Greens Surging across Europe

Jack Walsh

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There are dozens of topics on this site dealing with far right parties and the far right in general.
We are consistently told here it is surging through Europe, even after repeated election flops.
However, the Greens have been the story of 2018 in Europe

They are polling well almost everywhere, but astonishingly so in German, where they are now as high as 23% in recent days.

What a deep irony for all the frothing fascists praying for Merkel's Government to fall, only to be replaced by a genuine left wing coalition (SPD/Greens and Linke)

Is this Green surge capable of lasting or is it a temporary recoil in disgust at the far right fervour (which appears to have topped out across Europe)
 


twokidsmanybruises

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There are dozens of topics on this site dealing with far right parties and the far right in general.
We are consistently told here it is surging through Europe, even after repeated election flops.
However, the Greens have been the story of 2018 in Europe

They are polling well almost everywhere, but astonishingly so in German, where they are now as high as 23% in recent days.

What a deep irony for all the frothing fascists praying for Merkel's Government to fall, only to be replaced by a genuine left wing coalition (SPD/Greens and Linke)

Is this Green surge capable of lasting or is it a temporary recoil in disgust at the far right fervour (which appears to have topped out across Europe)
The German Greens have a far heftier political lineage than that of their equivalents in Ireland and other countries:

https://www.nytimes.com/1983/02/13/magazine/germany-s-volatile-greens.html
 

midlander12

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There are dozens of topics on this site dealing with far right parties and the far right in general.
We are consistently told here it is surging through Europe, even after repeated election flops.
However, the Greens have been the story of 2018 in Europe

They are polling well almost everywhere, but astonishingly so in German, where they are now as high as 23% in recent days.

What a deep irony for all the frothing fascists praying for Merkel's Government to fall, only to be replaced by a genuine left wing coalition (SPD/Greens and Linke)

Is this Green surge capable of lasting or is it a temporary recoil in disgust at the far right fervour (which appears to have topped out across Europe)
The Green 'surge' in Germany has been almost entirely at the expense of the SPD, which is in freefall. Left-wing voters clearly see the SPD as nothing more than a prop for Merkel and are simply opting for the real thing. A similar process unfortunately has been happening between the CDU and the AFD. Apart from Germany, I'm not aware of any massive swing to the Greens elsewhere - certainly not in Britain or Ireland, nor in France or Italy either.
 

Jack Walsh

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The Green 'surge' in Germany has been almost entirely at the expense of the SPD, which is in freefall. Left-wing voters clearly see the SPD as nothing more than a prop for Merkel and are simply opting for the real thing. A similar process unfortunately has been happening between the CDU and the AFD. Apart from Germany, I'm not aware of any massive swing to the Greens elsewhere - certainly not in Britain or Ireland, nor in France or Italy either.
Their combined vote (SPD and Greens) was just 30% in election, it is now 37%, so I think Greens are taking from CDU/CSU as well

i think they will go well here in locals next year as well
 

Dame_Enda

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The Greens have historically been stronger in Germany than elsewhere in Europe.
 

willow68

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The Greens. Started with so much promise and enthusiasm.
Now just enemies of freedom. Bought for shysters clapping their own People's doom.. to vote Green these days as a white indigenous European person is like being the proverbial turkey voting for Christmas. A despicable party on all levels.
 

Kevin Parlon

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The Watermelons. I personally know Germans who've become disillusioned with the CDU/CSU, are of a conservative bent but can't bring themselves to vote for the AFD or (of course) the SPD. Yes, I know. Europe is becoming more polarized. It is inevitable that as people fall out of the middle, some will fall to the left. The overall movement though is rightwards.
 

Fr Dougal

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Self hating Germans vote for eugenicist Greens. What a surprise!
 

Dame_Enda

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With the SPD in govt in Germany, the Greens provide an outlet for Leftist protest types uncomfortable with the former Communists in the Linke party.
 

twokidsmanybruises

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With the SPD in govt in Germany, the Greens provide an outlet for Leftist protest types uncomfortable with the former Communists in the Linke party.
??? The Greens are steeped in as much grandfathered-in Communists and Marxists as Die Linke.
 

Jack Walsh

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With the SPD in govt in Germany, the Greens provide an outlet for Leftist protest types uncomfortable with the former Communists in the Linke party.
Yes, 23% when for a left party is dismissed as "leftist protest types"

While 23% for AfD, if it occurred would be hailed as an imminent European wide takeover by the far right.
 

jmcc

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??? The Greens are steeped in as much grandfathered-in Communists and Marxists as Die Linke.
Wonder how Eamon Ryan got mixed up with that lot. :) The German Greens do seem to be quite different to the Irish Greens.
 

Fr Dougal

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Wonder how Eamon Ryan got mixed up with that lot. :) The German Greens do seem to be quite different to the Irish Greens.
Both are totalitarian eugenicists.
 

twokidsmanybruises

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Wonder how Eamon Ryan got mixed up with that lot. :) The German Greens do seem to be quite different to the Irish Greens.
Ahh, a world of difference between how respectable Irish gentlemen do Green and how those wacky German smash-the-capitalist-pigs pinkos do Green.
 

Jack Walsh

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The Greens would now be a major force in Irish politics if they had just stayed the hell out of Govt.
If there was ever a Govt they should have avoided, that was it, and that is not just hindsight.
There were enough sirens going off in June 2007 if they had just listened.
 

owedtojoy

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The Watermelons. I personally know Germans who've become disillusioned with the CDU/CSU, are of a conservative bent but can't bring themselves to vote for the AFD or (of course) the SPD. Yes, I know. Europe is becoming more polarized. It is inevitable that as people fall out of the middle, some will fall to the left. The overall movement though is rightwards.
It is not "right-ward".

Stop spreading alt-right mythologies. The picture is far more complex, and it could well be that right-wing parties have peaked. The influx of refugees from the Middle East has reduced by ~90%. There are signs that Labour voters in the UK are disillusioned with Brexit and its Tory shenanigans, meaning a swing towards a new referendum and a possible Remain vote.

In Bavaria, the AfD sent from 4% in 2013 to 12% in 2017 to 10% in 2018.

The Greens went from 8.6% to 9.6% to 17.6%

The Centrist liberal Free Democrats also increased their votes, while the vote for CSU, SPD and AfD fell.

Just because the media want to talk about fat arses swaggering around with flags and salutes, it does not mean there is also a rising tide to the left, one that may have a more lasting impact.
 

midlander12

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Their combined vote (SPD and Greens) was just 30% in election, it is now 37%, so I think Greens are taking from CDU/CSU as well

i think they will go well here in locals next year as well
Certainly in the Bavaria and Hesse state elections the Green gains almost exactly mirrored the SPD losses.

The Irish Greens are a sad shadow of their German counterparts, and indeed of their own previous incarnation before they propped up the grotesque Cowen cabinet for years after it became obvious they had beggared the country. They will never be more than a fringe left-liberal group, making occasional gains during declines of Lab or the SD's or whoever else inhabits that space.
 

midlander12

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The Greens would now be a major force in Irish politics if they had just stayed the hell out of Govt.
If there was ever a Govt they should have avoided, that was it, and that is not just hindsight.
There were enough sirens going off in June 2007 if they had just listened.
Yes, well.....
 

owedtojoy

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The Greens would now be a major force in Irish politics if they had just stayed the hell out of Govt.
If there was ever a Govt they should have avoided, that was it, and that is not just hindsight.
There were enough sirens going off in June 2007 if they had just listened.
You could set it to music and play in on the fiddle ... the PDs and Labour would join in the chorus.

The Law of Irish Coalitions is that the smaller party gets screwed and punished for everything, while the larger one is rewarded, and not held in the least accountable. Same thing happened to the Lib Dems in the UK..

Sinn Fein should take note.
 
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