Does Varadkar have the balls to stand up to the EU?

owedtojoy

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Doing what they have always done but without being shackled to the lowest growth block in the world would be a start.....

Removal of tariffs on imported goods driving up the purchasing power of the lowest 50% income bracket and thus domestic demand (they don't tend to save so much),

Getting rid of a ton of regulation and a whole tranche of bureaucracy (efficiency).

Not forcing the poor to waste a large % of their money on over priced low value foods and basic consumer goods thus driving domestic demand, improving BofP and generally making poor people's lives better.

Not paying for an INTERnational health service.

A selective immigration system like the US, Canada and Aus so they get the best and the brightest (yeah I know we have the lottery but that is a small %)

Not paying for a EU Army (Although the comedy value might be worth it).

Investing 12B a year in something that actually generates a return ie education or infrastructure. Lets do some math, a hospital cost maybe $1B, so after 5 years nearly every county in the UK could have had a new hospital, not mentioning the construction industry spin offs, second 5 years could be schools - 200M$ each so that's 5 per county (ish). 3rd 5 years, rail up grades would be three cross rail size projects. Thats 15 years of mass construction / investment all "paid for already so no tax hike). All require steel, labor, trucks, talent.............

Personally id take a bunch of that money and invest it in O&G extraction, from what I read they are sitting on 100s of years of shale, they already have connectors to Europe, Europe can by its gas off the Russians, the Arabs, The US or the Brits. Shale is cheap, make your choice.

Investing 39B in the same (contentious but true)

Investing the money they do charge on the tariffs they decide to keep in the same rather than sending the revenue to Brussels...

Lowering the CT rate to that of ROI which seems to work for Ire'.

Lowering the CT rate to a point that undercuts the EU by enough to offset any EU tariff charges.

Not having to manufacture to CE standards when the destination country doesn't need, require it or want.

Creating free ports and special economic zones (allowed under WTO), in fact NI could be a special economic zone with nominal CT of 5% for e.g. to compensate for the farm problems.

Sell processed fish products to the far east would be another good idea and they are certainly going to be swimming in fish - pardon the pun ;-)

There are other perfectly good revenue raisers like taxing foreign commercial vehicles (I have seen ques of eastern European lorries there that pay no road taxes or fees. Additionally in the US / Canada we also keep an eye on truckers cross border fuel loading - another tax dodge!

...few ideas there buddy blue.
BBC Report last night.

The British plan for Brexit was to cut and paste all the trade deals the EU made when Britain was a member, insert "UK" instead of "EU", and expect the other country to sign up straight away.

It is not working out that way - other countries, even Commonwealth countries, are reading the fine print and asserting their own interests. Very few have accepted a "rollover" deal = Canada refused point blank.

Because Britain may be a large economy, but it is not as large as the EU economy. The EU has much more clout.

So "Global Britain" is going to be smaller and poorer than "European Britain", a lot more so in the short term, but with a longer term recovery that will still not regain the pre-Brexit UK.

 


AhNowStop

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Doing what they have always done but without being shackled to the lowest growth block in the world would be a start.....
"Shackled" :ROFLMAO:😂

Dont forget its also the largest economic block in the world .... when you're at the top of the heap growth is obviously going to be slower..

You sound as if you'd be happier trading with some third world country with £1 GDP with 300% growth than with the EU with its massive £GDP but low growth ...

you do realise that doesnt make sense dont you ?


Removal of tariffs on imported goods driving up the purchasing power of the lowest 50% income bracket and thus domestic demand (they don't tend to save so much),
Domestic producers can all go to fuk then yeah .. bye bye farming for a start
and bye bye food hygene etc.. and hello hormones, chlorene, GM etc....

and we wont even be able to label the sh1te products differently than home produce ..

is that what you want?


Getting rid of a ton of regulation and a whole tranche of bureaucracy (efficiency).
Name three you would be desperate to see removed?


Not forcing the poor to waste a large % of their money on over priced low value foods and basic consumer goods thus driving domestic demand, improving BofP and generally making poor people's lives better.
again, as per above .. ruin the domestic manufacturing & farming base ..... paying people a decent wage would be a better thing to do here but the Brexiteers dont want that .. thats just another reason they want out .. i.e. so they can do away withe the labour laws... Not good.


Not paying for an INTERnational health service.

A selective immigration system like the US, Canada and Aus so they get the best and the brightest (yeah I know we have the lottery but that is a small %)
If brexit goes ahead one of the main bartering points in any future trade deal with "any" country will be is visa access ... so instead of your Europenas that you obviously love so much, you'll be getting Chinese, Indian, Pakistan, South Americans etc.. etc.. etc.....

will you be happier with that ?


btw there may be no NHS if the US get their way ... but maybe you would like that too


Not paying for a EU Army (Although the comedy value might be worth it).
LMFAO .. do you pay for one now ?

BTW it was hilarious to see the Brits run asking the EU for help in the Iranian issue .. so a joint Army = Bad .. but joint Navy = great .. what gobsh1tes they are


Investing 12B a year in something that actually generates a return ie education or infrastructure. Lets do some math, a hospital cost maybe $1B, so after 5 years nearly every county in the UK could have had a new hospital, not mentioning the construction industry spin offs, second 5 years could be schools - 200M$ each so that's 5 per county (ish). 3rd 5 years, rail up grades would be three cross rail size projects. Thats 15 years of mass construction / investment all "paid for already so no tax hike). All require steel, labor, trucks, talent.............

Personally id take a bunch of that money and invest it in O&G extraction, from what I read they are sitting on 100s of years of shale, they already have connectors to Europe, Europe can by its gas off the Russians, the Arabs, The US or the Brits. Shale is cheap, make your choice.


Investing 39B in the same (contentious but true)

Investing the money they do charge on the tariffs they decide to keep in the same rather than sending the revenue to Brussels...
Its not a wasted €12b .. its to help the entire block and comes back re business etc.... i.e. all boats rise etc....

and the €39b has to be paid ... its for "ongoing" commitments and who is going to trust the UK in a trade deal if they dont pay their bills . .. mind you who the feck would trust them anyway after this clusterfuk



Lowering the CT rate to that of ROI which seems to work for Ire'.

Lowering the CT rate to a point that undercuts the EU by enough to offset any EU tariff charges.
[/QUOTE]

Hmmmm if it was that simple everyone would be at it ...


Not having to manufacture to CE standards when the destination country doesn't need, require it or want.
:rolleyes:
lowering standards in NOT the way to go .. among other things, maintaining them means business can switch supply immediately on request ..
;)


Creating free ports and special economic zones (allowed under WTO), in fact NI could be a special economic zone with nominal CT of 5% for e.g. to compensate for the farm problems.

Sell processed fish products to the far east would be another good idea and they are certainly going to be swimming in fish - pardon the pun ;-)
You dont need to leave the EU to create free ports

Sell processed fish? :rolleyes: .. deadly money spinner there ..ffs


There are other perfectly good revenue raisers like taxing foreign commercial vehicles (I have seen ques of eastern European lorries there that pay no road taxes or fees. Additionally in the US / Canada we also keep an eye on truckers cross border fuel loading - another tax dodge!

...few ideas there buddy blue.
well we'll all get rich on that last one for sure eh :rolleyes:


anyway, the crux of the matter is why would any country give the UK a better deal than they give the EU which is 8 times bigger ? .. why ?

and what do you think the EU would do if a country did that ?

Like all Brexiteers, you either have an ulterior motive or you simply havent thought this through ole bean



edit - but the main reason this all started was to preserve peace in the EU ... that should not be forgotten
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
I hear the African Union is open to new members. Might be a bit far from the equator but it could probably be towed toward Tunisia.
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
'Consternation in Tunbridge Wells' doesn't have the same ring as Panic in Detroit, mind...
 

puffin

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I find it richly ironic where various people in Ireland were laughing at the British ''breathtaking ignorance'' in their understanding of the EU, and what the only two outcomes of Brexit were going to be. Now it seems the same thing is happening here.

If, and I stress if, there is a hard Brexit, then Ireland is obliged to protect the Single Market and the Customs Union by inspecting and taxing goods and services (with the possible exception of people) that come over the border. This will mean putting infrastructure in place and customs/Gardai officers to police them.

This will likely mean the border will be divided between commercial and domestic crossing points. There is no negotiation on this. There is no bilateral options available on this.

Leaving, or threatening to leave the EU is also not an option, unless you want to join the UK and trash our economy.

However, by remaining in the EU and manning their only land border with a third country, the EU will ensure any and all funding required to keep our economy upright, whatever additional infrastructure is required, whatever new markets are needed, and whatever East-West routes need to be accomplished, will be provided to Ireland without much strings attached.*

Because the EU wants the 27 and those outside the EU to see what happens to countries and their economies when they leave the EU, and what happens to countries and economies when they remain. Thus, they prevent the break-up of the EU.

*maybe a new discussion on our corporate tax strategy and taxing of profit centres.
A lot of good public sector jobs with pensions attached in the revenue service.
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
Why should the Irish Government consider itself bound by treaty or legal agreement when the scenario would be that both London and Brussels could be accused of tearing up exactly that?

Varadkar should (not publicly) make it clear that we will not be bound by demands from any neighbouring country which has just torn up a legal agreement signed in conjunction with the Irish Government.

The international response to any attack on GFA terms and agreements would be considerable on both London and any wobble in Brussels on that. And Varadkar should quietly let it be known that this would be facilitated by the Irish Government in such circs.

Might not be a bad idea to get Varadkar on a plane to Washington either, to meet senior policymakers there at the State Dept.

The US is heavily invested in the GFA and we should use that.
 

owedtojoy

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Why should the Irish Government consider itself bound by treaty or legal agreement when the scenario would be that both London and Brussels could be accused of tearing up exactly that?

Varadkar should (not publicly) make it clear that we will not be bound by demands from any neighbouring country which has just torn up a legal agreement signed in conjunction with the Irish Government.

The international response to any attack on GFA terms and agreements would be considerable on both London and any wobble in Brussels on that. And Varadkar should quietly let it be known that this would be facilitated by the Irish Government in such circs.

Might not be a bad idea to get Varadkar on a plane to Washington either, to meet senior policymakers there at the State Dept.

The US is heavily invested in the GFA and we should use that.
Nancy Pelosi has announced that any Trade Deal endangering the GFA will be nixed in Congress.

 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
Great stuff. There's no way the yanks will allow Downing Street and the Dandelion to rip up an agreement they put a hell of a lot of work into.
 

redneck

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It is almost nailed on that Boris Johnson and Donald Trump will do a trade deal, that will tie the UK to the USA.
Unless there is a second referendum, if no deal in November, expect a second referendum, which Remain will win.
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
Johnson will be the White House poodle, same as every PM since Anthony Eden. This is an area in which Downing Street has no other option.
 

Dame_Enda

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I think self preservation has to be the order of the day if they mean it about a No-Deal Brexit. The government should have contingency plans in place to limit the economic damage. I haven't seen any sign of this. A few days ago I read only 10% of Irish businesses have contingency plans. We shouldn't have to be kamikazes for the Imperial Cult of the EU.
 

shiel

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I think self preservation has to be the order of the day if they mean it about a No-Deal Brexit. The government should have contingency plans in place to limit the economic damage. I haven't seen any sign of this. A few days ago I read only 10% of Irish businesses have contingency plans. We shouldn't have to be kamikazes for the Imperial Cult of the EU.
I know.

The Irish were blamed for the famine in the London media of the time.

AT present the Brexiteers declare economic war.

The London narrative is that it is all the fault of incompetent Paddy.

When the shit hits the fan both London and it looks like on this occasion the Dublin media will spout the 'Paddy is to blame' mantra.
 

belcoo666

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BBC Report last night.

The British plan for Brexit was to cut and paste all the trade deals the EU made when Britain was a member, insert "UK" instead of "EU", and expect the other country to sign up straight away.

It is not working out that way - other countries, even Commonwealth countries, are reading the fine print and asserting their own interests. Very few have accepted a "rollover" deal = Canada refused point blank.

Because Britain may be a large economy, but it is not as large as the EU economy. The EU has much more clout.

So "Global Britain" is going to be smaller and poorer than "European Britain", a lot more so in the short term, but with a longer term recovery that will still not regain the pre-Brexit UK.

but, but , but they want their empire back ? 😢

We need to beef up our navy so that the boatloads of starving pom refugees can be detected and returned to merry Engeland
 

belcoo666

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I think self preservation has to be the order of the day if they mean it about a No-Deal Brexit. The government should have contingency plans in place to limit the economic damage. I haven't seen any sign of this. A few days ago I read only 10% of Irish businesses have contingency plans. We shouldn't have to be kamikazes for the Imperial Cult of the EU.
We should known our history and have made sure that we had far less dependence on the British economy and the English scum class that run it . We should have created direct access to Europe either via tunnel or proper provision of direct shipping decades ago .
 

IntergalaticHam

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With direct access, how are the two brexit busting ferries doing ? How many lorries have bypassed the landbridge so far because of them, anyone in the know ?

They should be running at full capacity now surely to show we are not reliant and can bypass UK and go direct to EU.
 

Talk Back

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With direct access, how are the two brexit busting ferries doing ? How many lorries have bypassed the landbridge so far because of them, anyone in the know ?

They should be running at full capacity now surely to show we are not reliant and can bypass UK and go direct to EU.
I think a lot of the hauliers pick up goods in Britain for Ireland on the return trip from the continent.

That's not going to happen once Britain crashes out - goods to and from Ireland will come directly from the continent then for obvious reasons.
 

Talk Back

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Even if the UK crash out of the EU, there will be no new trade deal with the EU and the USA until the three issues of the 'Withdrawal Agreement' are addressed - namely money owed, people's rights, and the partition of Ireland.

So - no hard British border through Ireland means a de-facto border between Ireland as a whole and Britain, where it belongs, back in the Irish Sea.

We Irish really have the brits over a barrel.

 

Mickeymac

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Even if the UK crash out of the EU, there will be no new trade deal with the EU and the USA until the three issues of the 'Withdrawal Agreement' are addressed - namely money owed, people's rights, and the partition of Ireland.

So - no hard British border through Ireland means a de-facto border between Ireland as a whole and Britain, where it belongs, back in the Irish Sea.

We Irish really have the brits over a barrel.


Most sane and sensible experts have been drumming that info to the Brits for 3 years.
 


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