FF Type Party Couldn't Be prominent In A Predominantly Protestant Country?

SlickWilly

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Well Myers has suggested in the past that you wouldn't find such a party outside Sicily! And maybe in South America! I have been told by an expert on US politics on their continuum FF would be the Democrats with its links to the construction industry and I said to myself Yes, pre 1960s Southern Democrats, than I was reminded of auld Dick Daley's Chicago!
Also 2 disgraceful examples of protestant dominated societies which arguably produced worse than Eff Eff ever were are, South Africa run by the National Party and the Northern part of this island being misruled by Unionists for 70 odd years!
 


He3

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If the euro teaches us anything it is that Protestant money and Catholic money should never marry.

;)
 

Mitsui2

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The Greeks are mainly orthodox!
Yes but there are very strong correspondences between old style "high" Catholicism and the carry-on of the Orthodox Church at local level, also between the historically peasant nature of most of the adherents of both churches (developed - I might add - in countries under foreign occupation).

At that level there are a host of correspondences between the two faiths - and the Greeks have their gombeen men too. I once lived in a Greek village for a year and I was amazed at the number of what I'd always thought classic Irish "types" that I could pick out from a very early stage, and at how thoroughly later knowledge and experience of the individuals concerned confirmed my early impressions.

Though I can't imagine a Greek Jackie Healy Rae - but maybe I'm wrong.
 

irish_bob

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Well Myers has suggested in the past that you wouldn't find such a party outside Sicily! And maybe in South America! I have been told by an expert on US politics on their continuum FF would be the Democrats with its links to the construction industry and I said to myself Yes, pre 1960s Southern Democrats, than I was reminded of auld Dick Daley's Chicago!
Also 2 disgraceful examples of protestant dominated societies which arguably produced worse than Eff Eff ever were are, South Africa run by the National Party and the Northern part of this island being misruled by Unionists for 70 odd years!
NO , because protestant countries are puritanical about money but not sex , FF on the other hand and ireland
 

Panopticon

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Well Myers has suggested in the past that you wouldn't find such a party outside Sicily! And maybe in South America! I have been told by an expert on US politics on their continuum FF would be the Democrats with its links to the construction industry and I said to myself Yes, pre 1960s Southern Democrats, than I was reminded of auld Dick Daley's Chicago!
Also 2 disgraceful examples of protestant dominated societies which arguably produced worse than Eff Eff ever were are, South Africa run by the National Party and the Northern part of this island being misruled by Unionists for 70 odd years!
Well UK Labour has behaved almost as badly as FF - they just governed such a big country that they could afford their massive bank debts, whereas we can't.

Part of the problem is that there are so few "Protestant countries". Most are now thoroughly secular (Scandis) or have a large Catholic minority (Germany, Netherlands, USA).

The NSDAP, of course, got its support from the Protestant areas of Germany, but FF aren't as bad as they were!
 

Tomas Mor

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What about Italy ? Seriously though, the hospitals should have been left to the nuns, and the banks to the Protestants !
 

louis bernard

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The NSDAP, of course, got its support from the Protestant areas of Germany, but FF aren't as bad as they were!
The third of Germany that was Catholic was equally as supportive of the Nazis. These luminaries were all brought up as Catholics.
“Among the many Nazi leaders who were Roman Catholics, in addition to Adolf Hitler, were Josef Goebbels, Heinrich Himmler, Reinhard Heydrich, and Rudolf Hoess, (not to be confused with Hitler's Deputy Fuëhrer and secretary, Rudolf Hess). Hermann Goering, on the other hand, had mixed Catholic - Protestant parentage”
 

florin

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The third of Germany that was Catholic was equally as supportive of the Nazis. These luminaries were all brought up as Catholics.
“Among the many Nazi leaders who were Roman Catholics, in addition to Adolf Hitler, were Josef Goebbels, Heinrich Himmler, Reinhard Heydrich, and Rudolf Hoess, (not to be confused with Hitler's Deputy Fuëhrer and secretary, Rudolf Hess). Hermann Goering, on the other hand, had mixed Catholic - Protestant parentage”
Not to mention that the Catholic Centre party allied with the Nazis against Godless Communism.
 

Panopticon

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The third of Germany that was Catholic was equally as supportive of the Nazis. These luminaries were all brought up as Catholics.
“Among the many Nazi leaders who were Roman Catholics, in addition to Adolf Hitler, were Josef Goebbels, Heinrich Himmler, Reinhard Heydrich, and Rudolf Hoess, (not to be confused with Hitler's Deputy Fuëhrer and secretary, Rudolf Hess). Hermann Goering, on the other hand, had mixed Catholic - Protestant parentage”
Incorrect. Catholic and urban areas were less supportive of the NSDAP than the rural, protestant North East.
 

devnull

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In the 1920's the Nazis were strongest in Catholic areas.
But the (Catholic and democratic) Centre Party managed to hold onto its share of the vote in the 1930's (11-13%), limiting Nazi gains amongst Catholics and by 1932 the Nazis were significantly stronger in Protestant areas.
As the Nazis started taking over the state the Centre Party's opposition crumbled, but their overall history is as a staunchly anti-Nazi party.

In a dominant-party system that party usually has corruption problems.
There are a few exceptions, but the problem is hardly unique to Catholic countries.
It's worth noting that although Dev himself had financial irregularities, FF as a party were clean for the first 30 years of their virtual monopoly on power.
 

dent

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I would have always thought that was so, but then you look at the DUP who have been caught with their hands in the cookie jar as well. Power is the corrupting factor.
 

oggy

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If American I would be a Democrat. If British I would have a problem. People like me who shun ideology or any type of extreme views are happy to have a catch-all party like FF. People wth strong religious beliefs, right wing economics and a host of other right wing leanings are very much at home in FG and represent the core vote of that party. Economics and the left are an oxymoron. The left want everything that money can buy but live off the fat of the land rather than be seen to create the necessary wealth to pay the cost of goodies. Really FG are the same in that regard, most FG have safe secure jobs with a few of them enjoying the benefits of inherited wealth
 

picador

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NO , because protestant countries are puritanical about money but not sex , FF on the other hand and ireland
So do you care to explain why the Presbyterian Mutual Society went bust and is looking a bail-out from the British government!?
 

Fides

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If American I would be a Democrat. If British I would have a problem. People like me who shun ideology or any type of extreme views are happy to have a catch-all party like FF. People wth strong religious beliefs, right wing economics and a host of other right wing leanings are very much at home in FG and represent the core vote of that party. Economics and the left are an oxymoron. The left want everything that money can buy but live off the fat of the land rather than be seen to create the necessary wealth to pay the cost of goodies. Really FG are the same in that regard, most FG have safe secure jobs with a few of them enjoying the benefits of inherited wealth
I agree that up to now FF have been a catch all party but for me that is part of their problem. I don't really know what they will come up with next, they have been in coalition with the PDs, Labour and the Greens, a fair old rainbow. I do have strong religious beliefs (evangelical Christian) but I don't feel at home with any party here. What I want is a party that tells the truth and do what they say they will do and whose members act with a high level of integrity. I don't know any country whether Catholic, Protestant, Jewish or Muslim that has a party like that!!!
 

oggy

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I agree that up to now FF have been a catch all party but for me that is part of their problem. I don't really know what they will come up with next, they have been in coalition with the PDs, Labour and the Greens, a fair old rainbow. I do have strong religious beliefs (evangelical Christian) but I don't feel at home with any party here. What I want is a party that tells the truth and do what they say they will do and whose members act with a high level of integrity. I don't know any country whether Catholic, Protestant, Jewish or Muslim that has a party like that!!!
Think I engaged with you before and decided you are fair minded person. Your points are valid and in my moments of idealism I would agree with you. Problem is that old real world with all its flaws is the world I see. In 1979 it was decided by an independent commission to increase by 22 the Dail seats to 166. This effectively ruled out FF chances of becoming a single party government. It also effectively meant government became FG/Lab V FF/ whoever. Have theory on the reasons behind founding of PD's but thats another days debate
On the political probity side like you I would be highly desirous of reaching close to perfection. We have been lucky in this country to have had a low levels of corruption and FF have had a monopoly on that. I believe its a new era and corruption will in the future be spotted and attacked instantly. The battle for the perfect world goes on
 

SlickWilly

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He3
On the never let protestant and catholic money marry as in the yoyo well as has been pointed out re sane yoyo countries Germany is possibly 40% catholic and probably more important to Vatican coffers than Brazil the biggest one, Hitler's native Austria is overwhelmingly catholic, Holland's largest religeon at over 1/3 is catholic, luxemburg is catholic. So what's the point, you are making. BTW the traditionally prod supported BOI, unfortunately and I sincerely mean that, made a living shight of the COI shareholding and finances with the freefall in its shares!
 

SlickWilly

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BTW, Scotland is about 80% protestant and its taig minority are virtually to a man and a woman labour party supporters as indeed non traditional English catholics are down south! It has been pointed out to me in overwhelmingly labour controlled areas of Scotland that their (LAB) levels of corruption leaves our Eff Eff rednecks in the haypenny place!
 

SlickWilly

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Another thing,
In fairness you can accuse Eff Eff rednecks of almost anything, but they are not Nazis!
 


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