Did outsourcing of cancer testing sentence a woman with cervical cancer to death?

ruman

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Whats your view on alterations a couple of weeks or longer after?

Should it merit a comment from a senior consultant in the event of them reviewing said records?
Will i get an answer to this question !
 


Ardillaun

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Will i get an answer to this question !
Don’t know about the Irish context. In Canada, what is required is that the date and time of the correction are documented and the orginal remains clearly legible in the record. In such circumstances, subsequent readers of the record can make up their own minds about the credibility of the correction.
 
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Noble Guardian

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Don’t know about the Irish context. In Canada, what is required is that the date and time of the correction is documented and the orginal remains clearly legible in the record. In such circumstances, subsequent readers of the record can make up their own minds about the credibility of the correction.
I'd concur with this. Any retrospective notes should be clearly marked as such, along with the context for the addition/amendment (to call it a correction would be presumptuous)
Notes written at such a remove from the original event would likely be seen to be less reliable than those written more contemporaneously.
 

Ardillaun

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Fair enough, sadly doesnt apply over here. I am aware of a few medics who left Ireland under how can i put it " a cloud" to go to Canada. Sordid business.
That has certainly happened - in both directions.
 

Noble Guardian

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Peter McKenna, Clinical Director of the National Women and Infants Health Programme was on the RTE Radio News at one programme. From what he said, it seems that the tests in question were repeat tests on previously negative HPV results which had been carried out with an expired kit, and that women whose tests returned a different (positive) result with the second test were informed directly at the time of the result.
If this is correct, the only women who were not informed were those whose repeat tests were confirmed as being negative for HPV and so did not need any additional treatment at this time.

this would,if correct, imply that this was a "near-miss" event rather than an actual clinical incident. Good, but more due to accident rather than design and so must be remedied.

Some clarifying questions need to be answered;
1) were the women who had the original negative result informed of this at the time, or were those results held pending confirmation?
2) Had those women already received the results of the cytology component of the test, with an explanation of the results and a description of any necessary further steps?

I suspect that this might not have been the case, as the testimony from the person who brought this to light suggested that she only found out about this because when had been chasing here smear test result, so implying that she had not received any test results, either the cytology or the original HPV result. She had told her story in a recording on Morning Ireland this morning, after 8am.
 

BACKTOBASICS

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The lab in Texas should never have been selected by the HSE, it already had a less than great reputation at the time. I understand the RCSI, where smear tests had been sent prior to the introduction of the cervical smear program, tendered but was not successful.
The smear tests should be done in Ireland, creating employment for technicians, laboratories etc - but hey, since when did our governments use logical joined up thinking since they veered to the left - their attitude - outsource and pin any errors on the lab selected - typical.
 

Noble Guardian

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The smear tests should be done in Ireland, creating employment for technicians, laboratories etc - but hey, since when did our governments use logical joined up thinking since they veered to the left - their attitude - outsource and pin any errors on the lab selected - typical.
Classical economics, nearly 200 years old.
 

BACKTOBASICS

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Classical economics, nearly 200 years old.
Yes, that is what it is about - saving money - but at a human cost - humans should not be treated as goods or a commodity, but in the uncaring society we have now - they are.

Not only do they send the samples to the U.S.A. - they send them to the South West Coast, Texas - a big time lag.

The potential cost to human life with any delay is a life and death matter, and cost is a factor, but should not be the sole deciding factor.

But unfortunately, in Ireland, they don't really care, do they?

My wife was put on the expensive new treatment due to stage 4 lung cancer, but she reacted very badly to it, and her whole system got inflamed and she died a week after the first treatment. She was a nurse and died comparatively young.

Doctors and big pharma will either kill you or cure you - they are not God.
 
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ruman

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Yes, that is what it is about - saving money - but at a human cost - humans should not be treated as goods or a commodity, but in the uncaring society we have now - they are.

Not only do they send the samples to the U.S.A. - they send them to the South West Coast, Texas - a big time lag.

The potential cost to human life with any delay is a life and death matter, and cost is a factor, but should not be the sole deciding factor.

But unfortunately, in Ireland, they don't really care, do they?

My wife was put on the expensive new expensive treatment due to stage 4 lung cancer, but she reacted very badly to it, and her whole system got inflamed and she died a week after the first treatment. She was a nurse and died comparatively young.

Doctors and big pharma will either kill you or cure you - they are not God.
Sorry for your loss
 

Ardillaun

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Not only do they send the samples to the U.S.A. - they send them to the South West Coast, Texas - a big time lag.
Transporting the specimens to anywhere in the US should not mean a big time lag. Sending them to Texas rather than, say, NY means just a few more hours.


The potential cost to human life with any delay is a life and death matter, and cost is a factor, but should not be the sole deciding factor.

But unfortunately, in Ireland, they don't really care, do they?
Cost wouldn’t be the only factor. Quality would be another. The US pioneered quality assurance in Pap smears and has strict regulations (CLIA etc.) for all labs performing this test.


My wife was put on the expensive new expensive treatment due to stage 4 lung cancer, but she reacted very badly to it, and her whole system got inflamed and she died a week after the first treatment. She was a nurse and died comparatively young.
Sorry to hear that. A close relative of mine died in the same way with the same cancer in Canada. We decided that going ahead with chemo was the best option and we knew the risks.


Doctors and big pharma will either kill you or cure you - they are not God.
Doctors are not God - they are just doing their best with imperfect tools. Very few set out to do a bad job.
 
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The smear tests should be done in Ireland, creating employment for technicians, laboratories etc - but hey, since when did our governments use logical joined up thinking since they veered to the left - their attitude - outsource and pin any errors on the lab selected - typical.
Doctor Leo, the King of Outsourcing was the person responsible.
 

Noble Guardian

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Doctor Leo, the King of Outsourcing was the person responsible.
How do you figure that? You've got your dates wrong (something your mother might have said...)
 

Noble Guardian

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Many say it, but some don't listen.
 
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How do you figure that? You've got your dates wrong (something your mother might have said...)
July 14 to May 16 is the area of focus.Hard to believe that important smears were sent to south texas/fcuking Honolulu rather than an Irish/uk lab.Leo would outsource his mother for tuppence.
 

redmonite

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Yes, that is what it is about - saving money - but at a human cost - humans should not be treated as goods or a commodity, but in the uncaring society we have now - they are.

Not only do they send the samples to the U.S.A. - they send them to the South West Coast, Texas - a big time lag.

The potential cost to human life with any delay is a life and death matter, and cost is a factor, but should not be the sole deciding factor.

But unfortunately, in Ireland, they don't really care, do they?

My wife was put on the expensive new treatment due to stage 4 lung cancer, but she reacted very badly to it, and her whole system got inflamed and she died a week after the first treatment. She was a nurse and died comparatively young.

Doctors and big pharma will either kill you or cure you - they are not God.
Yes, let the hse directly do the tests, they never make mistakes!
 

BACKTOBASICS

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Yes, let the hse directly do the tests, they never make mistakes!
The obvious thing to do is set up our own cancer testing lab - resource and man it with competent people - what is wrong with that - Sending the samples to America seems like making out that Irish technicians are inferior - an inferiority complex which has the potential to cost Irish lives, as every day counts with cancer diagnosis.

And don't talk about the HSE - a top-heavy management conglomerate.
 


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