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Fine Gael put "national debt clock" on website.

anfieldabff

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Joined
Sep 9, 2010
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724
Wonder will they leave it up when they get into power?
When Labour/FG get in power they will have two clocks up, one for the unemployment rate and one for the national debt, both will be reducing at rate of knots. Just like in the early 80's when unemployment was dropping at 1000 per week.
 


spotty

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Joined
Apr 23, 2010
Messages
364
Ok Spotty now can you tell me which party has been in power for the last 10 years and which party has put us on the road to oblivion. You seem to have conveniently ignored the corrupt members of the party!!! What was the CJH qoute on being ousted ," I have done the State some service, but enough of that"
History of course has proved otherwise, unfortunately history will also prove your other diatribe equally false
Fianna Fáil has been in power, but it was the opposition that set us on the road to these difficulties.

You see, they made prudence in the management of the public finances impossible. Whenever we tried to reduce spending, they screamed blue murder. They demanded more, and more, and more. No amount of public spending was enough for them.

Fianna Fáil has always been a democratic party. We listen to the voice of the people. Unfortunately, the people were whipped up into a rage of irresponsibility by the opposition, and kept demanding spending levels that were clearly unsustainable.

This mess is ultimately the people's fault - they demanded the policies that got us here - but they were aided and abetted by the opposition.

Fianna Fáil alone stood as a beacon of fiscal sense in the boom years. Remember Charlie McCreevey cutting spending in 2004, only to be sabotaged by the people, who demanded his removal? They forced Bertie to become a socialist, in order to satisfy their thirst for spending.

And even as the wreaked havoc, the opposition smiled.
 

anfieldabff

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Joined
Sep 9, 2010
Messages
724
So spotty if you are listening so well, when are we having the byelections and the GE.???
 
D

Deleted member 17573

When Labour/FG get in power they will have two clocks up, one for the unemployment rate and one for the national debt, both will be reducing at rate of knots. Just like in the early 80's when unemployment was dropping at 1000 per week.
And how do you reckon they will reduce the national debt when Enda says there will be no spending cuts and no additional taxes?:confused:
 

grafter1

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Joined
Apr 1, 2010
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829
Irish people simply cannot survive without the state.
Well for all your comical posts you've hit the nail on the head here.

Until we rid the masses of relying or feeling entitled to survival courtesy of the state we are doomed.
 

spotty

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Joined
Apr 23, 2010
Messages
364
So spotty if you are listening so well, when are we having the byelections and the GE.???
My own belief is that there is no constitutional need to have a General Election until 2014. The Government has the option of extending the term of the Dáil by 2 years, and it should take it.

To have an election now would be grossly unfair on the party in power. We are having to take the tough decisions while the opposition are free to chase popularity. It is established principle in the west that elections should be "free and fair", and I think that we should live up to that standard here.

As for the by-elections, there is no requirement to hold them, and to do so might bring down the Government. It would be wrong to hold them when doing so may endanger the political stability of the country.
 

Ulster-Lad

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Joined
Oct 26, 2006
Messages
9,989
My own belief is that there is no constitutional need to have a General Election until 2014. The Government has the option of extending the term of the Dáil by 2 years, and it should take it.

To have an election now would be grossly unfair on the party in power. We are having to take the tough decisions while the opposition are free to chase popularity. It is established principle in the west that elections should be "free and fair", and I think that we should live up to that standard here.

As for the by-elections, there is no requirement to hold them, and to do so might bring down the Government. It would be wrong to hold them when doing so may endanger the political stability of the country.
FF was elected to a 5 year term that expires in 2012. That is the law.

As to your comment about the by-elections that is very un-democratic of you. But then again what do we expect from your party.
 

anfieldabff

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Sep 9, 2010
Messages
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You know spotty, I actually hope that you do stay in power untill 2012 because by then all the lies will have come out, the slow drip of bad news will have become a deluge. FF will not only be out of power for one dail term but for an entire generation. This is one time that there is no way that you will be able to coordinate the economic cycle with the electoral cycle. (Even if you could extend the dail term by two years)
The irony is that having screwed the Irish people, FF is itself screwed with no hope for the future.
 

flavirostris

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Joined
Dec 21, 2007
Messages
24,569
To have an election now would be grossly unfair on the party in power. We are having to take the tough decisions while the opposition are free to chase popularity
Brilliant spotty. You should be FF press officer
 

spotty

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Joined
Apr 23, 2010
Messages
364
You know spotty, I actually hope that you do stay in power untill 2012 because by then all the lies will have come out, the slow drip of bad news will have become a deluge. FF will not only be out of power for one dail term but for an entire generation. This is one time that there is no way that you will be able to coordinate the economic cycle with the electoral cycle. (Even if you could extend the dail term by two years)
The irony is that having screwed the Irish people, FF is itself screwed with no hope for the future.
I hope we stay in power till then to. The work must be finished. A lot has been done, but there is a lot more to do.
 

anfieldabff

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Joined
Sep 9, 2010
Messages
724
Good night spotty, the rest of us have to go to bed to dream!! and I have to be up at 6.30 am to go to work.
 

spotty

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Joined
Apr 23, 2010
Messages
364
Good night spotty, the rest of us have to go to bed to dream!! and I have to be up at 6.30 am to go to work.
You should be thankful you have a job. If it wasn't for the sure-footedness of Brian Lenihan, we could have an unemployment crisis in the country on top of everything else. As it is, it's only 13%. One in ten. Not that bad at all.
 

slippy wicket

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Joined
Mar 10, 2010
Messages
4,492
You should be thankful you have a job. If it wasn't for the sure-footedness of Brian Lenihan, we could have an unemployment crisis in the country on top of everything else. As it is, it's only 13%. One in ten. Not that bad at all.
A come on, you must be taking the piss.
Seriously, if you believe that , or even worse if the fat pig and the rest of the roadkill in waiting in the cabinet believe it we are truly screwed.:eek:
 
G

Gimpanzee

In actual fact the 1980s was dominated by a coalition of the far right and the far left - Labour and Fine Gael. They ran the country into the ground. It took unprecedented patriotism and determination by the Fianna Fáil party to pull our nation out of a tailspin and back on the road to growth and prosperity.

And we did it all without a national debt clock, I'll have you know.

There can be no doubt that we live in challenging times.

The collapse of Lehman brothers and the global financial crisis caused by George W Bush damaged Ireland greatly.

These past few years have required every Irishman to strain every sinew and stretch every muscle and bear every load conceivable.

We in Fianna Fáil have taken the hard decisions. Some of them have been painful.

But we have done so without shirking our sacred duty - people before party, state before self, the national interest before the popular choice.

Now, we are finally seeing that those hard decisions are paying off. Our bonds are oversubscribed. The international markets have confidence. The jobless rate is levelling out. The country is has been dragged by sheer force of will out of its tailspin and into a gentle glide.

Now is the time to fire up the engines of recovery. Now is the time to shoulder the burden of initiative. Now is the moment to renew ourselves once more.

The corner has been turned. The nation saved from oblivion. Fianna Fáil has performed it's sacred duty once more. On to prosperity.
Positively guff-tastic.
 

rgaok

Well-known member
Joined
May 18, 2010
Messages
1,907
In actual fact the 1980s was dominated by a coalition of the far right and the far left - Labour and Fine Gael. They ran the country into the ground. It took unprecedented patriotism and determination by the Fianna Fáil party to pull our nation out of a tailspin and back on the road to growth and prosperity.

And we did it all without a national debt clock, I'll have you know.

There can be no doubt that we live in challenging times.

The collapse of Lehman brothers and the global financial crisis caused by George W Bush damaged Ireland greatly.

These past few years have required every Irishman to strain every sinew and stretch every muscle and bear every load conceivable.

We in Fianna Fáil have taken the hard decisions. Some of them have been painful.

But we have done so without shirking our sacred duty - people before party, state before self, the national interest before the popular choice.

Now, we are finally seeing that those hard decisions are paying off. Our bonds are oversubscribed. The international markets have confidence. The jobless rate is levelling out. The country is has been dragged by sheer force of will out of its tailspin and into a gentle glide.

Now is the time to fire up the engines of recovery. Now is the time to shoulder the burden of initiative. Now is the moment to renew ourselves once more.

The corner has been turned. The nation saved from oblivion. Fianna Fáil has performed it's sacred duty once more. On to prosperity.


Is that you, Bertie?
 

KENNY POWERS

Active member
Joined
Sep 10, 2010
Messages
149
You should be thankful you have a job. If it wasn't for the sure-footedness of Brian Lenihan, we could have an unemployment crisis in the country on top of everything else. As it is, it's only 13%. One in ten. Not that bad at all.
If Fianna fail are the guardians if the Irish soul, then we truly are all in hell.
Troll on Spotty!
 

oggy

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 28, 2009
Messages
8,900
I do not propose to post a link to that website from these parts, but I note that Fine Gael have added a clock to their homepage which purports - I stress the word - to count the monies being added to the national debt by the Government's national restoration plan.

We can therefore take it that this clock is being endorsed by Fine Gael.

Since the infamous day when they took a shilling off the old age pension, through the historic display of meanness that was the attempt to tax childrens shoes, and right up till this moment, Fine Gael have been a party that simply do not want to spend money.

They have repeatedly shown, throughout their history, that they will begrudge a pensioner a few pence and a child a pair of shoes because they are so mean.

Once again today, we are seeing evidence of the party's historic meanness. This national debt is essential to pay for essential services, including the Dáil, local councillors, údarás na Gaeilge, and a range of other bodies. Without us incurring this debt, there are countless men and women who would go hungry. Banks would collapse. The airport would close. The EU would throw us out. The GAA would see attendances plummet. The average joe could no longer buy a pint.

This debt is keeping us in business. The fact that Fine Gael are attacking it is evidence that they would sooner see people starve than spend the money necessary. But sure we knew that. The pensioners knew it back in 1930.
Keep up the good work Spotty, to me your losts are a cross between a wind up of the 99% of posters who are ABFF and a carefully calculated reflection of the facts in the real world. The ABFF live in fear of failure again and its no harm reminding them
 

Bleu Poppy

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 1, 2010
Messages
4,485
I do not propose to post a link to that website from these parts, but I note that Fine Gael have added a clock to their homepage which purports - I stress the word - to count the monies being added to the national debt by the Government's national restoration plan.

We can therefore take it that this clock is being endorsed by Fine Gael.

Since the infamous day when they took a shilling off the old age pension, through the historic display of meanness that was the attempt to tax childrens shoes, and right up till this moment, Fine Gael have been a party that simply do not want to spend money.

They have repeatedly shown, throughout their history, that they will begrudge a pensioner a few pence and a child a pair of shoes because they are so mean.

Once again today, we are seeing evidence of the party's historic meanness. This national debt is essential to pay for essential services, including the Dáil, local councillors, údarás na Gaeilge, and a range of other bodies. Without us incurring this debt, there are countless men and women who would go hungry. Banks would collapse. The airport would close. The EU would throw us out. The GAA would see attendances plummet. The average joe could no longer buy a pint.

This debt is keeping us in business. The fact that Fine Gael are attacking it is evidence that they would sooner see people starve than spend the money necessary. But sure we knew that. The pensioners knew it back in 1930.
Sweet mother of all that is good and holy, acne-puss is back!

Anyway, when the Cumman na n-Gaedhael government dropped the old age pension by 1 shilling it was at a time that the economy had, and was, contracting severely. The cost of living had gone down, and was going down, dramatically arising from the departure of the British army, Royal Navy, R.A.F.- the military complex that fed itself on the fresh produce from our farms, and factories producing processed foods such as cured pork products, condensed milk, etc. Other factors included the significant withdrawal of those with means from the country after independence, not to mention the fact that heavy industry, sited in N.I. was no longer a driver of growth in the economy, etc., etc.. Difficult though it is to acknowledge, the move was economically and fiscally justifiable.

By the by, this occurred in 1924- not 1930, which (once again) demonstrates your fantastic grasp of the MaFFia's propaganda and your distinct lack of knowledge and information on the history of our country. The proposal was carried by some 61 votes to 19 which gives a very strong indication that the Dáil of the day believed that it was a good proposal.

Another requirement at the time was the need to consolidate the national finances- which also had to be stretched to undo the damage caused by a disastrous Civil War- brought about by armed irregular forces illegally occupying the centre of administration of justice. And don't give me the "who fired the first shot?" ráiméis that I've been listening to for some 34 years and more.

Furthermore, the nascent State also needed new infrastructure and the monies that otherwise might have been spent on drink or saved in unproductive fashion, went into the establishment of the E.S.B. and the construction of a national grid to provide for better futures for the people of the new country.

Anyway, back on topic. When the illegitimate offspring of Kate Coll came to power, did he restore the shilling? Nottatall boy. He just set about destroying the farm based economy of the State through refusing to pay over the land annuities (which, by the way, he continued to collect from Irish farmers) to the British Exchequer. This led to tariffs on Irish exports to the U.K. Ultimately, the Irish State did reach agreement with Whitehall- 90% of the monies owing were paid over in one fell swoop instead of over the previously agreed time span which was to run up to the 1960's.

But shure, when you want your country to be a backward introverted isolated little island bobbing around the Atlantic, there's nothing that you won't stoop to in order to castrate it economically.

Furthermore, perhaps the shilling might not have had to have been deducted had Coll's bastard child handed over to Michael Collins (the State's 1st Minister for Finance) the monies that he raised after he was rescued from Lincoln Jail and dispatched to the U.S. to promote the cause of Independence and to raise funds for the cause. But no, even after he was defeated he would not hand the monies over to the legitimate government but held onto it and used it to found and fund a party rag.

In respect of the failed Bruton Budget in 1982- the objective was not to tax children but to ensure that there was no tax evasion / avoidance.... which, I believe, is the main reason that the MaFFia object to it so frequently. Shure, even the Taoiseach's brother is on for that bit of sport, and has had to make a settlement with the Irish Revenue. Shure, even the previous Taoiseach has made a settlement with the Revenue, as did his great hero, Charlie Charvet Shi[r]ts, yet another MaFFia Taoiseach.

Borrowing for constructive purposes is to be welcomed- especially for literally those purposes. That is, for capital projects that will assist economic growth.
Borrowing for current expenditure, that is to pay salaries, benefits, and so forth, should only be done with the utmost caution and with very short term valid objectives in sight.

Unfortunately, vast sums are being borrowed, at historically high interest rates, to pay (amongst other things) seriously inflated salaries in the public service- particularly at the top. One of the craziest things is the so-called pension levy on all civil and public servant salaries. A hospital manager, for example, still has to budget for, and find, the full cost of a surgeon or nurse's salary before skimming of the requisite percentage of the Levy to forward to Lennie. That is serious VOODOO fiscal policy.

However, at the moment, the biggest borrowings are being made and are being sunk into failed banks for reasons which have yet to be adequately explained.

FG has always known when to borrow. They did it in the 70's to stave off the worst of the economic cold winds arising from not one but two oil crises. FG did it again in the 80's in order to assist the Irish economy adjust without going into deflation after the mad mad years of the Jack Lynch-Martin O'Donoghue and Charlie Haughey-Gene Fitzgerald governments.

The rest of your comments are so off the wall that they defy logic. Ergo, they cannot be responded to.
 
Last edited:

Joopface

Active member
Joined
Apr 9, 2010
Messages
108
Sure, this is great. The national debt's only 20 grand per person.

All we need to do is put fake salary amounts on headed paper, get our parents to cosign for us, and lob into d'local high street bank. It'll mean spending our 20k on the national interest instead of a 2010 reg car, but if we can't all make sacrifices in this crisis...
 


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