Cuts in old age pensions coming down the line

cry freedom

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I notice in the media recently that cuts in old age pensions are being mooted.

As someone who is approaching the old age pension qualifying age, and as someone who has never drawn the dole,and paid my own and my families way all my life, I now wish to inform the powers that be, that if they cut my old age pension without swinging cuts in public service pensions and a major clearing out of all the quangos in this country then I will not be responsible for my actions.
If you really want the balloon to go up just try it.
Just you try it!
I mean can read a book just as well in Mountjoy as at home.
 


johnfás

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If everything else is being cut, why should the old aged pension be immune?

Pensioners are less likely to have dependent children, less likely to have a mortgage and more likely to have other savings. In addition, many are eligible for free medical care, benefit from reduced prices for recreational activities and all are entitled to free transport within the State. In a climate of falling prices, why is it unreasonable to suggest that pensions, as well as all other groups in society, also take a hit?

Personally I find it offensive that such a large group of society thinks that they should be immune.
 

cry freedom

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If everything else is being cut, why should the old aged pension be immune?

Pensioners are less likely to have dependent children, less likely to have a mortgage and more likely to have other savings. In addition, many are eligible for free medical care, benefit from reduced prices for recreational activities and all are entitled to free transport within the State. In a climate of falling prices, why is it unreasonable to suggest that pensions, as well as all other groups in society, also take a hit?

Personally I find it offensive that such a large group of society thinks that they should be immune.
I qualified my opposition. Why don't you address those two points?
 

dotski_w_

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I notice in the media recently that cuts in old age pensions are being mooted.

As someone who is approaching the old age pension qualifying age, and as someone who has never drawn the dole,and paid my own and my families way all my life, I now wish to inform the powers that be, that if they cut my old age pension without swinging cuts in public service pensions and a major clearing out of all the quangos in this country then I will not be responsible for my actions.

ROTFL! Are you going to use that one in court? "But, m'lud, I informed the powers that be on politics.ie under my handle "cry freedom"!!

You are a prize muppet, aren't you?
 
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In all fairness pensions have to be cut.

Its widely excepted that pensioners have less outgoings than families ,and yet families have seen incomes fall.

Why should a person who has worked all their lives and neverdrawn dole now find themselves having to claim the dole and still support their family, pay their debts and yet face dole cuts?, when pensioners have little overheads but continue to receive pensions with no cuts?

I agree the public service should have their pensions hit, But then I dont think Anglos should be bailed out, Cowen paid what he gets, etc. The List of what should happen and what shouldnt is endless, but unless the average Irish person starts to join forces against the government they will continue to do as they please.
 

ballot stuffer

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I notice in the media recently that cuts in old age pensions are being mooted.

As someone who is approaching the old age pension qualifying age, and as someone who has never drawn the dole,and paid my own and my families way all my life, I now wish to inform the powers that be, that if they cut my old age pension without swinging cuts in public service pensions and a major clearing out of all the quangos in this country then I will not be responsible for my actions.
If you really want the balloon to go up just try it.
Just you try it!
I mean can read a book just as well in Mountjoy as at home.
Your generation caused this mess and you expect the younger generation to pay for it.
The net benefactors of this countries crisis are your age group. For the most part it is the younger generation up to their necks in property debt. The bailouts for the bondholders of the banks, the shareholders are in alot of ways bailouts for your pension funds.
 

johnfás

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I qualified my opposition. Why don't you address those two points?
I would fully support public sector pension reform and a review (by which I mean an actual review, rather than a dust gathering one) of quangos. I consider it inequitable that changes to pension arrangements for civil servants, to which they do not pay into a pension fund so have a questionable basis on which to ground a belief of legitimate expectation, are only applicable to those entering the sector at a certain date in the future. It implies a class division between people doing the same job depending on the date in which they were hired - or more specifically, their age - rather than their grade.

On the quangos issue, absolutely, clear them out where they are not needed. Of course one does have to bear in mind that clearing out quangos does have the result of increased unemployment and also the fact that some quangos are necessary. But beyond that, yes, I agree with you.

Now, no exemptions for pensioners simply on the basis that they vote more. That isn't equitable either.
 

cry freedom

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ROTFL! Are you going to use that one in court? "But, m'lud, I informed the powers that be on politics.ie under my handle "cry freedom"!!

You are a prize muppet, aren't you?
You are quite right, dotski, you are quite right!
[I never argue with an idiot]
 

cry freedom

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I would fully support public sector pension reform and a review (by which I mean an actual review, rather than a dust gathering one) of quangos. I consider it inequitable that changes to pension arrangements for civil servants, to which they do not pay into a pension fund so have a questionable basis on which to ground a belief of legitimate expectation, are only applicable to those entering the sector at a certain date in the future. It implies a class division between people doing the same job depending on the date in which they were hired - or more specifically, their age - rather than their grade.

On the quangos issue, absolutely, clear them out where they are not needed. Of course one does have to bear in mind that clearing out quangos does have the result of increased unemployment and also the fact that some quangos are necessary. But beyond that, yes, I agree with you.

Now, no exemptions for pensioners simply on the basis that they vote more. That isn't equitable either.
Probably.
If they do real work and it can be objectively assessed [By someone like Colm McCarthy for instance], then fine.
But if not why should they be on super dole rather than ordinary dole.
What gives them the right to be better paid than other unemployed people
 

ellie08

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I notice in the media recently that cuts in old age pensions are being mooted.

As someone who is approaching the old age pension qualifying age, and as someone who has never drawn the dole,and paid my own and my families way all my life, I now wish to inform the powers that be, that if they cut my old age pension without swinging cuts in public service pensions and a major clearing out of all the quangos in this country then I will not be responsible for my actions.
If you really want the balloon to go up just try it.
Just you try it!
I mean can read a book just as well in Mountjoy as at home.
People like yourself deserve your pension! You paid plenty of tax (which I believe was extremely high in the 80's) and you never cost the state a penny. Remember what happened when the govt moved to remove the medical cards of the older generation? They took the streets and good on them!
 

johnfás

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Probably.
If they do real work and it can be objectively assessed [By someone like Colm McCarthy for instance], then fine.
But if not why should they be on super dole rather than ordinary dole.
What gives them the right to be better paid than other unemployed people
Is your thread about quangos or is it about the old aged pension?

Here is my opinion on quangos:
- Where a function is unnecessarly or duplicated, that function should be cut.
- A function necessarily entails employment.
- If there is a function in another area of the public service which requires additional resources for which that employee can be easily transferred, they should be transferred to that function.
- If it is not the case that my third point can be achieved, that person should lose their job. This should either be to simply cut costs (i.e. a function is no longer necessary) or to free resources in order to employ somebody who is qualified to fulfil the identified and necessary other function.

A simple, and populist, example:

1. HSE Manager who doesn't know what his job is, but qualified to do general administration. Necessary position to be filled in other department which requires administrator. Move him from one to another.

2. HSE Manager who doesn't know what his job is, but qualified to do general administration. Necessary Speech Therapy Positions in the Health Service which require specialised qualifications. Make manager redundant, employ speech therapist.

3. HSE Manager who doesn't know what his job is, but qualified to do general administration. No necessary jobs. Make manager redundant.

It is all very much common sense you see.

Now, if your thread is really about quangos, perhaps you should change the thread title
 

cozzy121

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I’m sorry but many OAP’s along voted bertie & his boys in 3 times!
They must reap what they sow.
 

Aindriu

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The very first thing that needs to be cut is this country is TD's & ministers salaries, followed by the number of TDs.
 

bob3344

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The pension tripled over the course of the boom, now the country is in the toilet so it needs to come down somewhat.

I would agree with cutting the number of tds & getting rid of the seanad also.
 

Cassandra Syndrome

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Why should Pensioners be cut? They worked all their life and paid more than enough PRSI contributions to deserve a fair payback. A lot of pensioners have had their Private pensions wiped out by the same Cabal tht ruined this country. Should we crucify them more?

This reduction sends out the wrong signal for people to save and to prepare for retirement.
 

HarshBuzz

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Why should Pensioners be cut? They worked all their life and paid more than enough PRSI contributions to deserve a fair payback. A lot of pensioners have had their Private pensions wiped out by the same Cabal tht ruined this country. Should we crucify them more?

This reduction sends out the wrong signal for people to save and to prepare for retirement.
there's a very good article in the IT today on this, I think it answers your question quite well.

have a read
 

cozzy121

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I may be the only OAP on this forum and I'm much more than a match for all the mean spirited here! Watch your manners.

We are political direct!
I'm sorry it's not being mean spirited to point out that if OAPs don't share the pain that others have had to then they'll just make the same mistakes again and vote the likes of bertie in again.

Surely lessons must be learned by all, in the wake of berties property bubble?
 

dotski_w_

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The very first thing that needs to be cut is this country is TD's & ministers salaries,
I believe this has already happened.
followed by the number of TDs.
this too - down to 163 already ;)

No problems with those sort of cuts, but anyone who thinks it'll make a noticeable difference to the deficit is a bit deluded.
 


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