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How are the parties divided on abortion?


TommyO'Brien

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No one political party is uniformly pro-life or pro-choice. Already Sinn Féin's Peadar Toibin has broken ranks and indicated he will defy the SF whip and "vote pro-life".

D J Moore ‏@djcpmoore BREAKING : Peadar Toibin (Sinn Fein, Meath West) has just said on RTE News that he will defy Sinn Fein whip next week and "Vote Pro-Life"
Retweeted by irishpollingreport


A couple of other SF TDs are also known to define themselves as pro-life in terms of their views over the years and may do the same.

In FG, James Bannon has given an interview indicating that he has issues with voting for any legalisation of abortion. Simon Harris has moved in the other direction, from opposing legislating for X case to being open to doing so now given the developments in Galway. Other TDs are pro-choice.

Éamon Ó Cuiv doesn't hide his pro-life credentials and may break ranks with his party (yet again - he seems to be the Lannigan's Ball of politicians, forever stepping out and in again). Other FF TDs identify themselves as pro-life while some identify themselves as pro-choice.

Labour is split between the Dublin liberal wing represented by Ivana Bacik and the conservative rural party which is quite conservative socially, so a split on the issue is possible.

So we may witness most if not all parties experiencing breakaways on the issue in any Oireachtas vote.
 
Joined
Oct 8, 2011
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No one political party is uniformly pro-life or pro-choice. Already Sinn Féin's Peadar Toibin has broken ranks and indicated he will defy the SF whip and "vote pro-life".

D J Moore ‏@djcpmoore BREAKING : Peadar Toibin (Sinn Fein, Meath West) has just said on RTE News that he will defy Sinn Fein whip next week and "Vote Pro-Life"
Retweeted by irishpollingreport


A couple of other SF TDs are also known to define themselves as pro-life in terms of their views over the years and may do the same.

In FG, James Bannon has given an interview indicating that he has issues with voting for any legalisation of abortion. Simon Harris has moved in the other direction, from opposing legislating for X case to being open to doing so now given the developments in Galway. Other TDs are pro-choice.

Éamon Ó Cuiv doesn't hide his pro-life credentials and may break ranks with his party (yet again - he seems to be the Lannigan's Ball of politicians, forever stepping out and in again). Other FF TDs identify themselves as pro-life while some identify themselves as pro-choice.

Labour is split between the Dublin liberal wing represented by Ivana Bacik and the conservative rural party which is quite conservative socially, so a split on the issue is possible.

So we may witness most if not all parties experiencing breakaways on the issue in any Oireachtas vote.
It's a great question and leads to the question about whether any vote should be under the whip or a conscience vote.

I'd love to know the real figures.
 

ShoutingIsLeadership

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Jan 17, 2011
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I posted this on another thread earlier:

Peadar Toibin (SF) says he will be voting "pro life" in any vote in the Dail.

What does that mean? Does that mean not legislating for X even if it means the death of women?

Time to challenge anyone who uses the term "pro life".

I won't dwell on the irony of a SF TD claiming to be "pro life".
 

borntorum

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Surely a vote on abortion should not be whipped.

My guess, based on no evidence whatsoever, is that if all parties allowed a free vote, legislation for X would pass.

Btw, I think the OP is somewhat inaccurate in stating that Labour is split on the issue. Certainly it's not uniformly pro-choice and a number of Labour TDs are understood to be irritated by Ivana Bacik's repeated assertion that the party supports a liberal abortion regime. But it seems that it is almost entirely pro-X legislation.
 

eoghanacht

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Irish society is divide between mad religious nutters and the rest of us.
 

Cato

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Labour is split between the Dublin liberal wing represented by Ivana Bacik and the conservative rural party which is quite conservative socially, so a split on the issue is possible.

So we may witness most if not all parties experiencing breakaways on the issue in any Oireachtas vote.
Could you name some of these Labour TDs or Senators that you believe likely to break ranks on this? The only two that come to my mind who might defy the whip are the Senators Whelan and Kelly.
 

Eoin Coir

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I posted this on another thread earlier:

Peadar Toibin (SF) says he will be voting "pro life" in any vote in the Dail.

What does that mean? Does that mean not legislating for X even if it means the death of women?

Time to challenge anyone who uses the term "pro life".

I won't dwell on the irony of a SF TD claiming to be "pro life"
.
This is peace process mode,and time to move on !
 

Fra_south_Derry

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Jun 9, 2009
Messages
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Surely a vote on abortion should not be whipped.

My guess, based on no evidence whatsoever, is that if all parties allowed a free vote, legislation for X would pass.

Btw, I think the OP is somewhat inaccurate in stating that Labour is split on the issue. Certainly it's not uniformly pro-choice and a number of Labour TDs are understood to be irritated by Ivana Bacik's repeated assertion that the party supports a liberal abortion regime. But it seems that it is almost entirely pro-X legislation.
Can't blame them though Ivana is a media hure.
 

Cato

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Aug 21, 2005
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This is peace process mode,and time to move on !
Well, I think that SF's new found pro choice stance could come as a surprise to many of their supporters in the North.
 

punchdrunk

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Jul 15, 2008
Messages
7,208
Surely a vote on abortion should not be whipped.

My guess, based on no evidence whatsoever, is that if all parties allowed a free vote, legislation for X would pass.

Btw, I think the OP is somewhat inaccurate in stating that Labour is split on the issue. Certainly it's not uniformly pro-choice and a number of Labour TDs are understood to be irritated by Ivana Bacik's repeated assertion that the party supports a liberal abortion regime. But it seems that it is almost entirely pro-X legislation.
So people are not entitled to freedom of conscience is it? TDs are not going to be bullied by Bacik.
 

eoghanacht

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Of course it is. And only an extremely fair, open-minded and rational person would say such a thing.

:roll:

You wouldn't recognise one if you seen one Maria though would you.
 

Fra_south_Derry

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Irish society is divide between mad religious nutters and the rest of us.
Feck off. From my experience atheists like yourself are more obsessed by God than religious people. Time to grow up and remove that massive chip from your shoulder.
 

borntorum

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Well, I think that SF's new found pro choice stance could come as a surprise to many of their supporters in the North.
I don't think it's 'new found'. In fact, to my eyes, as they've become more mainstream down here they appear to have moderated their previously stronger pro-choice stance
 

MariaMcN

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Feb 9, 2012
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I posted this on another thread earlier:

Peadar Toibin (SF) says he will be voting "pro life" in any vote in the Dail.

What does that mean? Does that mean not legislating for X even if it means the death of women?

Time to challenge anyone who uses the term "pro life".

I won't dwell on the irony of a SF TD claiming to be "pro life".
Some people might be conflicted about X, with the 'risk of suicide' part of the ruling being a particular problem, I imagine.
 
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Surely a vote on abortion should not be whipped.....
So the Whip should only apply on less important issues?

I think that the Whip should absolutely apply in a vote of such importance and that anybody who defies it should be suspended from the party.

I'd allow abstentions at the most.

Making an issue a cross-party one doesn't necessarily reduce the effect of the Whip.

All of the parties need to grow some balls on the issue.
 

MariaMcN

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I don't think it's 'new found'. In fact, to my eyes, as they've become more mainstream down here they appear to have moderated their previously stronger pro-choice stance
They were supposed to 'agree to disagree' as a party. They didn't claim to be pro-choice up until recently. Even now there is big division within the party at large.
 

Fra_south_Derry

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Well, I think that SF's new found pro choice stance could come as a surprise to many of their supporters in the North.
Somebody had to end the repression in the 6 counties. The liberal twats blowing smoke up john bulls ass weren't going to do it.
 
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