• Due to a glitch in the old vBulletin software, some users were "banned" when they tried to change their passwords at the end of February. This does not apply after the site was converted to Xenforo. If you were affected by this, please contact us.

Fear God and Honour Thy Queen

Irish-Rationalist

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 2, 2016
Messages
3,205
July is almost upon us. That time of year when Orangemen, her majesties most loyal subjects (apparently she's remotely aware of their existence), put on their sashes and take to the Queen's highway with their banners, bowlers and big pointy sticks. Last year I remember encountering an "Orange Arch" not too far from where I grew up. Across the top in bold lettering was written the unequivocal message: "Fear God and Honour thy Queen".

I remember thinking, if God really exists, and is full of love as the bible (2000 yr old fictional novel) tells us, why on earth would you want to fear him? And is playing the loyal subordinate to the most privileged family in England, who in the 21st century really doesn't give a toss about her most loyal minions in the north of Ireland, still a wise and feasible option?

I find it astonishing that religionist's are still peddling the God fear notion as a means of controlling people, and that Unionist's are still under the illusion that Elizabeth is keen on retaining her 6 county colony in the north of Ireland. When will these people realise that it was man who created God, and as a coping mechanism, and that demanding loyalty to the British monarchy in the 21st century is just so anachronistic and passe?

In the interests of cultural equality I enjoy a good Orange pageant as much as the next Socialist Republican. It's a colourful time of year when antiquated Irish chapel's that are looking a bit shabby receive a good hosing down. But for dear sake fellas; fearing a supernatural entity, which in all probability doesn't exist, and honouring a monarch who'd covertly like nothing more than a united Ireland; is this really befitting behaviour for a group of cultured and learned gentlemen?



This one says "Fear God Honour The King". When was the last time the UK had a king?
 


Ó Ghabhainn

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 2, 2009
Messages
3,120
Well, surely for Christians, the Queen is a false idol. As is il papa. The current il papa knows this.
 

theloner

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 24, 2011
Messages
9,487
What an odd bunch.
 

GDPR

1
Joined
Jul 5, 2008
Messages
217,847
Its a quote from one of the Epistles of St Peter.

I remember seeing in on one of those weird arches though and just down from it was one with Cromwell on it.
 

theloner

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 24, 2011
Messages
9,487
LOL83.....

Indeed..
 

blokesbloke

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 13, 2011
Messages
22,697
Is there really a point to this OP, OP?

You're asking why religious people haven't realised there is no God - bit of a non-starter.

You're asking why royalists are royalists - ditto.

You're not really making any new points that haven't been endlessly debated before.

I couldn't give two fecks about the royal family and I'm damn sure none of them give two fecks about anyone in NI - but I don't think they give two fecks about practically anyone in the rest of the UK either. They're parasites, nothing more, nothing less. They care about the country because it gives them power, they care about the people who keep them in power, that's it.

The rest of the public I am sure they hold in amused contempt, especially the ones who fawn over them.

I suppose Unionists are the most pro-royal because the queen is a symbol of the country they feel a connection to and she's the head of state.

As she's also above politics, they can depend on her not to say anything that would upset them whatever her private feelings or, crucially, whatever the political situation.

I recall a newspaper article ages ago when the British government were doing something a Unionist politician didn't like - probably before the GFA - and they said they owed their allegiance to the Queen, not the British Government.

Which is fine but the queen will do whatever the British Government wants so even as a very young man then it struck me as a bit of a technical distinction, designed to be comforting but ultimately meaningless.

That's all the royal family is - comfort for the masses.

Personally I find them as comforting as being wrapped in a blanket of razor-wire, but hey, not everyone feels the same.
 
Last edited:

petaljam

Moderator
Joined
Nov 23, 2012
Messages
30,446
In the interests of cultural equality I enjoy a good Orange pageant as much as the next Socialist Republican.
For this sentence alone this deserves a like, well it made me laugh anyway.

(As for the rest, I'm saying nahin so am are.)
 

blokesbloke

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 13, 2011
Messages
22,697




The arch isn't bad but might have looked better if the walls by the gates didn't look like they were made out of breeze-block.

Are these a represenation of real gates somewhere or metaphorical ones?

Naturally I am sure it contravenes all sorts of planning/traffic laws but they don't seem to apply in NI.

I'm sure it's blocking the pavement a bit too... but c'est la vie, I suppose nobody will complain and nobody will do anything even if they do.
 

blokesbloke

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 13, 2011
Messages
22,697
Well, surely for Christians, the Queen is a false idol. As is il papa. The current il papa knows this.
Depends on the Christian I guess.

RCs wouldn't see il papa as a false idol.

Anglicans wouldn't see Lizzie as one.

Others might seem them both as one.
 

between the bridges

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 21, 2011
Messages
44,682
A wee bit of history for ye muppets...

Triumphal and Fraternal Arches

The practice of erecting free-standing arch structures originated in ancient Rome, where triumphal arches were built as part of the public celebrations for returning military leaders, as a means of honouring the victorious warrior-hero and his army (Saxl and Wittkower 1948). Arches were introduced into England during the Renaissance, and through the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries, they were used extensively, particularly in royal pageantry. Elaborate arches were erected across the main thoroughfares of provincial towns to mark royal visits or as part of the celebrations of important events such as coronations, where they served both to honour the royal visitor and to demonstrate loyalty and devotion to the monarch (Bergeron 1971). Such arches were temporary installations, but nevertheless were elaborately designed and often incorporated extensive floral displays to represent the virtues and qualities of the visitor. Throughout the nineteenth century, arches were utilised by friendly societies and other fraternal organisations to welcome members to important gatherings; they were also erected as part of wedding celebrations and for some religious occasions (Gosden 1961; Buckley and Anderson 1988). Arches have therefore been used for a variety of public expressions: to welcome dignitaries, to honour the hero, to celebrate military victories, to greet friends and colleagues, and to mark important events.
The earliest reference to a formal arch in Ireland dates from 1790 when the Bishop's Gate in the Londonderry [3] city walls was rebuilt as a replica of a triumphal arch in honour of King William III.


The term "arch" may seem a little misleading for what was often no more than bunches of flowers, ribbons, coloured paper, and boughs of trees which were tied to a rope and suspended across a street. But, as Loftus (1994) notes, similar techniques for creating arches had been utilised in England since the sixteenth century. It is also clear from some descriptions that while many were quite simple affairs, floral arches were often elaborate, colourful and impressive constructions. The arch over the entrance gate of the Archdeaconry house in Hillsborough in 1830 was described as being "composed of the richest flowers of orange, purple and blue [4] fastened with ribands of the same colours" (Belfast News Letter [BNL] 20 July 1830). In smaller villages, a single arch would be erected on part of the parade route or over the entrance to the field, but in urban centres, several arches might be erected along the main thoroughfares. In 1848, it was reported that twelve arches were erected in Enniskillen and "eight or nine" appeared in Ballymena, while at least fifteen arches were erected in Coleraine in 1870. The Coleraine arches incorporated a wide a range of representations of King William, the Relief of Derry, the Boyne Obelisk, and "other emblems of the Revolution" (BNL 13 July 1848; 13 July 1870). It also seems that the quality and quantity of arches in any given area could depend on the state of the weather and the consequent number of lilies that were available rather than simply the enthusiasm of local people. In 1874, it was reported that Ballymena had "not seen such a crop of Orange lilies for many a year, and consequently not so many arches"; as a result, there was "hardly a street in town without an arch" (BNL 16 July 1874). Floral displays remained an important component of the visual displays into the twentieth century, but over the years, the style and content of the arches became more elaborate. By the late 1840s, a number of distinctive and noteworthy arches were observed. In Lisburn, a triple arch spanned both the cartway and the footpaths on either side, and the structure included both a crown and a miniature equestrian King William made of alabaster as the centrepiece. A similarly elaborate arch appeared at Cavan, while the one in Moneymore was somewhat obscurely described as being "of a most rare description, in the Gothic order" (Northern Whig [NW] 14 July 1849). Clearly, within the constraints of local customs and the symbolic traditions of the Orange Order there was a considerable leeway for local initiative and imagination to be expressed in the visual displays.

The Orange Arch: Creating Tradition in Ulster on JSTOR

Oh and there were 'Green' arches erected for st pat's and Aug 15th, very popular late 1800's last one recorded 1932...
 

fitzroyalty

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 29, 2009
Messages
746
I think the arches look well. That's Waringstown in the op if I'm not mistaken. When these wee villages are decorated properly and respectfully they actually look good.

Drove down the Falls earlier in the week and it also surprisingly looked well, almost carnival-like decorations
 

between the bridges

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 21, 2011
Messages
44,682




The arch isn't bad but might have looked better if the walls by the gates didn't look like they were made out of breeze-block.

Are these a represenation of real gates somewhere or metaphorical ones?

Naturally I am sure it contravenes all sorts of planning/traffic laws but they don't seem to apply in NI.

I'm sure it's blocking the pavement a bit too... but c'est la vie, I suppose nobody will complain and nobody will do anything even if they do.
Temporary permit from roads service, if you note the base there usually a manhole cover which when removed lets the stanchions fit into locking bolts, structural engineers cert, (Holls does moi's) insurance and road bond all required. There maybe some who don't but any that I'm aware of comply or they aren't covered by OO PI insurance.
 

between the bridges

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 21, 2011
Messages
44,682
I think the arches look well. That's Waringstown in the op if I'm not mistaken. When these wee villages are decorated properly and respectfully they actually look good.

Drove down the Falls earlier in the week and it also surprisingly looked well, almost carnival-like decorations
Yeah there has to be a happy medium, no paramilitary displays, time limit, maybe a fee/charge/ registration etc.
 

Glaucon

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 13, 2012
Messages
8,270
I think the arches look well. That's Waringstown in the op if I'm not mistaken. When these wee villages are decorated properly and respectfully they actually look good.
They are about as "respectful" of Catholics as this is of Jews:

 

Roy Feen

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 4, 2010
Messages
2,956
This one says "Fear God Honour The King". When was the last time the UK had a king?
Maybe it's referring to Elvis.

It would seem apt to commemorate a fat drug addict with a parade of fat drug addicts in funny little costumes.
 

fitzroyalty

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 29, 2009
Messages
746
They are about as "respectful" of Catholics as this is of Jews:

I'm reminded of Poyntzpass in the early 2000s when the Armagh gaelic team were enjoying success. The bunting and union jacks were up for the 12th and they came down shortly after and made way for the orange and white of Ard Mhacha. There might have even been some cross over.

I know more often than not it's not done like this but there has to be some compromise.
 


New Threads

Popular Threads

Most Replies

Top