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Dev's would-be High King


FloatingVoterTralee

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During the period when De Valera was drafting Bunreacht na hÉireann, he reportedly dallied with the idea of installing Leopoldo O'Donnell, the 6th Duke of Tetouan, as a constitutional monarch, the family having fled Ireland during the Flight of the Earls and occupying the office of Prime Minister of Spain during the 19th century. The pair had previously been in contact in 1922, having attended the Irish Race Conference in Paris, so though the idea seems outlandish, it may not have been completely implausible.
 

Dearghoul

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During the period when De Valera was drafting Bunreacht na hÉireann, he reportedly dallied with the idea of installing Leopoldo O'Donnell, the 6th Duke of Tetouan, as a constitutional monarch, the family having fled Ireland during the Flight of the Earls and occupying the office of Prime Minister of Spain during the 19th century. The pair had previously been in contact in 1922, having attended the Irish Race Conference in Paris, so though the idea seems outlandish, it may not have been completely implausible.
I suppose when it came down to it Dev (being Dev) couldn't countenance a higher power in the land.
Countenacing the arrangement at all raises questions about his grasp of the concept of a Republic.
 

Warrior of Destiny

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During the period when De Valera was drafting Bunreacht na hÉireann, he reportedly dallied with the idea of installing Leopoldo O'Donnell, the 6th Duke of Tetouan, as a constitutional monarch, the family having fled Ireland during the Flight of the Earls and occupying the office of Prime Minister of Spain during the 19th century. The pair had previously been in contact in 1922, having attended the Irish Race Conference in Paris, so though the idea seems outlandish, it may not have been completely implausible.
Sources? Academic journal articles? Who 'reportedly' said it?
 

Marcos the black

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Instead he made himself king..
 

Lempo

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During the period when De Valera was drafting Bunreacht na hÉireann, he reportedly dallied with the idea of installing Leopoldo O'Donnell, the 6th Duke of Tetouan, as a constitutional monarch, the family having fled Ireland during the Flight of the Earls and occupying the office of Prime Minister of Spain during the 19th century. The pair had previously been in contact in 1922, having attended the Irish Race Conference in Paris, so though the idea seems outlandish, it may not have been completely implausible.
Not so outlandish necessarily, at that period. After Finland gained independence from Russia, it was just about done deal in 1918 that Finland would become a constitutional monarchy and the king was already chosen and all talked up of a younger prince from the German House of Hessen. But after Germany lost the war he declined from coming, apparently feeling that a king from country just having lost the Great War would be a bit if a burden for a newborn country.

Germany was not at all surprising choice for a country wishing to alienate itself from Russia as far as possible. Would there have been something to be gained politically from Spain to Ireland so that especially this well-connected Duke would have seemed to be the most tenable option?

A Catholic country of the Armada fame? Silly question. :p
 

PO'Neill

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During the period when De Valera was drafting Bunreacht na hÉireann, he reportedly dallied with the idea of installing Leopoldo O'Donnell, the 6th Duke of Tetouan, as a constitutional monarch, the family having fled Ireland during the Flight of the Earls and occupying the office of Prime Minister of Spain during the 19th century. The pair had previously been in contact in 1922, having attended the Irish Race Conference in Paris, so though the idea seems outlandish, it may not have been completely implausible.
 

Cruimh

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During the period when De Valera was drafting Bunreacht na hÉireann, he reportedly dallied with the idea of installing Leopoldo O'Donnell, the 6th Duke of Tetouan, as a constitutional monarch, the family having fled Ireland during the Flight of the Earls and occupying the office of Prime Minister of Spain during the 19th century. The pair had previously been in contact in 1922, having attended the Irish Race Conference in Paris, so though the idea seems outlandish, it may not have been completely implausible.
reported where? I've read a fair few books on D Va and not seen this mentioned .
 

pippakin

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There is an argument for a monarch as a head of state. I don't like it but there is no denying most monarchies are very popular in their own countries. Its because there is a good argument for it that I doubt Dev even considered it.
 

Dearghoul

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reported where? I've read a fair few books on D Va and not seen this mentioned .
I think this is mentioned in Tim Pat Coogans book about the diaspora; What was Dev's stance toward the 1919 Dail's desire to offer kingship to The O Connor Don?
 

Dearghoul

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No - he was first and foremost a separatist and maintained he was happy to go along with the system of Government chosen by the Irish People.
And of course to ascertain what the Irish people wanted he only had to look into his own heart.

Still.... I'm glad we didn't want a monarchy.
 

Little_Korean

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No - he was first and foremost a separatist and maintained he was happy to go along with the system of Government chosen by the Irish People.
Do you know what date he said this? Because that would seemingly go against his anti-Treaty stance, if I'm not mistaken.
 

Ren84

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During the period when De Valera was drafting Bunreacht na hÉireann, he reportedly dallied with the idea of installing Leopoldo O'Donnell, the 6th Duke of Tetouan, as a constitutional monarch, the family having fled Ireland during the Flight of the Earls and occupying the office of Prime Minister of Spain during the 19th century. The pair had previously been in contact in 1922, having attended the Irish Race Conference in Paris, so though the idea seems outlandish, it may not have been completely implausible.
Heard mentions of this before though I heard he was looking at a few descendants of the old High Kings, and not specifically the O'Donnell chief. Of course this particular bout of madness from Dev was short lived and he instead chose John Charles McQuaid as high king instead.
 

Dearghoul

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Do you know what date he said this? Because that would seemingly go against his anti-Treaty stance, if I'm not mistaken.
That occurred to me but;
Not really if you're of a Jesuitical cast of mind.
If you were primarily a separatist, you could reject any Treaty which fell short of full separation, without invoking the Republic.
 
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Aristodemus

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I cannot comment on the veracity of that story but it has now got to the stage where I am almost ready to believe anything and everything I read and hear about DeValera. The more that is revealed about him, the more he comes across as a mountebank and a charlatan. His baleful influence over this country, and the unfortunate course of its history since he, uniquely amongst the 1916 leaders, avoided execution, points to him being a self-serving, grasping, and rapacious person.
 

Little_Korean

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That occurred to me but
Not really if you're of a Jesuitical cast of mind.
If you were primarily a separatist, you could reject any Treaty which fell short of separatism, without invoking the Republic.
Indeed, you could quibble merrily over anything you cared for in that issue.

I suspect Dev's axe to grind was based on no small measure on the danger of Collins eclipsing him - as he was already threatening to do so - as the man who brought home the bacon to a grateful nation.
 

Cruimh

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Do you know what date he said this? Because that would seemingly go against his anti-Treaty stance, if I'm not mistaken.
It was during the treaty debates

The plain fact is that in his whole attitude to the problem of Anglo-Irish relations, de Valera, from Easter Week up to the present time, has been a Separatist. At no time, as he himself declared during the Treaty debates, has he been a "doctrinaire Republican." If the people of Ireland wanted a Republic, well and good; he would fight for it. But he was committed to no particular form of government; he saw no special virtue in Republicanism. What he did believe in was Separatism; he was determined - with Tone and the Fenians - "to break the connection with England." His reading of history had convinced him that the connection was not only disastrous for Ireland, but morally bad for England; that there would be no lasting peace or friendship between the two countries save on the basis of equal rights and equal nationhood; that to use what the English call an "Irish bull" Britain and Ireland would never come together until they were separated.
De Valera by Mac Manus 1948, page 99


http://archive.org/details/eamondevalera007589mbp
 
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