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Gender is NOT a social construction


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While discussing gay marriages I pointed out there are differences between males and females crucial for upbringing of a well balanced child. I was told that wasn't true and that 'gender was a social construction'.

It appears it is not. Significant differences between female and male brains do exist and these are resposnible for male and female behavior.

http://www.sciam.com/print_version.cfm? ... 414B7F0000
 

rockofcashel

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Oh by the way however, I do agree that gender is not a social construction however.

Men have mickeys, women don't. (Cept Hayley maybe)

I've yet to hear a good argument yet though as to what having or not having a mickey has to do with raising children
 

smiffy

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rockofcashel said:
Oh by the way however, I do agree that gender is not a social construction however.
Possibly, although some aspects of gender identity might well be.

All our friend has shown by citing that article is that there are certain biological differences between men and women. Good for him. It might have been more impressive, however, if anyone disagreed with this.

What he has failed to show is what those differences actually are, and what political positions one should take on the basis of them (including, as you say, what difference having a penis makes to raising children).
 
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smiffy said:
Good for him. It might have been more impressive, however, if anyone disagreed with this.

TheBear

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Views: 5032
Forum: Current Affairs Posted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 3:32 pm Subject: Tax break for gay couples

The idea of gender roles is a social construction.
Will you kids stop talking about the penises and vaginas now. The article I linked in the opening post is about the brain.
 

Paraic

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The Conservative Dubliner said:
While discussing gay marriages I pointed out there are differences between males and females crucial for upbringing of a well balanced child. I was told that wasn't true and that 'gender was a social construction'.
It is well documented and uncontroversial that there exist significant structural differences (in overall volume, in the hypothalamus, etc.) between the brains of males and females. The influence of these differences on behaviour and abilities is much more controversial.

How does the article you've linked to support the contention implied by the phrase I've emphasised above?

The Conservative Dubliner said:
It appears it is not. Significant differences between female and male brains do exist and these are resposnible for male and female behavior.
Huh?

You might want to refine this.

Paraic
 

smiffy

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The Conservative Dubliner said:
smiffy said:
Good for him. It might have been more impressive, however, if anyone disagreed with this.

TheBear

Replies: 399
Views: 5032
Forum: Current Affairs Posted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 3:32 pm Subject: Tax break for gay couples

The idea of gender roles is a social construction.
Please read my post again. I said:

All our friend has shown by citing that article is that there are certain biological differences between men and women. Good for him. It might have been more impressive, however, if anyone disagreed with this.
The "this" referred to the phrase "there are certain biological differences between men and women", not to the 'gender as social construction' argument.

Will you kids stop talking about the penises and vaginas now. The article I linked in the opening post is about the brain.
Tell you what: make a point, address the arguments that have been put, and then maybe people will stop talking about pensises.
 

Paraic

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rockofcashel said:
Oh by the way however, I do agree that gender is not a social construction however.

Men have mickeys, women don't. (Cept Hayley maybe)
Mickeys are a characteristic of sex, not gender.

Paraic
 

TheBear

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rockofcashel said:
Oh by the way however, I do agree that gender is not a social construction however.

Men have mickeys, women don't. (Cept Hayley maybe)
I was going to respond to this, but then I realised that Paraic had taken the words right out of my mouth. In this discussion, we should really clarify the terms which we are going to use, as failing to do so, and having different people using one term in a number of ways will lead to confusion. Sex (a biological concept) and gender (a sociological concept) are different things.

rockofcashel said:
I've yet to hear a good argument yet though as to what having or not having a mickey has to do with raising children
You even go ahead and make the point for us. The biological sex of a person has nothing to do with their ability to fulfil either of the stereotypical gender roles.

The Conservative Dubliner, you have outed me. Oh, the shame! :cry: Imagine actually being held to account for the things I said, etc... I know that it was me who said it. I will defend the position as soon as you provide me with anything I actually need to defend it against. My real position, mind, not one that you just make up for me. I've had enough of that for one day.

Aside:
Paraic said:
It is well documented and uncontroversial that there exist significant structural differences (in overall volume, in the hypothalamus, etc.) between the brains of males and females. The influence of these differences on behaviour and abilities is much less controversial.
Just wondering, did you mean 'more' controversial here?
 

Lilac

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The biological sex of a person has nothing to do with their ability to fulfil either of the stereotypical gender roles.
Wrong!
Nothing and nobody could ever replace a mother!
You see in nature: A baby animal dies when the mother isn't able to care for it, for instance, if she was shot or the like.
 

pluralist

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Lilac said:
The biological sex of a person has nothing to do with their ability to fulfil either of the stereotypical gender roles.
Wrong!
Nothing and nobody could ever replace a mother!
You see in nature: A baby animal dies when the mother isn't able to care for it, for instance, if she was shot or the like.
Really? How. Interesting.

So, what about hermaphodrite species, how does it work with them?
 

Paraic

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TheBear said:
Paraic said:
It is well documented and uncontroversial that there exist significant structural differences (in overall volume, in the hypothalamus, etc.) between the brains of males and females. The influence of these differences on behaviour and abilities is much less controversial.
Just wondering, did you mean 'more' controversial here?
Yikes. Yes, 'more controversial'. I've edited the blooper, thanks.

Paraic
 

Zariatnatmick

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Apr 4, 2005
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This thread is based on a terminological misunderstanding. Gender is defined as "Sexual identity, especially in relation to society or culture". Granted, this is not the only definition and the word has previously been used to serve the same meaning as "sex". In recent decades "gender" has come to be used in a more specific sense by anthropologists, psychologists and sociologists - which is altogether sensible because of the fact that "sex" adequately spanned the biological aspect while the language was not equipped with a word for the social/cultural aspect. To make it clearer for those who are not familiar with the idea, an example of a gender characteristic is the fact that women once wore dresses while men wore trousers, or that women wear make-up and men do not (generally - and when they do it is considered to be "feminine"). These have nothing directly to do with biology. In a sense - sex is genetic; gender is mimetic. The real debate here is whether or not parenting roles and such things pertain to sex or gender.
 
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