Dropping of compulsory status of History and Geography in the new Junior Cert.

Disillusioned democrat

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I'd have no problem dropping history as long as there is a clear rule that says anyone who doesn't do history must never be allowed vote ever again.

It seems like a recipe for disaster to try to bury our past.
 


wombat

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It seems like a recipe for disaster to try to bury our past.
Compulsory is the wrong word, you can fail history and still get a cert, it was only Irish which was really compulsory. I must admit that I hated history and was delight to drop it after Inter cert, Geography, on the other hand, I found fascinating and kept it for the Leaving. I'm sure history could have been made more interesting but it was the wars of Louis 14th that wrecked my head. Interestingly, I read a lot of history, I just don't have to memorise dates when doing so.:)
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
Never seen any indication that Irish voting patterns are informed by history. Much more evidence that your voting preferences are determined by which house in the village you were born in.

Perhaps a history-amnesty should be declared- where everyone who feels any link to historical events agrees to just forget it.

History is mostly incorrect anyway as it is tied to dates and the dynamics which throw up such dates are much more interesting and don't fit into the TedTalk view of history.
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
Introduction to history classes for the teenager; 'History is an arranged timeline of events agreed by people who weren't there.'
 

Lumpy Talbot

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Example. Modern Irish history will hardly feature the filth of the church and its orders until current generations are dead and gone.

Luckily for the population currently alive. If I had to write that chapter it would never be published- not because of any inaccuracy but because the current population wouldn't have the stomach to read a bluntly honest view.

We prefer net curtains.
 

Politics matters

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"Don't know where they came from nor even where they are standing now". What kind of statement is that?

People experience their own lives and know its realities. They encounter that reality in their daily activities, daily choices and experiences. They don't have to be told who they are, or where they came from.

Using the teaching of history to tell the students 'who they are' is already to say that the aim of the lesson is to coach them into a particular narrative that suits those who set the curriculum.
Yeah feck the leaders of 1916, they were all priviledged white men anyway.

Leo is our leader now, a gay half-Indian man is who we should put our faith in!!!!!
 

toughbutfair

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Geography is no great loss , however history must be preserved , was reading a debate in the USA about whether they should include more women and blacks in the history of science I.e. trying to rewrite history to be PC .
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
History is better at biting the misuser on the arse....
 

DJP

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I hope it does happen that there are shorter courses across second level. That way for example there could be a shortish (a few weeks say) course on 1916 etc. which would educate young people on that and other specific relevant topics. A lot of the material in I think all subjects at second level is not relevant I think.
 

Lumpy Talbot

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You'd be safer dropping Geography rather than History, I've since worked out. If you are told to stand in the corner for being a little ballocks from time to time it would be far better to hear that from a History teacher.

With the Geography teacher you wouldn't know which corner her or she meant. And it is a big old world.
 

wombat

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I hope it does happen that there are shorter courses across second level. That way for example there could be a shortish (a few weeks say) course on 1916 etc. which would educate young people on that and other specific relevant topics. A lot of the material in I think all subjects at second level is not relevant I think.
Those of a certain age will remember the short version of Irish history - Brits bad.:)
 

Degeneration X

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Leo does not care about Irish history or culture, I think we all know why.
It is said it is impossible to write a proper history of the USA in the second half of the 20th Century without mentioning Elvis.

Leo thinks it is impossible to write a history of the past few decades without mentioning Kylie!!
 

Fun with Irish

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I think there is a case for the cessation of history and geography teaching. History is now pretty much taken care of by lobbying algorithm and geography no longer matters now that we have SatNav.

History is variable in any case as a glance at our Northern Ireland forum can attest.
Until the US goes to war and shuts down world-wide communication on the web.

Maybe it would be good to substitute 'Politics' for 'History' in aid of pupils understanding the contemporary world and its dynamics. It might help them to recognise false news.

There is the obvious difficulty that what they learn might be a partisan interpretation of current events. (Instead of 'History' which in our schools used to be a partisan interpretation of past events.)
 

toughbutfair

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It is said it is impossible to write a proper history of the USA in the second half of the 20th Century without mentioning Elvis.

Leo thinks it is impossible to write a history of the past few decades without mentioning Kylie!!
Gays like Kylie , Madonna, lady Gaga etc . I wouldn’t be surprised to hear our Taoiseach is going to the spice girls concert, maybe ask for an autograph.
 

Politics matters

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Compulsory is the wrong word, you can fail history and still get a cert, it was only Irish which was really compulsory. I must admit that I hated history and was delight to drop it after Inter cert, Geography, on the other hand, I found fascinating and kept it for the Leaving. I'm sure history could have been made more interesting but it was the wars of Louis 14th that wrecked my head. Interestingly, I read a lot of history, I just don't have to memorise dates when doing so.:)
History for the leaving is far more interesting compared to the junior.

Modern Irish history, the junior cert, WW2, the cold war etc.
 


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