Free Trade and economics

yosef shompeter

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZnUJZOgsaY

Italian Economy Forces Many to Keep Living With Parents: Video

The recent Italian elections have focused attention on Italy's stagnating economy. Stagnating? Well it's more complicated than that. Northern Italy is home to some of Europe's richer regions, it's the poor south that's stagnating.
What went wrong and what went right?

Change of scene: Trump's economic policy of slapping tariffs on steel and aluminium at first sight doesn't seem to make "open-market" sense. In the ideal free-trade scenario a country produces what it can do best or cheapest -- it exploits its economic advantage.
But certain products are strategic. The production of micro-chips is not the same as the production of potato-chips as there are so many jobs upstream and downstream and linkages.

I read some time ago that the Germans have a low-wage economy, but they top up the workers wages with some sort of dole or supplement. That way they have managed to hold on to their industrial base and avoid mass unemployment.
China can compete with its low-wage and low currency economy and has managed to effect a massive transfer of wealth since it opened up in the 1990's
I'm sure the US is sore that Chines firms like Xioamai are now competing with Apple. Likewise the Germans and French as the Chinese now have their own rapid rail systems... They found the ideas and knowhow from Altrom and Siemens to be very useful indeed.

So how did Italy not follow the example of the Germans. How did they allow things to get so bad?

We might learn a few lessons ourselves from all this.
The free open economy only exists in an ideal world. I believe that all sorts of subsidies are available to lure Auto companies to set up plants in Europe. Is this correct?
 


Spirit Of Newgrange

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is it still the case that the GATT talks ( General Agreement of Tariffs & Trade) will always give priority to produce made in the EU & the US meanwhile never focussing on the stuff that developing countries produce ?

So we remove the tariffs on Software and crucify Coffee producers ?
 

mr_anderson

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[video=youtube;uXVVJSIWrCI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uXVVJSIWrCI[/video]
 

Watcher2

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May 2, 2010
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZnUJZOgsaY

Italian Economy Forces Many to Keep Living With Parents: Video

The recent Italian elections have focused attention on Italy's stagnating economy. Stagnating? Well it's more complicated than that. Northern Italy is home to some of Europe's richer regions, it's the poor south that's stagnating.
What went wrong and what went right?

Change of scene: Trump's economic policy of slapping tariffs on steel and aluminium at first sight doesn't seem to make "open-market" sense. In the ideal free-trade scenario a country produces what it can do best or cheapest -- it exploits its economic advantage.
But certain products are strategic. The production of micro-chips is not the same as the production of potato-chips as there are so many jobs upstream and downstream and linkages.

I read some time ago that the Germans have a low-wage economy, but they top up the workers wages with some sort of dole or supplement. That way they have managed to hold on to their industrial base and avoid mass unemployment.
China can compete with its low-wage and low currency economy and has managed to effect a massive transfer of wealth since it opened up in the 1990's
I'm sure the US is sore that Chines firms like Xioamai are now competing with Apple. Likewise the Germans and French as the Chinese now have their own rapid rail systems... They found the ideas and knowhow from Altrom and Siemens to be very useful indeed.

So how did Italy not follow the example of the Germans. How did they allow things to get so bad?

We might learn a few lessons ourselves from all this.
The free open economy only exists in an ideal world. I believe that all sorts of subsidies are available to lure Auto companies to set up plants in Europe. Is this correct?
I forget all the figures, but during Burlesconis last reign, the Italian economy grew by a meagre percent (possibly 1 for the whole term) meanwhile Silvios empire grew by a lucrative sum. There are only so many interests that can be covered off you know.
 

Barroso

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is it still the case that the GATT talks ( General Agreement of Tariffs & Trade) will always give priority to produce made in the EU & the US meanwhile never focussing on the stuff that developing countries produce ?

So we remove the tariffs on Software and crucify Coffee producers ?
GATT is gone.
It's the World Trade Organisation now.
Did you not follow Peter Sutherland's career?
 

owedtojoy

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Feb 27, 2010
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[video=youtube;uXVVJSIWrCI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uXVVJSIWrCI[/video]
Italy was certainly worse off with the corrupt and self-serving Silvio Berlusconi, his responsibility for the state Italy is in was somehow left out of the OP. When he took office, Italy had an economy much the size of the UKs. now it's GDP is ~75% of the UK's.

His disastrous reign is a warning for any country who thinks of electing a "strongman" preaching simple snake-oil solutions. That cure is worse than the disease.
 

owedtojoy

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Messages
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZnUJZOgsaY

Italian Economy Forces Many to Keep Living With Parents: Video

The recent Italian elections have focused attention on Italy's stagnating economy. Stagnating? Well it's more complicated than that. Northern Italy is home to some of Europe's richer regions, it's the poor south that's stagnating.
What went wrong and what went right?

Change of scene: Trump's economic policy of slapping tariffs on steel and aluminium at first sight doesn't seem to make "open-market" sense. In the ideal free-trade scenario a country produces what it can do best or cheapest -- it exploits its economic advantage.
But certain products are strategic. The production of micro-chips is not the same as the production of potato-chips as there are so many jobs upstream and downstream and linkages.

I read some time ago that the Germans have a low-wage economy, but they top up the workers wages with some sort of dole or supplement. That way they have managed to hold on to their industrial base and avoid mass unemployment.
China can compete with its low-wage and low currency economy and has managed to effect a massive transfer of wealth since it opened up in the 1990's
I'm sure the US is sore that Chines firms like Xioamai are now competing with Apple. Likewise the Germans and French as the Chinese now have their own rapid rail systems... They found the ideas and knowhow from Altrom and Siemens to be very useful indeed.

So how did Italy not follow the example of the Germans. How did they allow things to get so bad?

We might learn a few lessons ourselves from all this.
The free open economy only exists in an ideal world. I believe that all sorts of subsidies are available to lure Auto companies to set up plants in Europe. Is this correct?
The main subsidy is a skilled workforce that makes well-designed and manufactured cars.

Better than any the Americans can come up with, it seems.

Wealthy Americans don't buy German luxury cars because they are cheap.
 

Trainwreck

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The main subsidy is a skilled workforce that makes well-designed and manufactured cars.

Better than any the Americans can come up with, it seems.

Wealthy Americans don't buy German luxury cars because they are cheap.
You do know where most of those German cars are made right?


I can only shake my head at the regular beclowning of our resident idiots like Owed. "Because Germany has a skilled workforce!... [SUB]to manufacture those cars in America[/SUB]...."
 

firefly123

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is it still the case that the GATT talks ( General Agreement of Tariffs & Trade) will always give priority to produce made in the EU & the US meanwhile never focussing on the stuff that developing countries produce ?

So we remove the tariffs on Software and crucify Coffee producers ?
Quite the opposite actually...
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Everything_but_Arms

Everything but Arms (EBA) is an initiative of the European Union under which all imports to the EU from the Least Developed Countries are duty-free and quota-free, with the exception of armaments.
Horrid EU!
 

firefly123

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Italy was certainly worse off with the corrupt and self-serving Silvio Berlusconi, his responsibility for the state Italy is in was somehow left out of the OP. When he took office, Italy had an economy much the size of the UKs. now it's GDP is ~75% of the UK's.

His disastrous reign is a warning for any country who thinks of electing a "strongman" preaching simple snake-oil solutions. That cure is worse than the disease.
25% of its GDP went on hair dye alone
 

firefly123

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You do know where most of those German cars are made right?


I can only shake my head at the regular beclowning of our resident idiots like Owed. "Because Germany has a skilled workforce!... [SUB]to manufacture those cars in America[/SUB]...."
Designed and managed by ze germans.
 

Trainwreck

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Designed and managed by ze germans.
Ouch!


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Bangle

Christopher Edward "Chris" Bangle (born October 14, 1956) is an American automobile designer. Bangle is known best for his work as Chief of Design for BMW Group, where he was responsible for the BMW, MINI and Rolls-Royce motor cars.

Facts bite. Those spouting bullshít founded on brainless ideological programming are especially vulnerable to attack.
 

firefly123

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Ouch!


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chris_Bangle




Facts bite. Those spouting bullshít founded on brainless ideological programming are especially vulnerable to attack.
I'm sure he drew all the pictures.
jaysus lad I know you're smarter than that.
yanks pay a premium for Beemers and mercs because they are premium items. the vast bulk of the design process is done by Europeans and mostly Germans but I'm sure there are some Americans too.
are we really having this level of conversation?
 

Dame_Enda

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Dec 14, 2011
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Free trade has decimated manufacturing and textiles in the West. If the West ends up in a war with Asian countries, the latter will have an advantage in raw materials (though maybe less so with oil because of Shale, but thats banned in some countries including France).
 


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