Did bonds actually go over 8% yesterday?

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I heard a few reports yesterday over bonds going up, hitting and exceeding 8%, but the page we here on Politics.ie seem to consistently referring to is Bloomberg.

GIGB10YR: Ireland 10 Year Summary - Bloomberg

Bloomberg's one-day analysis of GIGB10YR:IND says that the daily-high yesterday was 7.88, which does appear to be an all time high. Bloomberg records the price at close being 7.68.

So, I know for a fact there are some seriously heavy-hitters both reading (and posting) about this stuff - what's the story here, I think it would be helpful for Pie members and the wider Pie audience to get an idea of where this data/info comes from and how it differs from what Bloomberg is showing us.
 


lostexpectation

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On Twitter Brian said:

"REuters is live feed. BBerg is not, at least on the web. "

He uses a Reuters live app it seems

He also earlier said:

"for people wondering why these differ from bberg - im looking at live trade BID prices on reuters. BBerg is midquote and delayed."

also this is on a benchmark bond. The ten year benchmark is the april 2020 bond.

Twitter

so yes
 

Cassandra Syndrome

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I heard a few reports yesterday over bonds going up, hitting and exceeding 8%, but the page we here on Politics.ie seem to consistently referring to is Bloomberg.

GIGB10YR: Ireland 10 Year Summary - Bloomberg

Bloomberg's one-day analysis of GIGB10YR:IND says that the daily-high yesterday was 7.88, which does appear to be an all time high. Bloomberg records the price at close being 7.68.

So, I know for a fact there are some seriously heavy-hitters both reading (and posting) about this stuff - what's the story here, I think it would be helpful for Pie members and the wider Pie audience to get an idea of where this data/info comes from and how it differs from what Bloomberg is showing us.
Here is the list of the bonds traded on the secondary market

Irish Stock Exchange

I think Bloomberg works on averages of volume, distant to maturity and term of bond. I believe the 2020 and the 2024 Bond went over 8% before closing underneath 8%. I am too sure on the exact methodolgy of Bloombergs quote but when you hear it quoted on the news they always use the last bonds to mature hence the higher yield quoted than we see on bloombergs' average.
 

Tea Party Patriot

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They hit 8% for a brief moment.

But its still not a serious figure, the risk free rate is currently 7% in the US. If further uncertainty continues expect them to hit 9% or higher very shortly.
 

jimbo99

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They hit 8% for a brief moment.

But its still not a serious figure, the risk free rate is currently 7% in the US. If further uncertainty continues expect them to hit 9% or higher very shortly.
And will probably continue to 10%, until a GE is called, they do not want to lend any more of their money to this particular government.
 

nuj

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They have, for the first time, crossed 8% this morning. It didn't happen yesterday.

Great as my respect for Brian Lucey is - despite the Anglo deposits thingy - he was plain wrong yesterday. Or maybe he's just prescient?
 

nuj

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Here is the list of the bonds traded on the secondary market

Irish Stock Exchange

I think Bloomberg works on averages of volume, distant to maturity and term of bond. I believe the 2020 and the 2024 Bond went over 8% before closing underneath 8%. I am too sure on the exact methodolgy of Bloombergs quote but when you hear it quoted on the news they always use the last bonds to mature hence the higher yield quoted than we see on bloombergs' average.
They don't. They use the bid yield on the 5% Treasury 2020, as discerned by them from actual market quotes on their own proprietary trading platform.
 

DCon

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CNBC just reported that the Irish 10-year hit 8% for the first time ever today.

Not sure where they get their info though
 

stripey cat

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It's confusing, but I think you are getting the price mixed up with the 8 Euro Bonds that Frank McBrearty says the government are selling.

 

Partizan

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It's confusing, but I think you are getting the price mixed up with the 8 Euro Bonds that Frank McBrearty says the government are selling.

I'll buy some of those €8 bonds and stuff it in the mouth of this Labour gombeen.
 

nuj

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CNBC just reported that the Irish 10-year hit 8% for the first time ever today.

Not sure where they get their info though

Not that it matters, but CNBC are wrong...yields were a lot higher in the 1980s, and the early 90s. But the last time they were above 8% was in early 1996.
 

Tea Party Patriot

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Curious.

How do you arrive at a risk free rat eof 7% in the US?
US risk free rate of return is calculated off the rate of an issued T-bill, currently 7%.

In reality every investment carries a small amount of risk, it is more an accountants / stockbrokers term than actually risk free.
 

myksav

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Not yesterday. It hit 7.88, dropped to 7.85 at close of dealing and opened at 7.95 this morning.

It doesn't actually matter to Ireland what the rate is right now, we're not borrowing. It will matter later on when we will have to borrow but that's future which isn't fixed.

(analogy)
"Did you see the movie last night?" "No." "Ah, you missed it, then." "Nope, I hadn't been wanting to see it so I didn't miss it."
 

weathervane

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US risk free rate of return is calculated off the rate of an issued T-bill, currently 7%.

In reality every investment carries a small amount of risk, it is more an accountants / stockbrokers term than actually risk free.
The yield on 1 year T-Bills is around 0.2% - That's the risk free rate in the US.

wv
 

Tea Party Patriot

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The yield on 1 year T-Bills is around 0.2% - That's the risk free rate in the US.

wv
Your correct, I got that figure from a conversation with a broker earlier who obviously doesn't know his arse from his elbow.
 

Tea Party Patriot

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The yield on 1 year T-Bills is around 0.2% - That's the risk free rate in the US.

wv
November 2010
Date 1 mo 3 mo 6 mo 1 yr 2 yr 3 yr 5 yr 7 yr 10 yr 20 yr 30 yr
11/01/10 0.14 0.13 0.16 0.22 0.34 0.50 1.17 1.90 2.66 3.66 4.01
11/02/10 0.13 0.13 0.16 0.22 0.34 0.51 1.15 1.87 2.63 3.58 3.93
11/03/10 0.13 0.13 0.16 0.22 0.34 0.49 1.11 1.85 2.67 3.71 4.09
11/04/10 0.13 0.13 0.17 0.21 0.33 0.45 1.04 1.73 2.53 3.62 4.04
11/05/10 0.13 0.13 0.16 0.22 0.38 0.51 1.10 1.77 2.58 3.69 4.12
11/08/10 0.12 0.13 0.16 0.22 0.41 0.59 1.13 1.78 2.60 3.70 4.12

U.S. Treasury - Daily Treasury Yield Curve
 

Tea Party Patriot

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Indiansign

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So 10 year bonds are basically unsellable.

What other bonds are there (5yr, 3yr, 3month whatever) and what rates are those at?

For that matter, why is it only the 10yr bond that gets any coverage?
 

olamp

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It's confusing, but I think you are getting the price mixed up with the 8 Euro Bonds that Frank McBrearty says the government are selling.

Couldn`t believe him last night! He mentioned 8 euro bonds at least four times before somebody corrected him! God help the people of Donegal.
 


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