How is a more liberal abortion regime likely to change Ireland?

Disillusioned democrat

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 16, 2010
Messages
16,014
Right now all the focus is on the referendum and it's either black or white to most people - it's about choice and rights vs. a belief that a foetus is a human.

What strikes me as very odd is that there's been little discussion about what happens next.

The government has suggested legislation before the end of the year - but given it's precarious position, dependency on independents and the number of scandals rocking it is it optimistic to assume they'll last past the next budget.

Is the HSE ready for this? Are there spare teams of doctors and psychiatrists ready for the necessary assessments before an abortion later than 12 weeks can be authorized?

Is the mental health sector ready for an increase in the number of patients looking for counseling before/after an abortion? Grieving counseling for those who later regret having an abortion?

Are the Gardaí ready for the kind of demonstrations and sometimes violence against abortion clinics or practitioners?

How will we know we've made the right or wrong decision - will the HSE publish statistics of abortions before 12 weeks or after 12 weeks? Do we have targets that will help us identify if we're being too liberal?

I fear we're being led into a situation that few in government - if any - really have planned for but will happily throw it onto the existing crap services while patting themselves on the back for being such great leaders.
 


D

Deleted member 51920

No handicapped people, no cleft palate - all shiny happy people
 

Spanner Island

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 22, 2011
Messages
23,973
There's so much bullsh!t in your OP it's not worth responding to...

The desperation is palpable...
 

Sync

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 27, 2009
Messages
29,664
The point is to make it legally ok to introduce the legislation, which can only be done with the constitutional change.

Most of what you’ve outlined above needs to be addressed, and needs to be addressed before legislation is implemented.

You can’t begin to implement it prior to the constitutional change. It wouldn’t be appropriate, a good use of resources or legal in some cases. To use a simple example that youv’e given: If the contents of assessments were to be developed and rolled out for training now, you’d have started a thread complaining about that.
 

LadyLou

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 20, 2010
Messages
1,339
Abortion will be compulsory and there will be an abortion clinic in every estate

and every village in Ireland.
 

Disillusioned democrat

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 16, 2010
Messages
16,014
There's so much bullsh!t in your OP it's not worth responding to...

The desperation is palpable...
Not at all - I'm resigned to a Yes vote, to be honest it's 3:1 in my own home...but if we're going down that route I wish we were doing it properly.

I'm sure if the vote wasn't this week we'd still be talking about the cervical cancer screening fiasco - we're just crap at stuff, but happy to heap more demand onto an already broken system.
 

Disillusioned democrat

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 16, 2010
Messages
16,014
The point is to make it legally ok to introduce the legislation, which can only be done with the constitutional change.

Most of what you’ve outlined above needs to be addressed, and needs to be addressed before legislation is implemented.

You can’t begin to implement it prior to the constitutional change. It wouldn’t be appropriate, a good use of resources or legal in some cases. To use a simple example that youv’e given: If the contents of assessments were to be developed and rolled out for training now, you’d have started a thread complaining about that.
So what happens in the vacuum between the repeal of the 8th and the passing of legislation?
 

Spanner Island

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 22, 2011
Messages
23,973
Not at all - I'm resigned to a Yes vote, to be honest it's 3:1 in my own home...but if we're going down that route I wish we were doing it properly.

I'm sure if the vote wasn't this week we'd still be talking about the cervical cancer screening fiasco - we're just crap at stuff, but happy to heap more demand onto an already broken system.
Getting this out of the constitution and legislating properly for it is doing it properly...
 

culmore

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 14, 2010
Messages
3,181
well if the woman has a termination in the first 12 weeks she will only be using the HSE services for that period of time instead of for the nine months so it will in fact mean less visits to Doctors and Clinics and Hospitals.
 

CookieMonster

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 19, 2005
Messages
33,861
Abortion will be compulsory and there will be an abortion clinic in every estate

and every village in Ireland.
That's what the bastard repealers really want, you know.
 

Clanrickard

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 25, 2008
Messages
33,604
People who are pro-life will take direct action.
 

Sync

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 27, 2009
Messages
29,664
So what happens in the vacuum between the repeal of the 8th and the passing of legislation?
THAT’S a good question. And one I’ve no idea why hasn’t been pushed properly by the No side. The answer seems to be “everyone hopes things go ok until legislation is passed.”

There’ll be time to look at the missteps of both campaigns after the vote, but the lack of a false flag operation by No to focus on the legislative side of things has been a mistake.
 

Disillusioned democrat

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 16, 2010
Messages
16,014
Getting this out of the constitution and legislating properly for it is doing it properly...
I admire your optimism if somewhat worry about your learning disability.

We don't do "properly" here, we do sliveen gombeenery.

Abortion is serious - very serious - you could say life and death - but or legislators and implementators have a long and inglorious track record of half-arsed solutions, botched processes and flawed systems that no one is ever accountable for.

People have died very recently because of HSE mismanagement and lack of patient focus - the high courts are already chockablock with cases against them.
 

Spanner Island

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 22, 2011
Messages
23,973
So what happens in the vacuum between the repeal of the 8th and the passing of legislation?
Who knows?

No-one can tell the future...

I somehow doubt however, that there's going to be a huge surge in abortions here at any point...

I suspect many women will still travel too... because if some posters are to be believed... it'll be easier to do that than run the gauntlet of what they're promising if the vote doesn't go their way...

It's likely most if not all abortions in Ireland will take place in hospitals and in 'hard case' scenarios while the rest continue to travel...
 

Disillusioned democrat

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 16, 2010
Messages
16,014
THAT’S a good question. And one I’ve no idea why hasn’t been pushed properly by the No side. The answer seems to be “everyone hopes things go ok until legislation is passed.”

There’ll be time to look at the missteps of both campaigns after the vote, but the lack of a false flag operation by No to focus on the legislative side of things has been a mistake.
To be honest I think this is where the government have been most divisive and disingenuous...they played a shell game of what may be to come but dismissed any questions about details with distain.
 

Cellachán Chaisil

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 3, 2009
Messages
9,841

Disillusioned democrat

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 16, 2010
Messages
16,014
Who knows?

No-one can tell the future...

I somehow doubt however, that there's going to be a huge surge in abortions here at any point...

I suspect many women will still travel too... because if some posters are to be believed... it'll be easier to do that than run the gauntlet of what they're promising if the vote doesn't go their way...

It's likely most if not all abortions in Ireland will take place in hospitals and in 'hard case' scenarios while the rest continue to travel...
That kind of says it all really.

You can't "tell" the future, but you plan for it, you make arrangements for different outcomes and you plan to measure the outcomes to make sure they're close to what was expected.

That some people are happy to go blindly into the future without preparing for the worst is bewildering.
 


Popular Threads

Most Replies

Top