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Gardai evidence in Love and Slurry Murder Trial


Cdebru

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Jan 4, 2006
Messages
5,470
Yes the Gardai were pretty terrible. That's irrelevant. The jury found him guilty because however bad the Gardai were there was still enough to convict.

Blood

Have you ever been in a milking parlor? It's just about the easiest place to get rid of blood. And if the killing took place in a yard a hosepipe used pretty quickly would wash away blood. A farm is full of dirt, which is why it's also a place that has oodles of water and it would be perfectly normal to be hose downing a yard.

Mary Shaking

Bobby had confessed to her that he had had suicidal feelings on occassion. He felt bad that his marriage had broken down. It would be more likely Bobby felt he could say these things to his lover rather than to his children. You want to protect your children and you're not going to be telling them how low you feel or how you miss a loving relationship with their mother as parents we don't talk to our kids about such things. So I believe that Mary was frantic with worry that he had killed himself.

Going away with Quirke

Mary probably believed Bobby had taken his own life. She had zero reason to be suspicious of Quirke as a murderer. Who amongst us would imagine our ex lover killed our current lover. It's the stuff of movies. It does happen. Occassionally. But it's not the first idea that would spring to mind. The fact she left her home forever the day Bobby's body was found shows a woman in fear who couldn't believe her lover was murdered. She wanted to get as far away from it as possible.

Texts

The Ryan children are naturally distraught and angry. They don't know what happened. They clearly suspect Mary. They didn't like her it seems. Children, even adult children, don't normally take to their parents new lovers. So that's at play here. The phone was not 'hopping' it was stated in court but the actual evidence was there were two text messages from Mary. And two back to her.

Defense Tactics

They've clearly worked on you. And I see Bobby's daugher has now given an interview to a rag stating that Quirke did not act alone.

House

We were all incorrectly led to believe blood was found in the house and that Mary had covered it up by getting the place repainted. If you were a murderer you would have scrubbed that room and repainted immediately. Not a couple of years down the line.

Motive

What motive could you ascribe to Mary being involved?
Gardai
I disagree ( not that I believe he is innocent I just don't think there was enough there to convict beyond reasonable doubt), I think a really poor investigation opens reasonable doubt.

Blood
Blood is pretty hard to get rid of completely, especially as the medical evidence is lots of it, and if it was with a baseball bat or similar you are looking at spatter hard to eradicate completely. especially giving that he left to go away for the weekend with his wife, was in his own milk shed around 8 had to dump van walk back, strip and dump the body etc. If blood was allowed to dry harder to remove

Mary Shaking
It is not just the shaking, it is rushing the son out of the farm, the apologising, the steering the kids in the direction of suicide when he had been missing for a couple of hours, his van hadn't even been found at that stage. Taking down his missing poster from near her house.

Going away with Quirke
Her evidence was that she suspected him and wanted to see if she could find out more, sounds like BS

Defence tactics
I would tend to agree with the daughter the layout of the farm getting him to the run off pit ? the time frame, leaving the body somewhere while he dumped the vehicle, the clean up, and heading away for the weekend at lunch time.

House
The point is that the Gardai failed to conduct proper searches anywhere, in Mary's house, the milking parlor, the van, the field car etc etc, they left the door open to the defence to point the finger by not closing off alternative avenues.


Motive

You could speculate, covering up an accident.

An escalation of a domestic argument

Jealousy

Fear, witnessed something and was afraid or blackmailed into silence.


One other odd thing

Why disclose the body, I get that he had to be off the property, but why not retrieve and dispose of it elsewhere, why call in the Gardai ?
 


SuirView

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Joined
Mar 29, 2012
Messages
12,361
Gardai
I disagree ( not that I believe he is innocent I just don't think there was enough there to convict beyond reasonable doubt), I think a really poor investigation opens reasonable doubt.

Blood
Blood is pretty hard to get rid of completely, especially as the medical evidence is lots of it, and if it was with a baseball bat or similar you are looking at spatter hard to eradicate completely. especially giving that he left to go away for the weekend with his wife, was in his own milk shed around 8 had to dump van walk back, strip and dump the body etc. If blood was allowed to dry harder to remove

Mary Shaking
It is not just the shaking, it is rushing the son out of the farm, the apologising, the steering the kids in the direction of suicide when he had been missing for a couple of hours, his van hadn't even been found at that stage. Taking down his missing poster from near her house.

Going away with Quirke
Her evidence was that she suspected him and wanted to see if she could find out more, sounds like BS

Defence tactics
I would tend to agree with the daughter the layout of the farm getting him to the run off pit ? the time frame, leaving the body somewhere while he dumped the vehicle, the clean up, and heading away for the weekend at lunch time.

House
The point is that the Gardai failed to conduct proper searches anywhere, in Mary's house, the milking parlor, the van, the field car etc etc, they left the door open to the defence to point the finger by not closing off alternative avenues.


Motive

You could speculate, covering up an accident.

An escalation of a domestic argument

Jealousy

Fear, witnessed something and was afraid or blackmailed into silence.


One other odd thing

Why disclose the body, I get that he had to be off the property, but why not retrieve and dispose of it elsewhere, why call in the Gardai ?
I didn't know that a "baseball bat" was mentioned during the trial.
 

Emily Davison

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Jun 9, 2013
Messages
30,269
Tell me how you think he could have taken a badly decomposed body out of a deep pit? It's one thing dumping a 'fresh' body into a pit, taking it out is an altogether different job. Have you seen knackers taking away dead animals?

His fatal mistake was that he actually created a tomb, with no insect access. No worm access. I was surprised at that, because he's a farmer and even without google he should have known the basics of decomposition.
 

Emily Davison

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Jun 9, 2013
Messages
30,269
I didn't know that a "baseball bat" was mentioned during the trial.
Not sure about that, I think it's a possible 'weapon'. They don't know what was used. But I guess anything long and hard. As it's Ireland I find the baseball bat unlikely. He could have used a shovel. Or a golf club. Or a hurley maybe.
 

redneck

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May 5, 2007
Messages
6,615
Regarding this trial there is a case, in my opinion, to have put Mary Lowery up as an accomplice. It was she who "lured" Mr Ryan to the house with a series of text messages. She had been warned not to do this by her boyfriend - Quirke.
 

Cdebru

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I didn't know that a "baseball bat" was mentioned during the trial.

It was by the coroner from the North, said he had seen punishment beatings with baseball bats and some of Mr Ryans injuries were consistent with that.
Southern coroners said it was consistent with being hit by a vehicle.
 

Cdebru

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Jan 4, 2006
Messages
5,470
Regarding this trial there is a case, in my opinion, to have put Mary Lowery up as an accomplice. It was she who "lured" Mr Ryan to the house with a series of text messages. She had been warned not to do this by her boyfriend - Quirke.
Redneck is not just your name then ?

You are an idiot.
 

WayOutWest

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Aug 20, 2013
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It was by the coroner from the North, said he had seen punishment beatings with baseball bats and some of Mr Ryans injuries were consistent with that.
Southern coroners said it was consistent with being hit by a vehicle.
Yes all our coroners agreed the injuries could have been the result of being hit by a vehicle but the Northern expert didn’t disagree with them. It was only his opinion that it wasn’t a vehicle. He agreed that falling concrete during the removal could cause injuries and influence a pathologist’s findings. What we do not know is how many experts were contacted before one was found who would give a suitable opinion.
One would have thought that the body would have been videoed in the tank and also the removal of tank cover and body especially so as no pathologist attended the scene.
 

Frank Miller

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Apr 16, 2019
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Not sure about that, I think it's a possible 'weapon'. They don't know what was used. But I guess anything long and hard. As it's Ireland I find the baseball bat unlikely. He could have used a shovel. Or a golf club. Or a hurley maybe.
There is a big sale of baseball bats in Ireland but strangely very little sale of actual baseballs
 

redneck

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When the body was found it was not Mr Quirke who called the Gardai, it was Imelda Quirke.
 

SuirView

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When the body was found it was not Mr Quirke who called the Gardai, it was Imelda Quirke.
Imelda rang a guard,
Her friend Garda Tom Neville.
 

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