Govt. Loses Vote in Seanad

consultant

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I don't have full details but I hears that an opposition motion on the election of members was passed in the Seanad this evening.

Some independents who normally support th government abstained or were missing, others voted for the motion.
 


nonpartyboy

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The wheels are definitely coming off now.
 

EvotingMachine0197

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Fianna Fáil leader in the House Donie Cassidy confirmed that Independent Senator Fiona O'Malley voted against the Government in tonight's vote.
Are they smelling the coffee ?
 

Newsy

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DCon

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Tea Party Patriot

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I have to say given the motion in question that this is a good thing. I have a vote myself on the NUI panel but I have always considered the senate to be a totally undemocratic institution that is as much a home for party hacks and retired TDs as anything else. The handful of independent senators (few of whom i agree with on policy) have been the only ones to brighten the place up.
 

EvotingMachine0197

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I have to say given the motion in question that this is a good thing. I have a vote myself on the NUI panel but I have always considered the senate to be a totally undemocratic institution that is as much a home for party hacks and retired TDs as anything else. The handful of independent senators (few of whom i agree with on policy) have been the only ones to brighten the place up.
I'm not convinced the reform is going to be of any use. My vote is on the TCD panel - same as NUI with 3 seats.

Against a backdrop of 60 seats, the whole Uni thing was a farce anyway. Ahern with 11, had almost twice what the two Uni panels had put together.

Leaving 43 to the Party appointee system.... doomed.

I think all 60 seats should be appointed based on nominations from our university system across all fields of knowledge - medicine, law, economics, engineering, business, technology etc.

I'm going to get killed for that. :cool:
 

DCon

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I think all 60 seats should be appointed based on nominations from our university system across all fields of knowledge - medicine, law, economics, engineering, business, technology etc.
Good idea, but if it was proposed, CIF, the Vintners, ICTU etc etc etc would all want some seats too
 

EvotingMachine0197

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Good idea, but if it was proposed, CIF, the Vintners, ICTU etc etc etc would all want some seats too
Well those guys already have the quango boards wrapped up - or so I would argue.

The Senate is just an utter farce as it is currently constituted. Its like a mobile home permanently parked beside the main residence. Everything is plumbed in and out, and same rules apply. Its an expansion vessel for hot air.

Ideally, if we are to retain the Senate, I would prefer it were 60 people with no political allegiance* whatsoever.

They couldn't even stop the stupid Blasphemy legislation FFS.

*Naturally, every human forms a political opinion. However, some humans focus more on their professions than on their politics.
 

breakingnews

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Well if there's any doubt about the abolition of the seanad, this farce clears it up. Several senators didn't even bother turning up to vote.
 

Warren Poynt

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Excuse me.......but what makes some posters here support the idea of those who were fortunate enough to go to Third Level, having TWO parliamentary votes to the exclusion of all other citizens.

Such a concept is outrageously elitist and probably harks back to an 'us and them' attitude redolent of those who considered themselves superior to the the common man and woman by virtue of their background and education.

How dare they !

And to think some of our fellow citizens are considering 'tweaking;' or 'reforming' this concept as a way 'forward' into the 21st century is outrageous, cyclopic and discriminatory.

Do we need a bi-cameral parliament at all ? For the past 73 years the Senate/Seanad it has been treated as a rest home for failed politicians and an incubator for wannabees.

If this is how we see the future for our Second Chamber, God help us !

We already have a Presidential and Council of State check process on parliamentary legisaltion.

Is this not enough ?

While we're at it, shouldn't the Dail be reduced to, say, 100 deputies (Israel does very well on 120 members in the Knesset, thank you).

And could the seating arrangements in the Chamber be re-jigged so that persons elected would sit next to those of the first letter of their surname, rather than in party adverserial blocs. This obtains in Norway.

Any proposal to give some Irish people extra votes - and, therefore, extra parliamentary seats - strikes me as gross favouritism and discrimination. A bit like the practice of giving property owners and rate-payers extra votes in the Six Counties of old.

Wake up.

This country needs to be made more democaratic......not less.
 

Johnny64

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Where does this motion go from here?

My peference for Oireachtas reform would be to abolish the Senate, make all the current constituencies one seaters and have the rest of the TD's elected on a list system regional basis, using maybe the European constituencies.
Put and end to parish pumping, get the TD's to get on with the national job
 

consultant

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Where does this motion go from here?

My peference for Oireachtas reform would be to abolish the Senate, make all the current constituencies one seaters and have the rest of the TD's elected on a list system regional basis, using maybe the European constituencies.
Put and end to parish pumping, get the TD's to get on with the national job

Other than the visibility of a lost vote for the government and perhaps a token gesture towards Seanad reform, there doesn't seem to be a lot of relevance in the issue per se. But on those two fronts alone it constitutes an embarrasment for FF and the greens.

The questions re where the government vote was and why at this juncture its supporting independents failed to back the government might prove enlightening though, or at least the answers to these questions might.

Personally, I would tend towards your preference for reform.
 

FrankSpeaks

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Will the government be forced to implement the changes that the Seanad voted for?

Personally I am in favour of them.
 


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