Fianna Fail have ruined the country once again

junketman

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Mar 25, 2008
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Ah well another 17,000 on the dole, back to the bad old days of the 1980's I suppose when Fianna Fail left another mess behind them after their time in government and the crackpot economics of the 1977 election manifesto.

Well I suppose its turn out the lights on leaving the country time again. Well done FF, take a bow, give yourselves a pay rise, promote your friends to semi-state bodies and tell yerselves 'I'm alright Jack' while ignoring that yee have ruined the country once again.
 


returning officer

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That must be a record for the most number of bullshit cliches in the one post. Wow.
 

junketman

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returning officer said:
That must be a record for the most number of ******** cliches in the one post. Wow.
Nothing compared to the record numbers joining the dole queue in one year. I think I know which record is more significant.
 

codology

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Theres every chance that we are going to convince ourselves that things are as bad as 25 years ago,be careful what you wish for just to make FF look bad.
 

junketman

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codology said:
Theres every chance that we are going to convince ourselves that things are as bad as 25 years ago,be careful what you wish for just to make FF look bad.
Are you and I living in the same country?

Oh that's right tell the tens of thousands joining the dole queues we never had it so good, FF are best equipped to deal with the down turn yadda yadda yadda...

Only for FF imagine how bad it really would be!! :roll:

But if you think it's bad now, wait until you see how bad it will get.

The Celtic Tiger started during the Rainbow government's time because they kept a careful reign on government spending, got value for money and put the government finances in good order again after FF incompetance. The Celtic Tiger died around about 2004, ie during a FF government and the economy has been on a gradual slide since and FF haven't a bulls clue what to do....so if its bad now and on the slide, and FF are unable to halt the slide and get people working again, imagine how bad it will be by the next election? I would say 400,000 out of work easily. All I can say to FF is lads, no-one will help you with your homework on this one, you are in it by yourselves.
 

tonys

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195
Bawbag said:
Of course nobody here voted for these gombeen men :lol:
Nobody ever does, at least nobody with an IQ higher than, well anyone really.

On the other hand there are 1 million more people working and for the most part paying tax now than there was in the 80’s. now you might say big deal and you’d be right.
 

codology

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388
junketman said:
codology said:
Theres every chance that we are going to convince ourselves that things are as bad as 25 years ago,be careful what you wish for just to make FF look bad.
Are you and I living in the same country?

Oh that's right tell the tens of thousands joining the dole queues we never had it so good, FF are best equipped to deal with the down turn yadda yadda yadda...

Only for FF imagine how bad it really would be!! :roll:
Now your just being stupid I would'nt dare say that things have never been so good but we are a long long way away from things never been so bad.
 

Bawbag

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tonys said:
Bawbag said:
Of course nobody here voted for these gombeen men :lol:
Nobody ever does, at least nobody with an IQ higher than, well anyone really.

On the other hand there are 1 million more people working and for the most part paying tax now than there was in the 80’s. now you might say big deal and you’d be right.
Of course anyone who has a job in Ireland owes it all to the inspired leadership of Bertie. Remember how bad the 80's blah blah blah...
 

tonys

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Bawbag said:
tonys said:
Bawbag said:
Of course nobody here voted for these gombeen men :lol:
Nobody ever does, at least nobody with an IQ higher than, well anyone really.

On the other hand there are 1 million more people working and for the most part paying tax now than there was in the 80’s. now you might say big deal and you’d be right.
Of course anyone who has a job in Ireland owes it all to the inspired leadership of Bertie. Remember how bad the 80's blah blah blah...
I apologise for replying to your post, I thought you were an adult.
 

evercloserunion

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Dec 10, 2006
Messages
804
Bawbag said:
tonys said:
Bawbag said:
Of course nobody here voted for these gombeen men :lol:
Nobody ever does, at least nobody with an IQ higher than, well anyone really.

On the other hand there are 1 million more people working and for the most part paying tax now than there was in the 80’s. now you might say big deal and you’d be right.
Of course anyone who has a job in Ireland owes it all to the inspired leadership of Bertie. Remember how bad the 80's blah blah blah...
So when we do have jobs it's not FF's doing but when we don't have jobs it is? How does that work?
 

hiding behind a poster

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tonys said:
On the other hand there are 1 million more people working and for the most part paying tax now than there was in the 80’s. now you might say big deal and you’d be right.
Absolutely. Your party must be very ashamed of its role in virtually bankrupting our country the last time FF had a majority government. What was it again? National debt up by 240% from 1977-81, and when Haughey lost office that year the Exchequer was a few weeks away from being unable to pay nurses, teachers and Garda salaries. And the International Monetary Fund standing by to effectively take over our economy, and in effect our sovereignty, if we defaulted on any more loan repayments.
 

Bawbag

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evercloserunion said:
Bawbag said:
tonys said:
Bawbag said:
Of course nobody here voted for these gombeen men :lol:
Nobody ever does, at least nobody with an IQ higher than, well anyone really.

On the other hand there are 1 million more people working and for the most part paying tax now than there was in the 80’s. now you might say big deal and you’d be right.
Of course anyone who has a job in Ireland owes it all to the inspired leadership of Bertie. Remember how bad the 80's blah blah blah...
So when we do have jobs it's not FF's doing but when we don't have jobs it is? How does that work?
FF do not control the economy, IBEC and US and other multinational corporations do. It is their fault for allowing corporations to decide whether they want to employ us or not.
 

Bawbag

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tonys said:
Bawbag said:
tonys said:
Bawbag said:
Of course nobody here voted for these gombeen men :lol:
Nobody ever does, at least nobody with an IQ higher than, well anyone really.

On the other hand there are 1 million more people working and for the most part paying tax now than there was in the 80’s. now you might say big deal and you’d be right.
Of course anyone who has a job in Ireland owes it all to the inspired leadership of Bertie. Remember how bad the 80's blah blah blah...
I apologise for replying to your post, I thought you were an adult.
Would you like to explain to me the great vision of the FF government over the last 11 years? FF just pin their hopes on the market and take no responsibility themselves.
 

junketman

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Messages
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evercloserunion said:
Bawbag said:
tonys said:
Bawbag said:
Of course nobody here voted for these gombeen men :lol:
Nobody ever does, at least nobody with an IQ higher than, well anyone really.

On the other hand there are 1 million more people working and for the most part paying tax now than there was in the 80’s. now you might say big deal and you’d be right.
Of course anyone who has a job in Ireland owes it all to the inspired leadership of Bertie. Remember how bad the 80's blah blah blah...
So when we do have jobs it's not FF's doing but when we don't have jobs it is? How does that work?
Governments can only ever manage the fundamentals of an economy, that is their contribution, in every normal country in the world. If they manage the fundamentals well, the country goes in the right direction, often not in the lifetime of their government but future governments see the benefits as you don't turn an economy into a success overnight, it takes years and even decades of the right policies beforehand by successive governments.

FF have not managed the fundemantals well, the let spending get out of control and now have to cut everything back. They allowed a property bubble to develop which was their major contribution to the current downturn.
 

tonys

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hiding behind a poster said:
tonys said:
On the other hand there are 1 million more people working and for the most part paying tax now than there was in the 80’s. now you might say big deal and you’d be right.
Absolutely. Your party must be very ashamed of its role in virtually bankrupting our country the last time FF had a majority government. What was it again? National debt up by 240% from 1977-81, and when Haughey lost office that year the Exchequer was a few weeks away from being unable to pay nurses, teachers and Garda salaries. And the International Monetary Fund standing by to effectively take over our economy, and in effect our sovereignty, if we defaulted on any more loan repayments.
Not for the first time you get things arseways. You have misread your friend’s figures, not your fault really, he presents them in a deliberately skewed fashion. The real figure, given that FG took over in June of ‘81 would be about a 100% increase in the ND between ’77 and June ‘81, up by 5.5 Billion and from 75% of GDP to 93%. A percentage increase of 18% in GDP terms. ‘82 to ‘87 on the other hand also produced an increase of about 105% in the ND, but now that translates into 15.5 Billion, three times the increase of ‘77-’81 and in percentage GDP terms from 93% to 125% or a 32% increase, almost double the ‘77-’81 outcome.

The only way you can get a 200% increase from the ‘77 to June ‘81 Figures is to say that the ‘82 -’87 increase was in the region of 300%. Talk to your friend, he can have it one way or the other, but he really shouldn’t try to have it both ways.

Last point, the IMF had no special interest in Ireland in ‘81 but by ‘87 they were at the door with a battering ram.
 

tonys

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Joined
Oct 5, 2005
Messages
195
Bawbag said:
tonys said:
Bawbag said:
tonys said:
Bawbag said:
Of course nobody here voted for these gombeen men :lol:
Nobody ever does, at least nobody with an IQ higher than, well anyone really.

On the other hand there are 1 million more people working and for the most part paying tax now than there was in the 80’s. now you might say big deal and you’d be right.
Of course anyone who has a job in Ireland owes it all to the inspired leadership of Bertie. Remember how bad the 80's blah blah blah...
I apologise for replying to your post, I thought you were an adult.
Would you like to explain to me the great vision of the FF government over the last 11 years? FF just pin their hopes on the market and take no responsibility themselves.
After your last post, blah, blah, blah, I really couldn’t be arsed explaining anything to you.
 

Bawbag

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Jul 31, 2008
Messages
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tonys said:
Bawbag said:
tonys said:
Bawbag said:
tonys said:
[quote="Bawbag":25zzpq2v]Of course nobody here voted for these gombeen men :lol:
Nobody ever does, at least nobody with an IQ higher than, well anyone really.

On the other hand there are 1 million more people working and for the most part paying tax now than there was in the 80’s. now you might say big deal and you’d be right.
Of course anyone who has a job in Ireland owes it all to the inspired leadership of Bertie. Remember how bad the 80's blah blah blah...
I apologise for replying to your post, I thought you were an adult.
Would you like to explain to me the great vision of the FF government over the last 11 years? FF just pin their hopes on the market and take no responsibility themselves.
After your last post, blah, blah, blah, I really couldn’t be arsed explaining anything to you.[/quote:25zzpq2v]

I don't think you even could explain anything.
 

goosebump

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returning officer said:
That must be a record for the most number of ******** cliches in the one post. Wow.
Yes, its appears we are entering the Age of the Cliche.
 

evercloserunion

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Joined
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Messages
804
Governments can only ever manage the fundamentals of an economy, that is their contribution, in every normal country in the world. If they manage the fundamentals well, the country goes in the right direction, often not in the lifetime of their government but future governments see the benefits as you don't turn an economy into a success overnight, it takes years and even decades of the right policies beforehand by successive governments.
So how do you know that Fianna Fáil have ruined the country? You are right to claim that the economy cannot be built overnight. This downturn could just as likely be the work of the rainbow government as of Fianna Fáil. Similarly, you cannot use the current recession as evidence that Bertie et al ruined the economy. It's too soon to tell whether he did the long-term economic interests of Ireland a service or disservice.

FF have not managed the fundemantals well, the let spending get out of control and now have to cut everything back. They allowed a property bubble to develop which was their major contribution to the current downturn.
Regarding spending, I don't think government spending is a bad thing. The people were working, the businesses were setting up here, the economy was booming, the government had the money. So why not spend it? Would you have preferred if the government had adopted a laissez-faire attitude towards the economy during the Celtic Tiger? Imagine the state of our hospitals, schools and roads had that been the case! No, I think the fact that the government used the boom to facilitate increased government spending is to its credit. Just because we now have to cut back on spending doesn't mean we never should have spent in the first place, that doesn't make sense.

Regarding the property bubble, I'm no economist but I would not consider that to be one of the "fundamentals" which you claim the government can change. Capitalism is an inherently unstable economic system, characterized by fluctuating economies and expansion-recession cycles. Property bubbles occur--have occurred, are occurring and will occur in the future--in many many other first world nations. It is an economic phenomenon, not a government policy or even a direct result thereof. I do agree that Fianna Fáil are responsible for the extremely poor planning that went into Ireland's residential districts, particularly suburban Dublin, and our general infrastructure. But that was only one of many factors that led to the creation of the bubble; others included demographics and perhaps most importantly the state of the international economy. Capitalism is the price we pay for the protection of property rights. I don't think this bubble could have been avoided by alternative governments, but fortunately I also don't think that this bubble spells the end of Ireland's prosperity.
 


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