HSE engaging in serial insubordination re Cervical inquiry - why no disciplinary action ?

cyberianpan

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This is not a thread on the Cervical issue per se

It is a thread on why An Taoiseach is merely issuing press releases, when employees directed by his Minister are wilfully frustrating his orders

The Government is failing right in front of us ...Leo just does press releases. This goes beyond Health - right now we see Government itself flailing - they are not using their powers

Scally has had to go public again

Head of CervicalCheck inquiry criticises HSE over delays
Dr Gabriel Scally has told The Irish Times he is “disappointed at the pace and format in which information is being provided” to his examination into the withholding of information from women diagnosed with cervical cancer.

While he insists the organisation is co-operating and progress is being made, Dr Scally said the level of co-operation has not altered over the past number of weeks.
An Taoiseach is merely issuing press releases
It appears the position has not changed despite several pleas from the Government to co-operate fully with the investigation and pledges from the organisation to do so.

Speaking on Thursday, Taoiseach Leo Varadkar said it was “not acceptable” that Dr Scally was facing resistance from State organisations.

“The position from Government in terms of what we are saying is that we have asked Dr Scally to carry out this inquiry, he is doing it on behalf of the Government. Anyone who is not co-operating with him is not co-operating with Government. I don’t think I can be any more clear on this,” he told reporters.
This is a simple legal management issue:

Employees are engaging in wilfull insubordination
There is reasonable grounds to suspect that furthermore, they are covering up malfeasance

Anyone who read the released correspondence could see that there was a cover-up...it is still going on

1) Harris needs to resign now, he has fully failed - he is not holding his staff to account - he has had more than enough time

2) An Taoiseach needs to deal directly with the insubordinate employees, push them, gather evidence - and fire them for gross misconduct if needed

Cyp
 
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cyberianpan

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This is a breakdown of Government

It sets a terrible example

Leo doing another ditsy press release a month later ? Who does he think he is, the Opposition Leader ?


Cyp
 

max99

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This is a breakdown of Government

It sets a terrible example

Leo doing another ditsy press release a month later ? Who does he think he is, the Opposition Leader ?


Cyp
He should have stepped down two months ago..... Disgraceful
 

cyberianpan

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He should have stepped down two months ago..... Disgraceful
Well we literally have seen Scally had to go public...twice...with the same complaint

And Leo bats back with spin

There is clear insubordination and coverup going on ...Leo & Simon are the responsible managers, yet no tackling of the problem ?

This suggests that Leo cannot manage other problems

Is he anything beyond spin ?

Cyp
 

Analyzer

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HSE infected with a cover-up-culture. Is anybody surprised ?

It is the same as AGS on the McCabe debacle, RTE concerning the Cocaine supply, FAS (solas) concerning expenses trips to Florida, etc.....

There is a rampant problem of "the taxpayers will take the abuse" in the institutional state.
 

Disillusioned democrat

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Well, you know, Varadkar should have known as MoH at the time, he says he didn't - wasn't told, nothing to see here, move along....but maybe someone in the HSE thinks different.

It'd be hard to crack the whip on someone who could bring you down with them.
 
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Analyzer

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Well, you know, Varadkar should have known as MoH at the time, he says he didn't - wasn't told, nothing to see here, move along....but maybe someone in the HSE thinks different.
I think that he was in the DoT, at that time, helping the Luas order trams that were too long for O'Connell Bridge.....
 

cyberianpan

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Because Important People only do things that have the words policy or strategy in their summary.

Operational management is for others to worry about - and anyway involves way too much effort.
Indeed

But is Leo sending these orders by press release, or to a Sir Humphrey ?

Cyp
 

sic transit

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Projects don't always start on time and the "random" fixed dates confidently announced by politicians can make people look inept. That's not to say there isn't a whole pile of disorganisation and bad planning at the back of it all. Either way it ends up as a political football, especially heading into the silly season.
 

Paddy{ie

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This is not a thread on the Cervical issue per se

It is a thread on why An Taoiseach is merely issuing press releases, when employees directed by his Minister are wilfully frustrating his orders

The Government is failing right in front of us ...Leo just does press releases. This goes beyond Health - right now we see Government itself flailing - they are not using their powers

Scally has had to go public again

Head of CervicalCheck inquiry criticises HSE over delays


An Taoiseach is merely issuing press releases


This is a simple legal management issue:

Employees are engaging in wilfull insubordination
There is reasonable grounds to suspect that furthermore, they are covering up malfeasance

Anyone who read the released correspondence could see that there was a cover-up...it is still going on

1) Harris needs to resign now, he has fully failed - he is not holding his staff to account - he has had more than enough time

2) An Taoiseach needs to deal directly with the insubordinate employees, push them, gather evidence - and fire them for gross misconduct if needed

Cyp
Or HSE just following instructions.
 

ruman

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HSE infected with a cover-up-culture. Is anybody surprised ?

It is the same as AGS on the McCabe debacle, RTE concerning the Cocaine supply, FAS (solas) concerning expenses trips to Florida, etc.....

There is a rampant problem of "the taxpayers will take the abuse" in the institutional state.
Varadkar stated he intended introducing mandatory disclosure while Health Minister but did a uturn after the medics lobbied his Chief Medical Officer Tony Holohan. I dont think i've ever seen such a blatant display of hypocrisy from an Irish politician as Varadkar stating "doctors should disclose" in regard to the Cervical Check" scandal after he himself failed to make disclosure mandatory.

The HSE is only following what the Taoiseach told them, disclosure is voluntary and their are no consequences for non compliance. That's all down to Leo.
Harris in fairness appears to be trying to tidy up his bosses mess.

Our utterly useless media prefer to focus on Leo's socks !!!!
 

Massey

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Varadkar stated he intended introducing mandatory disclosure while Health Minister but did a uturn after the medics lobbied his Chief Medical Officer Tony Holohan. I dont think i've ever seen such a blatant display of hypocrisy from an Irish politician as Varadkar stating "doctors should disclose" in regard to the Cervical Check" scandal after he himself failed to make disclosure mandatory.

The HSE is only following what the Taoiseach told them, disclosure is voluntary and their are no consequences for non compliance. That's all down to Leo.
Harris in fairness appears to be trying to tidy up his bosses mess.

Our utterly useless media prefer to focus on Leo's socks !!!!
I agree there should be open disclosure.

But every quality improvement audit could be subject to open disclosure, it may cost the taxpayer billions.

All you need is a good lawyer , asking for FOI on every patient whose treatment was below average---Ka-Ching.
 

ruman

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I agree there should be open disclosure.

But every quality improvement audit could be subject to open disclosure, it may cost the taxpayer billions.

All you need is a good lawyer , asking for FOI on every patient whose treatment was below average---Ka-Ching.
Making a patients private medical information available to them is not difficult. You digitalise it and allow the patient immediate access. It is not hard. Concealing it from patients it not acceptable. I fail to see how that would constitute huge costs. In fact it probably would save a fortune in admin costs not to mention allowing medics to concentrate on care.
Patients should be allowed take their own information and have it reviewed by a medic of their choosing should they so wish. The HSE has a stone age mentality towards data, its astonishing really.

Medics concealing negligence from patients in certain cases should face criminal charges. Altering or removing medical records for example.
 

Dame_Enda

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The State should focus on justice for the victims rather than trying to limit compensation claims by suppressing the truth. This is like the Anti D scandal in that the State is proving recalcitrant and penny-pinching to very vulnerable and in some cases dying patients.
 

Massey

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Making a patients private medical information available to them is not difficult. You digitalise it and allow the patient immediate access. It is not hard. Concealing it from patients it not acceptable. I fail to see how that would constitute huge costs. In fact it probably would save a fortune in admin costs not to mention allowing medics to concentrate on care.
Patients should be allowed take their own information and have it reviewed by a medic of their choosing should they so wish. The HSE has a stone age mentality towards data, its astonishing really.

Medics concealing negligence from patients in certain cases should face criminal charges. Altering or removing medical records for example.
All patient information is available to the patient.

The issue is that if you do an audit and you find the patient care is less than Ideal , do you have to tell the patient.

For example, you are left on a trolley inA&E for 24 hours, and a week into your care on the ward you develop a clot.

Does the hospital have to write to you to tell you that your stay for 24hours in the A&E, was bad for you and may have contributed to your complication.
Could the patient sue the hospital( Ie the taxpayer) because of this?
 

ruman

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All patient information is available to the patient.

The issue is that if you do an audit and you find the patient care is less than Ideal , do you have to tell the patient.

For example, you are left on a trolley inA&E for 24 hours, and a week into your care on the ward you develop a clot.

Does the hospital have to write to you to tell you that your stay for 24hours in the A&E, was bad for you and may have contributed to your complication.
Could the patient sue the hospital( Ie the taxpayer) because of this?
Unfortunately that is simply not the case. Medical records regularly go missing following "adverse incidents", not to mention the post event alterations.

Yes, if a medic is aware of failings they tell the patient. Why are you even asking ? Why wouldnt they tell them , are they there to provide a service to their patient or not ?
 
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Massey

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So if there is overcrowding causing complications, the doctors should tell the patient?
We have 500 patients a day on overcrowded emergency departments - should they be compensated if they have any adverse events ?

I actually think it maybe a good idea, but will cost the taxpayer millions, at least initially.
 

fergal1790

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I think that he was in the DoT, at that time, helping the Luas order trams that were too long for O'Connell Bridge.....
He was in Social protection telling us that we are all scamming the system and defrauding the government of billions every year and that we don't get up early enough in the morning.

Harris is the one with questions to answer on this but he never does interviews because he is even worst at speaking in public than our blundering Taoiseach.
 

ruman

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So if there is overcrowding causing complications, the doctors should tell the patient?
We have 500 patients a day on overcrowded emergency departments - should they be compensated if they have any adverse events ?

I actually think it maybe a good idea, but will cost the taxpayer millions, at least initially.
It will reduce the chances of re occurrence and long term costs will drop. (Possibly we are agreeing with each other.)
For medics it will also ensure adequate investment in the right areas of the health service as failings due to inadequate resources will be highlighted. Currently medics face complaints to the medical council with no independent forum for complaints against HSE management.
 


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