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Dame_Enda

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The German Constitutional Court yesterday ruled that the ECB has 3 months to justify its bond purchases under its stimulus programme. Calls into question the future of the EUs PSPP (Public Sector Support Plan) and potentially of the Pandemic Emergency Support Plan.

This is despite the fact that the ECJ is supposed to be the superior court in interpreting EU law.

Do we need to worry?
 

Sync

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It's not countering an ECJ ruling. It landed at this court before hand. This may get referred to the ECJ (Which would make sense).

But ultimately no, it won't matter. The EU will come together, define an approach and just rush through the supporting legislation.

The same thing happened in the US during 2008. Individual cases get some success either in finding a technicality or get orders to make the govt present additional info. But it doesn't matter, the govt just passed new laws.

The same thing will happen here. Whatever is needed to get the economic gears turning in Europe and America will get passed. An individual court case won't stop things.
 

Fur Q

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This is a major decision by the German court and a blatant attack on the legal framework of the EU. The German court has taken it upon itself to dismiss part of an ECJ ruling on the grounds that it was wrongly decided. This is an assault on the supremacy of EU law and will no doubt be relied upon by the Polish and Hungarian governments and legal systems when the EU and ECJ seek to impose common standards on them in future. Not for the first time the Germans have assumed the right to disregard the rules of EU membership when it suits them
 

recedite

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But ultimately no, it won't matter. The EU will come together, define an approach and just rush through the supporting legislation.
EU countries have never agreed to share debt. Traditionally the Germans have been the most opposed in principle, but it seems Merkel is is willing to make an exception now.
The German constitutional court is quite rightly pointing out that you can't just make random exceptions to the rules, hence they are asking for the exact rationale and reasoning to be made public.

This is significant because if Merkel comes out and says "the ECB can ditch the rules whenever the German Chancellor says so" then obviously the Netherlands will not agree to that, and therefore the EU will not "come together, define an approach and just rush through the supporting legislation".
 

McTell

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I suppose this will go to the ECJ, but it must be a wake-up call to the technocrati.

Of course germany is obliged to pay europe;'s debts for the rest of all time. How else can we afford their cars, software, beers, dishwashers, and pumpernickels?
 

brughahaha

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I suppose this will go to the ECJ, but it must be a wake-up call to the technocrati.

Of course germany is obliged to pay europe;'s debts for the rest of all time. How else can we afford their cars, software, beers, dishwashers, and pumpernickels?

Buy a bike , use free online software , buy czech beer , use the sink and go to a Polish shop for the pumpernickel
 

McTell

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Buy a bike , use free online software , buy czech beer , use the sink and go to a Polish shop for the pumpernickel

Boycott the germans and the chinese.

And the yanks if'n they vote trump in again...
 

Fur Q

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The ECJ has today reasserted its legal superiority over member states’ courts in respect of ECB matters.

“In order to ensure that EU law is applied uniformly, the Court of Justice alone — which was created for that purpose by the member states — has jurisdiction to rule that an act of an EU institution is contrary to EU law,” the statement read. “Divergences between courts of the member states as to the validity of such acts would indeed be liable to place in jeopardy the unity of the EU legal order and to detract from legal certainty.”


Incidentally, the FT’s coverage of this story has been excellent, unlike the Irish Times which utterly failed to grasp the significance of the German decision.
 

McTell

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I like the way the ECJ re-announces its primacy - yes, since the 1960s - without anyone bringing this case to it. So more like a PR statement at this point.
 

Dame_Enda

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Commission warning of possible probes into Germany. Merkel trying to defuse issue in her party.

 

Malcolm Redfellow

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Commission warning of possible probes into Germany. Merkel trying to defuse issue in her party.
Rubbish.

The ECB is not a German prerogative, so for EU finance the ECB does out-clout the individual national central banks. The ECB is not the Deutsche Bundesbank, and notably was the first central bank to be established as an entity beyond government control.

So making a daisy-chain: [ECB = Bundesbank = German Federal Government = Angela Merkel] shows ignorance at each stage.
 

greencharade

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Combined with the willingness of Germany to close its borders when it suits them, this case demonstrates what the EU is really about. Ho! Ho!

Meanwhile, our sycophants continue to genuflect....
 

recedite

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Or that time they hogged all the PPE and the ventilators. Until they realised they had more than they needed.
Then it was "Lets make a modest EU stockpile, so we can all share in this bounty"
 

Fur Q

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The fallout from the German court's decision continues. The judge who wrote the decision has given an interview in which he warns the EU Commission that an infringement procedure against Germany:
“would trigger a significant escalation, potentially tipping Germany and other member states into a constitutional conflict that would be very difficult to resolve”.

In the long term, it would “weaken or even endanger the European Union”, he added.


The FT's influential commentator Martin Wolf says that

"the German constitutional court launched a legal missile into the heart of the EU. Its judgment is extraordinary. It is an attack on basic economics, the central bank’s integrity, its independence and the legal order of the EU...Future historians may mark this as the decisive turning point in Europe’s history, towards disintegration. "


Meanwhile, the Irish media is almost totally ignoring this story. I'm not aware of any coverage on RTE (which seems so bereft of hard news that it has taken to covering children dressing up as characters in famous paintings on the Six One news). And, laughably, the Irish Times even welcomed the German court ruling and said it would " prompt a massive sigh of relief among euro-zone finance ministers. " :rolleyes:

 

Montgomery Brewster

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The fallout from the German court's decision continues. The judge who wrote the decision has given an interview in which he warns the EU Commission that an infringement procedure against Germany:



The FT's influential commentator Martin Wolf says that




Meanwhile, the Irish media is almost totally ignoring this story. I'm not aware of any coverage on RTE (which seems so bereft of hard news that it has taken to covering children dressing up as characters in famous paintings on the Six One news). And, laughably, the Irish Times even welcomed the German court ruling and said it would " prompt a massive sigh of relief among euro-zone finance ministers. " :rolleyes:



I don't consider myself to be strongly pro/anti Eu, but crikey, since Brexit, they EU have done everything in its power to show the UK that it made the right call in leaving.

Crazy times
 

YouKnowWhatIMeanLike

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how much Irish debt did the ECB buy with the PSPP since 2015? NTMA has issued some 60bn euro in the last 5 years. PSPP is a loan program not a support scheme for defaulting states. the money that has to be paid back in full in good time (5-15 years)
 

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