Housing crisis can be fixed overnight but the government refuses to implement the most obvious solution.

Voluntary

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Housing crisis can be fixed overnight but the government refuses to implement the most obvious solution.

Housing crisis can be fixed overnight but the government refuses to implement the most obvious solution.

The Irish State keeps the low-end (eg small apartment) prices artificially high by charging horendous taxes and levies on new homes.

Having a roof over the head is a basic necessity, almost a human right. Is it even moral to charge own citizens huge amount of money on such necessities like housing (similarilly to water and food)?

So we now know the state takes €83,000 out from every new built house which goes on the market with pricetag of €230,000. My opinion is that this is a one big scam targetted agains our own citizens.

On a 230k build state takes 83k


While I believe the luxury and non-basic goods can be taxed as government wishes so, I also believe state should not benefit much on provision of basic necessities (like water, housing, basic food).

Quick and easy solution would solve the current housing crisis almost overnight:

- Remove State fees, levies, taxes from the cheapest new builds. Maybe exempt first 100k of the new build value from taxation/levies at all.
- Low taxes for the moderatelly priced new housing, low levies / taxes on the second 100k of the new build value.
- Leave the current level of taxation for amounts between 200k and 350k
- Even increase taxation of luxury houses (not necessities). If someone wants a premium house than this is ok, but he can contribute to the society at the same time.

What the above would achive:

- many affordable houses/apartments coming to the market very soon
- rents down (on lower end housing)
- lower end house prices down
- mid end house prices - slightly down
- luxury houses - no difference

+ Lower housing costs in the society means people have more money left in their pockets to spend on the real economy.


I also wonder: how is that the Irish nation can stand against water charges, but feels OK with the State charging them such huge amount of money for their right to have a roof over their heads?
 


Congalltee

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Social housing: has there ever been a proper audit to ensure that those currently in such houses a) fulfil the criteria and b) use the full capacity of the unit and c) are paying the rent? (If they can).
 

Clanrickard

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Housing crisis can be fixed overnight but the government refuses to implement the most obvious solution.

The Irish State keeps the low-end (eg small apartment) prices artificially high by charging horendous taxes and levies on new homes.

Having a roof over the head is a basic necessity, almost a human right. Is it even moral to charge own citizens huge amount of money on such necessities like housing (similarilly to water and food)?

So we now know the state takes €83,000 out from every new built house which goes on the market with pricetag of €230,000. My opinion is that this is a one big scam targetted agains our own citizens.

On a 230k build state takes 83k


While I believe the luxury and non-basic goods can be taxed as government wishes so, I also believe state should not benefit much on provision of basic necessities (like water, housing, basic food).

Quick and easy solution would solve the current housing crisis almost overnight:

- Remove State fees, levies, taxes from the cheapest new builds. Maybe exempt first 100k of the new build value from taxation/levies at all.
- Low taxes for the moderatelly priced new housing, low levies / taxes on the second 100k of the new build value.
- Leave the current level of taxation for amounts between 200k and 350k
- Even increase taxation of luxury houses (not necessities). If someone wants a premium house than this is ok, but he can contribute to the society at the same time.

What the above would achive:

- many affordable houses/apartments coming to the market very soon
- rents down (on lower end housing)
- lower end house prices down
- mid end house prices - slightly down
- luxury houses - no difference

+ Lower housing costs in the society means people have more money left in their pockets to spend on the real economy.


I also wonder: how is that the Irish nation can stand against water charges, but feels OK with the State charging them such huge amount of money for their right to have a roof over their heads?
Developers will pocket the extra profit and keep prices the way they are.
 

statsman

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Feb 25, 2011
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55,059
Housing crisis can be fixed overnight but the government refuses to implement the most obvious solution.

The Irish State keeps the low-end (eg small apartment) prices artificially high by charging horendous taxes and levies on new homes.

Having a roof over the head is a basic necessity, almost a human right. Is it even moral to charge own citizens huge amount of money on such necessities like housing (similarilly to water and food)?

So we now know the state takes €83,000 out from every new built house which goes on the market with pricetag of €230,000. My opinion is that this is a one big scam targetted agains our own citizens.

On a 230k build state takes 83k


While I believe the luxury and non-basic goods can be taxed as government wishes so, I also believe state should not benefit much on provision of basic necessities (like water, housing, basic food).

Quick and easy solution would solve the current housing crisis almost overnight:

- Remove State fees, levies, taxes from the cheapest new builds. Maybe exempt first 100k of the new build value from taxation/levies at all.
- Low taxes for the moderatelly priced new housing, low levies / taxes on the second 100k of the new build value.
- Leave the current level of taxation for amounts between 200k and 350k
- Even increase taxation of luxury houses (not necessities). If someone wants a premium house than this is ok, but he can contribute to the society at the same time.

What the above would achive:

- many affordable houses/apartments coming to the market very soon
- rents down (on lower end housing)
- lower end house prices down
- mid end house prices - slightly down
- luxury houses - no difference

+ Lower housing costs in the society means people have more money left in their pockets to spend on the real economy.


I also wonder: how is that the Irish nation can stand against water charges, but feels OK with the State charging them such huge amount of money for their right to have a roof over their heads?
What would be the impact on other tax revenue sources, and the consequent impact on people's ability to pay the smaller mortgages involved if they are paying higher taxes elsewhere?
 

Volatire

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Development levies and consultants fees also mean a chronic underutilisation of the existing housing stock.

There are many older people who live in large centrally located houses who do not want to move but would like to split their house into apartments.

They quickly realise that the would be down €60k on planning,levies and fire safety consultants etc.

So nothing happens, and someone else ends up commuting from Kildare.
 

hammer

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Would landlords reduce rents if they were allowed to write off 100% of all annual costs ?
 

hammer

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Who was it that said that you cannot build an apartment in Dublin for under €280,000 or so ?
 

hammer

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Fianna FAIL, the Banks, County Councils, Central Bank, Developers, Benchmarking, PRTB, reckless borrowers, etc. have fecked up home building, home ownership and rental market in this country.

I cannot see any easy solution.
 

Denislaw

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Social housing: has there ever been a proper audit to ensure that those currently in such houses a) fulfil the criteria and b) use the full capacity of the unit and c) are paying the rent? (If they can).
So you want the bedroom tax in...proper Tory aren't you...
 

Schuhart

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I thought the problem was that a relatively small group of property speculators don't want to admit that development land is worth much less that they'd like, and that the media are slow to frame the issue in those terms.

Coupled with the fact that repossessions are so low.

After all, the one fact in the matter is that houses are only worth what people can pay for them.
 

Congalltee

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A single person in Ireland on €48,000 qualifies for social housing :)
It's €35,000 to qualify to get on the list, but where would an able bodied single man actually come on the list?

The income threshold should obviously be lowered, and all those who exceed it given their notice to quit. those genuinely in need should the occupy these social housing units, not those who have "inherited" their social housing or are allowing empty bedrooms go to waste.
 

Barroso

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A single person in Ireland on €48,000 qualifies for social housing :)
It's €35,000 to qualify to get on the list, but where would an able bodied single man actually come on the list?

The income threshold should obviously be lowered, and all those who exceed it given their notice to quit. those genuinely in need should the occupy these social housing units, not those who have "inherited" their social housing or are allowing empty bedrooms go to waste.
Regardless of the income threshold, there is no supply of social housing to be housed in.
As for turfing people out, well that is a great solution, isn't it?
 

Voluntary

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Regardless of the income threshold, there is no supply of social housing to be housed in.
As for turfing people out, well that is a great solution, isn't it?
We only need more social housing because people cannot afford housing themselves. They cannot afford housing themselves because the State charges every single small appartment 80 thousand Euro only to enter the market.

Remove levies on affordable housing and you'll soon realize the social hosing list shrinks gradually.
 

hammer

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It's €35,000 to qualify to get on the list, but where would an able bodied single man actually come on the list?

The income threshold should obviously be lowered, and all those who exceed it given their notice to quit. those genuinely in need should the occupy these social housing units, not those who have "inherited" their social housing or are allowing empty bedrooms go to waste.
Just to correct you there. Its €35,000 net income.
 

Voluntary

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What would be the impact on other tax revenue sources, and the consequent impact on people's ability to pay the smaller mortgages involved if they are paying higher taxes elsewhere?
The implications would have to be carefully calculated. The reasoning is simple however. Move burden of high taxation from basic human needs like housing to non basic human needs (like maybe luxury housing). Also, don't forget the higher volume would compensate some income lost.

Also, considering the fact that for years we had only few thousands new houses delivered per year, then quick calculation gives 5000 x 100,000 = 0,5 billion Euros. Even if revenue would be cut by 0,5 billion this is a low cost for solving the housing crisis and making people live comfortable. Imagine how much money would come back to Revenue in form of other taxes (vat on goods, services etc).

Same principle could be applied as with income tax. The low earners income don't pay tax/prsi etc.
With the houses we could do something similar.
 

hammer

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Maybe people should stop buying private homes and register for social housing.

If this keeps up only social housing will be available.

Young couples wont be able to get a mortgage and/or save for a deposit.

I`m putting the eldest on the list Tuesday.
 

Voluntary

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Maybe people should stop buying private homes and register for social housing.

If this keeps up only social housing will be available.

Young couples wont be able to get a mortgage and/or save for a deposit.

I`m putting the eldest on the list Tuesday.
Strategy 2020: Provide 35,000 new housing units at a cost of €3.8 billion

Or we can allow people to buy cheap apartments/houses by removing levies with cost of 0.5 billion a year and even reduce social housing dependency.

Do we want more people depending on state funding or would we rather have people who can afford their housing?
That's an easy question if you ask me. Keep giving hungry men fish or give him once a fishing rod? Depends what's your objective is, want to make him free or keep a slave.
 


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