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FG obtains proof that Ahern supported Casino!


Joined
Sep 3, 2007
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According yesterday's Irish Mail on Sunday (page 4) Fine Gael have got their hands on material under the FOI Act which proves that Bertie Ahern initially supported the development of a Casino on the site of the Phoenix Park racecourse.

FG sources said they got loads of material showing this and have to "plough through the stuff" but that they will be releasing it in the coming days.

Bertie has repeatedly insisted that he opposed the Casino proposal from Day 1. What will the effect be if (when) he is shown up as a liar?

Will FF members change their views on his perjury at the Mahon Tribunal, if he is shown to have lied in other arenas?
And what kind of can of worms will this open up? (since his opposition to the Casino forms a part of his Tribunal defence)

ON EDIT: John Hynes, former Chairman of An Post, has already said that Ahern was in favour of the Casino at the time
 

White Horse

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Compound Fracture said:
What will the effect be if (when) he is shown up as a liar?
Unfortunately very litle.

Fianna Fail are morally bankrupt and are unconcerned about truth and honesty.

The Greens are quickly catching up with them .
 

returning officer

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Compound Fracture said:
Day 1. What will the effect be if (when) he is shown up as a liar?

Will FF members change their views on his perjury at the Mahon Tribunal, if he is shown to have lied in other arenas?
a) We will have to wait for the decision of the tribunal
or b) couldn't care less about a casino that never went ahead.

When was the last perjury trial in this country (and doesn't a successful one require two witnesses to corroborate the true events?
 

CorkHurler

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Compound Fracture said:
: John Hynes, former Chairman of An Post, has already said that Ahern was in favour of the Casino at the time
is that the same John Hynes who the Sunday Independent exposed as a Fine Gael member and canvasser for Gemma Hussey?
 
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returning officer said:
When was the last perjury trial in this country (and doesn't a successful one require two witnesses to corroborate the true events?
Last October. One of the witnesses in the Keane trial was convicted.

You don't necessarily need two witnesses. If documentary evidence proves the offence beyond reasonable doubt, then you're guilty regardless of what any witness says
 

aodh_rua

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I think they 'exposed' him as a friend of Gemma Hussey's who canvassed for her. That was the limit of his FG activism - he was there through her not because he was a 'party' man. Surely giving a friend a dig out at election time isn't a crime, and shouldn't undermine anyone serving on a state board - or do you disagree CorkHurler?
 

meriwether

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CorkHurler said:
Compound Fracture said:
: John Hynes, former Chairman of An Post, has already said that Ahern was in favour of the Casino at the time
is that the same John Hynes who the Sunday Independent exposed as a Fine Gael member and canvasser for Gemma Hussey?

Stop.

Press.
 
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CorkHurler said:
is that the same John Hynes who the Sunday Independent exposed as a Fine Gael member and canvasser for Gemma Hussey?
John Hynes exposed as a Fine Gael supporter.
Bertie Ahern exposed as a liar and a perjurer.

Which is more shocking do you think?
 

Tipp North

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meriwether said:
CorkHurler said:
Compound Fracture said:
: John Hynes, former Chairman of An Post, has already said that Ahern was in favour of the Casino at the time
is that the same John Hynes who the Sunday Independent exposed as a Fine Gael member and canvasser for Gemma Hussey?

Stop.

Press.
Don't worry about Corkhurler. He likes to attack the person rather than deal with the facts, hence he fits perfectly well in FF.
 

CorkHurler

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Tipp North said:
Don't worry about Corkhurler. He likes to attack the person rather than deal with the facts, hence he fits perfectly well in FF.
This from a member of the Varadkar and Regan??? In fact I'd be happy to debate the facts of the Fianna Fail economic miracle of the last 11 years with you any time!!
 

meriwether

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CorkHurler said:
Tipp North said:
Don't worry about Corkhurler. He likes to attack the person rather than deal with the facts, hence he fits perfectly well in FF.
This from a member of the Varadkar and Regan??? In fact I'd be happy to debate the facts of the Fianna Fail economic miracle of the last 11 years with you any time!!
If Varadkar and Regan have made unjustified personal attacks on someone, could youi point them out?

And Id be happy to debate the economic miracle of the last 6 months with you aswell.
The miracle of the no loaves and fishes anymore.
 

returning officer

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Compound Fracture said:
[quote="returning officer":1tm6ghvm]When was the last perjury trial in this country (and doesn't a successful one require two witnesses to corroborate the true events?
Last October. One of the witnesses in the Keane trial was convicted.

You don't necessarily need two witnesses. If documentary evidence proves the offence beyond reasonable doubt, then you're guilty regardless of what any witness says[/quote:1tm6ghvm]

Mr Behan had given a detailed statement to a number of gardai and retracted it at his trial.


Who will prove documentary evidence against Ahern?
People throw words like perjury round the place like a juggler of red herrings. Anyone want to take a bet on his sucessful proescution?
 
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Ah grow up. Are you seriously suggesting that documentary evidence would be ignored, for the lack of verbal testimony?

If so, why don't all tax-cheats and fraudsters get off scott-free?
 

digoutday

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returning officer said:
[quote="Compound Fracture":mw2v55dt][quote="returning officer":mw2v55dt]When was the last perjury trial in this country (and doesn't a successful one require two witnesses to corroborate the true events?
Last October. One of the witnesses in the Keane trial was convicted.

You don't necessarily need two witnesses. If documentary evidence proves the offence beyond reasonable doubt, then you're guilty regardless of what any witness says[/quote:mw2v55dt]

Mr Behan had given a detailed statement to a number of gardai and retracted it at his trial.


Who will prove documentary evidence against Ahern?
People throw words like perjury round the place like a juggler of red herrings. Anyone want to take a bet on his sucessful proescution?[/quote:mw2v55dt]


Telling the tribunal that he does not know about the 30k sterling is one hell of a tall story, a complete lie in fact.
 

Tipp North

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CorkHurler said:
Tipp North said:
Don't worry about Corkhurler. He likes to attack the person rather than deal with the facts, hence he fits perfectly well in FF.
This from a member of the Varadkar and Regan??? In fact I'd be happy to debate the facts of the Fianna Fail economic miracle of the last 11 years with you any time!!
It would be totally pointless. No matter what I say/argue with you, you will continue to believe what you want to believe. Don't let the facts get in the way of bind faith, isn't that right?
 

MarD

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From the FF backbencher response on Morning Ireland this morning to Kenny's statement it is pretty clear that any revelation on Ahern will have little effect on the rump FF support.

It is obvious now that they feel the last General Election gives them a rubber stamp for the next 5 years regardless of what is subsequently revealed. They will disregard the new information that has come to light since Ahern's first draft of the dig-out story before the election. It's a bit like the IRA claiming their mandate as stemming from a long past General Election.l

There is no appetite just yet for a leadership battle just yet, they are all going to try to keep their powder dry until after the Local elections. Kenny and Gilmore know this and are really trying to pressurise the Greens. Ryan and Gormley look like they aren't going to make the same mistake as McDowell and will balls it out with their position being that 'the Tribunal has yet to report'.

It's an interesting time for irish politics, FG and Labour would be able to make hay with this if they weren't both compromised by the planning decisions of their own councillors down through the years. The Game plan has to be the next Local elections.
 
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