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Cahal

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Were some of the letters written by Paul not actually written by other people.
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
Were some of the letters written by Paul not actually written by other people.
Prince, I should imagine. Prolific little bugger.
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
One of those weird little effects of a story being part of the cultural wallpaper is that hardly anyone ever asks how Mr Jesus managed to find four lads called 'Matthew', 'Mark', 'Luke' and 'John' in Judea two thousand years ago.

Otherwise the bible is full of Baphomets and Shepshebahs and what have you.

Think about it for a bit... it is almost as if the story was anglified at some point. 'Peter'. 'Saul that is called 'Paul' and so on.

It is almost as weird as being in Egypt and hearing some fellow in Cairo shouting 'hey Spot come back here' after his dog.

A bit strange, no?
 

Old Mr Grouser

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And if so why?

Personally I prefer the Gospel of St John and the Pauline Epistles; I will explain why later.
You can't pick and choose, ReF.

The whole Bible,starting at Genesis, is the Inspired Word of God.

"For if you believed Moses, you would believe me; for he wrote of me. But if you do not believe his writings, how will you believe my words?” (John 5:46-47 ESV)


 

Old Mr Grouser

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... St.John is too complicated for me:oops:
Alas! And I'd always thought of you as someone old enough to have recovered from effects of an Irish education.

John is clear enough if you go to an online English translation, say John 1 - ESVBible.org , and then 'copy and paste' it into a new Word document using a size and style of script that you find easy to read.

You can then start 'breaking it up' into readable chunks; and you'll make it even more readable if you use different colours and highlighters.
 

gerhard dengler

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Alas! And I'd always thought of you as someone old enough to have recovered from effects of an Irish education.

John is clear enough if you go to an online English translation, say John 1 - ESVBible.org , and then 'copy and paste' it into a new Word document using a size and style of script that you find easy to read.

You can then start 'breaking it up' into readable chunks; and you'll make it even more readable if you use different colours and highlighters.
Thanks.

I find Father Haydock's 1859 Bible commentary a must for St.John's gospel.
 

Old Mr Grouser

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... Personally I prefer the Gospel of St John and the Pauline Epistles ...
Here's a new video, just out, with Andrew Gemmill who explains why he believes that Paul's second letter to Timothy is not written as advice to a young evangelist; it's written to a mature experienced gospel-preacher who's showing signs of 'burn-out', and in danger of 'going off-message'.


 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
Bit strange though with all these letters to the Philistines and the Samartarians and the Evertonians by Messrs Paul, John, whassname and Luke that there is a distinct lack of the mundane involved.

Straight into a lecture on what 'god' really meant by something allegedly said by Mr jesus and nary a 'Hello and how's the missus. The weather here is grand. Is it raining where you are?' and things like 'If you are ever passing Herterich's in the main street could you stop off and buy us a couple of black puddings if it isn't too much trouble thanks very much.'

They just don't sound like genuine letters. More like people pretending not to notice there is a microphone in the flower arrangements and having a sort of fake sounding conversation while they wonder which one of them should smack it with their coffee cup.

Not one enquiry after the football scores even.
 
D

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One of those weird little effects of a story being part of the cultural wallpaper is that hardly anyone ever asks how Mr Jesus managed to find four lads called 'Matthew', 'Mark', 'Luke' and 'John' in Judea two thousand years ago.

Otherwise the bible is full of Baphomets and Shepshebahs and what have you.

Think about it for a bit... it is almost as if the story was anglified at some point. 'Peter'. 'Saul that is called 'Paul' and so on.

It is almost as weird as being in Egypt and hearing some fellow in Cairo shouting 'hey Spot come back here' after his dog.

A bit strange, no?
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
True though. All these early bishops firin' off letters to all and sundry proposing to interpret what Mr god actually meant.

I suppose it was money in the pocket for the ancient post-office what with the stamps and the price of scrolls at the time you'd have been laughing if you'd had a stationery shop nearby and doing a roaring trade in stamps and the ink and styluses and so on.

Very pompous letters too. Like they were all vying to be seen as Mr god's senior civil servant or Secretary General in the Department of What An Unclear god Might Really Have Meant.

Myself I've a notion that they were very publicly making it all up between them. But sure that wouldn't have mattered much to the early Roman postal service.

Anyways. Where were we all before yiz distracted me with your meanderings.
 

Old Mr Grouser

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Were some of the letters written by Paul not actually written by other people.
That's a fair question, Cahal.

Here's a lecture by Jon Lanier, a Christian Bible-preacher, where he considers the issues involved -




PS. Just to be clear, Jon Lanier, who lives in Texas USA, is a Bible-preacher but he earns living as a lawyer - http://lanierlawfirm.com/attorneys
 

IvoShandor

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yes
Sounds like a good name for a band. How about 'John and the Synoptics'?
 

Lumpy Talbot

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Sure don't practising lawyers and preachers have pretty much the same skill-set... making the implausible sound possible.

Both of those professions get paid for it too. It wouldn't actually be possible to argue authenticity for the letters of Paul unless you had analysed them for his known handwriting and that would imply you had a copy of his letters written out in his verified handwriting.

It still wouldn't 'authenticate' the contents as being true either.
 

Socratus O' Pericles

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Matthew, Mark, Luke and John went to bed with their trousers on.......


When I was in college there wasa band called Melanie Klein and the Defence Mechanisms.


That was soooooo clever.
 

ergo2

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True though. All these early bishops firin' off letters to all and sundry proposing to interpret what Mr god actually meant.

I suppose it was money in the pocket for the ancient post-office what with the stamps and the price of scrolls at the time you'd have been laughing if you'd had a stationery shop nearby and doing a roaring trade in stamps and the ink and styluses and so on.

Very pompous letters too. Like they were all vying to be seen as Mr god's senior civil servant or Secretary General in the Department of What An Unclear god Might Really Have Meant.

Myself I've a notion that they were very publicly making it all up between them. But sure that wouldn't have mattered much to the early Roman postal service.

Anyways. Where were we all before yiz distracted me with your meanderings.
Pls leave the Philatelists out of this. Afaik Paul never wrote to them
 

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