Ireland and UK developers McAleer & Rushe has emerged as the buyer of the Good Shepherd Convent in Sunday’s Well, above Cork city. Moneda Development was set up earlier this year, and directors include Eamonn Laverty and James Higgins of McAleer & Rushe, who specialise in design and build, asset management, construction and multi-use projects.

The high-profile convent site went to market earlier this year as part of a break up of the €503m Project Clear/Ulster Bank portfolio sell off, which had been acquired by Cairn Homes and Lone Star.
Ah yes .. THE BANKS
 

robut

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Leaving buildings like this lying idle for years is an invitation for trouble.

Btw, there are many people alive who couldn't give a flying fúck about the demise of the building given what used to go on in there.
Indeed OREBEL .. thats coming across on local cork radio also. But as many also say .. it should have been converted for good as the best remedy for that. Also encouraging burning buildings like this is not a good idea? And i am sure who ever did it couldnt give a crap about, nor knew about its history I would imagine?

The old Cork City Gaol had an equally horrific past, maybe even worse the St Kevins but is now a major Cork City tourist site:

https://corkcitygaol.com/

100 or more apts for elderly or others would have worked in St Kevins. The site was surplus to HSE requirements apparently ( 96fm ).

( It was an asylum with a dark past for many up to early 2000's - BUT please lets not go that direction here. Maybe start another thread about that if peeps want )
 
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'orebel

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Indeed OREBEL .. thats coming across on local cork radio also. But as many also say .. it should have been converted for good as the best remedy for that. Also encouraging burning buildings like this is not a good idea? And i am sure who ever did it couldnt give a crap about, nor knew about its history I would imagine?

( It was an asylum with a dark past for many up to early 2000's - BUT please lets not go that direction here. Maybe start another thread about that if peeps want )
Sure. I'm not encouraging it btw. I'm saying the council seem to be encouraging it by allowing these buildings to lie idle with little or no security.
Question: Is it easier to sell a listed building (and therefor the site it sits on) when it's been largely destroyed?
 

robut

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Sure. I'm not encouraging it btw. I'm saying the council seem to be encouraging it by allowing these buildings to lie idle with little or no security.
Question: Is it easier to sell a listed building (and therefor the site it sits on) when it's been largely destroyed?
And that Cynical ( :D ) thought or conclusion is what is coming across from many callers to Cork local radio stations. I think they see a repeat of the Good Shepards Convent fire event / sell off to developers once again ( Listed detail on Good Shepherd fire 2012 on page one here inc video and newspaper article on 2016 sale )
 

flavirostris

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Wow. That is a tragedy. That was a beautiful and historic structure. Dominating the skyline as you drove along the river.
 

robut

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Our countries history of BURNING BUILDINGS:

The destruction of country houses in Ireland was a phenomenon of the Irish revolutionary period (1919–1923), which saw at least 275 country houses deliberately burned down, blown up, or otherwise destroyed by the Irish Republican Army (IRA).

The vast majority of the houses, known in Ireland as Big Houses, belonged to the Anglo-Irish aristocracy of the Protestant Ascendancy, although the houses of some Roman Catholic unionists and/or suspected informers were also targeted. Although the practice by the IRA of destroying country houses began in the Irish War of Independence, most of the buildings were destroyed during the Irish Civil War (1922–23). Today, most of the targeted buildings are in ruins or have been demolished. Some were restored by their owners, albeit often smaller in size, or were later rebuilt and are now used for other purposes.
 

Toland

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Sure. I'm not encouraging it btw. I'm saying the council seem to be encouraging it by allowing these buildings to lie idle with little or no security.
Question: Is it easier to sell a listed building (and therefor the site it sits on) when it's been largely destroyed?
To be honest, I doubt the council has any alternative to allowing these buildings to lie idle. It would be great if they had.
 

robut

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And BTW .. even though this big fire happened in Cork City .. I would like to say that all of us here in Ireland ( regardless of wheter you are from Cork or not ) lose a bit of our history in events like this .. whether the site is good or bad. I think this is sad, as you might get from me here ( :D ) destruction of any of our history in this way angers and saddens me much.

I think every place like this has potential for bad history to be converted to good. We should cherish our history not callously burn it
 

'orebel

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To be honest, I doubt the council has any alternative to allowing these buildings to lie idle. It would be great if they had.
Really?

Can you elaborate?
 


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