Did Russia assassinate Poland's leadership in the 2010 airplane 'crash' ?

cyberianpan

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Vasily Blokhin, chief executioner for the Soviet NKVD personally executed about 7,000 Polish officers & elite in the 1940 Katyn Massacre:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katyn_massacre

He used a handgun, up close and personal

Poland lost its top leadership again in 2010, when they were en route to the Katyn memorial
New Evidence Shows Russia Played a Role in Plane Crash That Killed Poland’s Top Brass
Among the dead were President Lech Kaczyński and his wife, much of the president’s staff, 18 parliamentarians, 10 generals and admirals representing Poland’s top military leadership, and many other political notables. The disaster decapitated Warsaw.

To make matters even more painful, President Kaczyński and his entourage died en route to a commemoration at Katyń, the forest in western Russia where, in the spring of 1940, Stalin’s secret police murdered 22,000 Polish military officers
The plane crashed over Russian territory, and Poland got little or no access to the crash site
This February, he dismissed the official verdict of the Russian and Polish inquiries as a politically convenient fantasy, stating, “There is no doubt there were explosions on board before the aircraft hit the ground.” In a subsequent interview, Taylor explained, “There is strong evidence that a few seconds later the door on the left side of the fuselage, just forward of the wing, was blown out and driven hard into the ground by another explosion in the fuselage. He added that the Kremlin investigation was a fraud:
This requires some explaining

Dec 2017 - Vladimir Putin was responsible for plane crash that killed Polish President Lech Kaczynski, says Polish defence minister

How should this be investigated further ?

Cyp
 


Fritzbox

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Vasily Blokhin, chief executioner for the Soviet NKVD personally executed about 7,000 Polish officers & elite in the 1940 Katyn Massacre:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katyn_massacre

He used a handgun, up close and personal

Poland lost its top leadership again in 2010, when they were en route to the Katyn memorial
New Evidence Shows Russia Played a Role in Plane Crash That Killed Poland’s Top Brass


The plane crashed over Russian territory, and Poland got little or no access to the crash site


This requires some explaining

Dec 2017 - Vladimir Putin was responsible for plane crash that killed Polish President Lech Kaczynski, says Polish defence minister

How should this be investigated further ?

Cyp
Or maybe we can just accept that Polish pilots fly their planes in the same way Polish drivers drive their cars?
Has the Polish defence minister provided any evidence to back up his accusation?
 

cyberianpan

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Or maybe we can just accept that Polish pilots fly their planes in the same way Polish drivers drive their cars?
Has the Polish defence minister provided any evidence to back up his accusation?
Russia frustrated any investigation...FSB saturated the site, read the first article

The first article I posted has material from an independent aviation expert

Cyp
 

Analyzer

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No. The Kremlin did not assassinate the Polish leadership in 2010.

But....I wonder sometimes at who did.....
 

Analyzer

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If the answer to the question is yes.....then we are "safe".

We don' have a leadership running this country. We just have a rubberstamp that function as a political garrison for the nEU empire.
 

Fritzbox

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Russia frustrated any investigation...FSB saturated the site, read the first article

The first article I posted has material from an independent aviation expert

Cyp
Did this 'independent aviation expert' provide evidence to back up claims about an explosion - did he carry out tests on the airframe wreckage?

Here's the wreckage:
 

gleeful

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Vasily Blokhin, chief executioner for the Soviet NKVD personally executed about 7,000 Polish officers & elite in the 1940 Katyn Massacre:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katyn_massacre

He used a handgun, up close and personal

Poland lost its top leadership again in 2010, when they were en route to the Katyn memorial
New Evidence Shows Russia Played a Role in Plane Crash That Killed Poland’s Top Brass


The plane crashed over Russian territory, and Poland got little or no access to the crash site


This requires some explaining

Dec 2017 - Vladimir Putin was responsible for plane crash that killed Polish President Lech Kaczynski, says Polish defence minister

How should this be investigated further ?

Cyp
If the Russians were going to kill the Polish leadership would they really do it on their own land?

On the flip side, if the Poles wanted to distract their public from their own safety failings, would they blame Russia for it?
 

cyberianpan

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I did - nothing convincing was to be read.
The aviation expert is independent, and renowned, he says the the photos are not commensurate with the Russian explanation

The Poles were given limited site access, and the wreckage has still to be repatriated

To my mind this mandates an independent investigation with full access to wreckage, crash site, radar logs etc

Cyp
 

parentheses

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Right-wing Poles would have other enemies besides Russia. For example, the EU leadership, the Clinton wing of the Democratic party and the John McCain wing of the Republicans. Not to mention Poland's sometimes tense relationship with Israel
 

ffc

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Wasn't this an accident in extremely bad weather, where the pilots were put under severe pressure not to abort the landing by the Chief of the Polish Air Force standing behind them in the cockpit, virtually ordering them to land, despite their obvious concerns?
 

Fritzbox

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Wasn't this an accident in extremely bad weather, where the pilots were put under severe pressure not to abort the landing by the Chief of the Polish Air Force standing behind them in the cockpit, virtually ordering them to land, despite their obvious concerns?
It was. Pilot error - the cause of the majority of aircraft accidents around the world - nothing to see here.
 

Roisin3

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Russia frustrated any investigation...FSB saturated the site, read the first article

The first article I posted has material from an independent aviation expert

Cyp
Schindler’s article doesn’t prove anything. The former Lockerbie investigator didn’t examine the wreckage or the site.

Besides why wait for it to come in to land and then detonate multiple bombs inside the fuselage only yards from the runway?

The pilot came in just short of the runway in trees and the plane flipped.

Pure conspiracy theory, imo, which is why Schindler keeps mentioning conspiracy theory in his article. He’s always looking to blame Russia for anything.
 

Outlaw103

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:lol:

I was going to make a comment about it being quiet a coincidence that an NSA operative writes an article based on an assertion by a British intelligence agent blaming Russia for a plane crash 7 years ago in this environment.

I won't even bother. He doesn't even trust the intelligence of his reader to join the dots themselves so makes an explicit reference to Novichok in Salisbury.:lol: He actually thinks his readers are stupider than I think they are!!

I suppose when the UK "Free Press" are involved in voluntary gag orders which regulates what they are allowed write about they have to find some toxic propaganda to pump out.

In the latest edition of the war mongers agenda we have the Polish Government, staunch allies of the Russians, actively helping cover up that Putin killed their President.

Classic. :lol:
 

Dame_Enda

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I think this is possible. The fact he was on his way to the Katyn commemoration is significant, and Russian nationalists were not happy about Putin commemorating it. Poland and Russia have despised each other for centuries.

On the other hand, a technical fault is also possible. What doesnt help matters is the Putin regimes obsession with secrecy, which makes getting to the truth difficult. The same problem happened at the Moscow theatre siege, when they refused to tell the hospital the name of the gas they used.
 

GDPR

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I have always thought this was pilot error combined with sloppy Russian control tower procedures, but not in any way intentional or orchestrated.

The fact of the matter is that Law and Justice, the weird Polish rightwing nationalist party, used the fact that Russia refused to co-operate with the investigation to accuse the then Polish PM, Donald Tusk, of helping the Russians to conceal vital evidence.

Now the reality is that Law and Justice far from being patriots who are determined to resist Russian influence have been useful tools of the Kremlin. Their policy of antagonising the EU, getting into pointless rows with Ukraine, suspending the rule of law in the courts, and cracking down on free media suits Putin down to the ground.

He would be more than happy to create the impression that there was a Russian plot to down the Smolensk, if it helps Law and Justice to go on isolating POland within the EU petunia
 

Levellers

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Wasn't this an accident in extremely bad weather, where the pilots were put under severe pressure not to abort the landing by the Chief of the Polish Air Force standing behind them in the cockpit, virtually ordering them to land, despite their obvious concerns?
The pilot didn't want to land due to bad weather but was ordered to by some top brass.
 


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