Human Sexuality - Attraction and Repulsion

Wascurito

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Once upon a time, the view was that pretty much everyone was heterosexual. Men were attracted to women, women were attracted to men and that was the way God ordained it. Of course, there were a few Others variously deemed as perverts and unspeakables but these homosexuals (the kindest term in use at the time) were clearly "sick" and either needed to be locked up and/or "cured".

Then, along came Alfred Kinsey with research suggesting that the lines were a lot more blurred. His work - published in the late 1940s and 1950s - probably didn't do much to address prejudices against those who were homosexual. However, it indicated that there were far more people out there who didn't fit easily into either the heterosexual or homosexual groups. There were people who experienced some degree of homosexual attraction while being predominantly heterosexual and vice versa.



The problem with Kinsey's work is two fold:

1. It seems to imply that as one moves up the scale from exclusively heterosexual to exclusively homosexual, that the heterosexuality declines while the homosexuality increases; vice-versa going down the scale. I'm sure we all know bisexuals who are capable of experiencing an equal and high degree of attraction to both genders.

2. Asexuality is literally off the scale - cordoned off into its own little grey box and assigned a letter rather than a number.

Kinsey's Scale has since been adapted into what's called the Purple-Red Scale of Human Attraction. You can read it below for yourself. My reaction is....WTF? I don't see the point of adding romantic feelings into the mix. One can have romance with no sex and sex with no romance. Also, asexuality - while getting a mention - is on the wrong scale. Putting it on the horizontal scale makes about as much sense as deciding that zero is somehow special, not a number like 1 or 2. I think Indian mathematicians debunked that a few thousand years ago.



Sexual attraction isn't the only thing to be considered here. Given my own orientation, I can only theorize and throw this point open for discussion to all sexually-minded people on this board. However, I *assume* that the exclusive heterosexuals don't just feel no sexual attraction towards people of the same gender. I'm assuming that they'd feel an actual repulsion were they to be asked to engage in sex with people of the same gender. Equally, I assume that exclusive homosexuals don't just feel no sexual attraction towards people of the other sex: they'd be very much against any suggestion that they have sex with someone not of their gender.

No attraction is not the same as repulsion. I'm going for my daily walk in a wee while. It's cold and windy outside and the prospect holds little pleasure and no attraction but it doesn't repulse me. Likewise tea with no sugar or an afternoon spent watching Formula 1 racing. It's not my thing but you won't need to hold a gun to my head to get me to do it.

Scaled down to its bare essentials, human sexuality is a two-dimensional scale measuring the degree to which one is either attracted to or repulsed by sexual contact with:
- people of the other gender (X-axis)
- people of the same gender (Y-axis)

On that basis, one can decide whether one is heterosexual, homosexual, bisexual or asexual. Simples! I should point out that this graph can really only be applied to those who are cisgendered - hence the interchangeable use of the terms "sex" and "gender".



By the way, I know there are a few saddos whose first reaction will be to pile into this thread rolling their eyes and saying "Whatever" and "No-one cares". Give it a rest, folks. Just because your sexuality makes you feel deeply uncomfortable doesn't mean that the rest of us have to feel that way.
 
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Hunter-Gatherer

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Go and Google a photo of 'formula one supremo Bernie ecclestone with his wife. There is a strong attraction that kinsey never figured out.
 

firefly123

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I guess I'm pretty much hetero. I mean I see attractive males and admire the aesthetic but it doesn't get my nether regions in a tizzy if you know what I mean.
I think when I look at an attractive or fit man I feel a certain amount of admiration/envy (envy is too strong a word but I can't think of another).
 

silverharp

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one angle you didnt bring up is the difference between men and women?
 

petaljam

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I'm not sure I've much to add to this, but I find the first and the final graph equally ok, other than for asexuality, which becomes integrated into the overall scheme I can't really see the problem you identify with attraction/repulsion in the Kinsey scale.

I would actually find it hard to situate where I stand on the final one than on the first - I don't feel any repulsion (generally, which is what I assume you mean) for my own sex, and I'm not too sure how Id define my attraction for them.

Thing is, it's a very "incidental" thing for me - there are men to whom I'd never be attracted, and I have very occasionally felt some sexual attraction towards a woman. So I'd have no problem saying I'm a 1 on Kinsey, but on the third? No idea.

(The second scheme is just unusable, IMO)
 

petaljam

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one angle you didnt bring up is the difference between men and women?
Yes, maybe this is my problem, and why I can't use the third diagram easily.
The idea of repulsion towards your own sex seems to be a male heterosexual thing, to the extent that I've always suspected that it might be a defence mechanism by men who are refusing to acknowledge their own feelings.

But maybe it's really a difference between males and females. In which case IMO the third diagram doesn't suit to identify female sexuality.
 

Northsideman

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Go and Google a photo of 'formula one supremo Bernie ecclestone with his wife. There is a strong attraction that kinsey never figured out.
Security is something most crave and that is what money brings.
 

Wascurito

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I guess I'm pretty much hetero. I mean I see attractive males and admire the aesthetic but it doesn't get my nether regions in a tizzy if you know what I mean.
I think when I look at an attractive or fit man I feel a certain amount of admiration/envy (envy is too strong a word but I can't think of another).
Yep, you'd be exclusively hetero. A question if you don't mind - would you be repulsed by the idea of sex with a man? Don't be put off by other posts on this thread implying that there's something wrong with that. IMHO, there isn't.
 

Wascurito

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Yes, maybe this is my problem, and why I can't use the third diagram easily.
The idea of repulsion towards your own sex seems to be a male heterosexual thing, to the extent that I've always suspected that it might be a defence mechanism by men who are refusing to acknowledge their own feelings.

But maybe it's really a difference between males and females. In which case IMO the third diagram doesn't suit to identify female sexuality.
I have a problem with the bit in bold. Why should it be okay to acknowledge sexual attraction as okay but imply that sexual repulsion is somehow wrong? You're by no means the only one doing it but all we seem to doing is moving the censorious attitudes around. Once, same sex attraction was wrong. Now, it's sexual repulsion..... !
 

Wascurito

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one angle you didnt bring up is the difference between men and women?
Could you elaborate on this point, please? Bear in mind that I'm working with a two-dimensional medium - a computer screen.

If I start going too deep into gender, then we're touching on the gender-fluid folks and those who are non-binary etc....
 

Zapped(CAPITALISMROTS)

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[video=youtube;zZ3fjQa5Hls]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zZ3fjQa5Hls[/video] :rolleyes:
 

petaljam

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I have a problem with the bit in bold. Why should it be okay to acknowledge sexual attraction as okay but imply that sexual repulsion is somehow wrong? You're by no means the only one doing it but all we seem to doing is moving the censorious attitudes around. Once, same sex attraction was wrong. Now, it's sexual repulsion..... !
You misunderstand me, I'm not saying it's wrong, I'm saying it's not something I've ever heard heterosexual women express about lesbianism - that's always just "meh".

So I can't really understand the violence of the reaction that heterosexual men often express about homosexuality, given the absence of anything similar among heterosexual women.

Which is why I've long suspected that in fact it may be a disguised attraction that some, probably heterosexual, men refuse to acknowledge even to themselves, choosing to identify it as repulsion.

Obviously that's only speculation. And I'm not saying that there's anything morally wrong with it, except that I'm not convinced it's real, or females would presumably experience an equivalent amount of repulsion.

Either that or, as Silverharp has suggested, the differences in male and female sexuality are so great that it's not possible to use the same diagram to describe both.
 

Lumpy Talbot

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No
Once upon a time, the view was that pretty much everyone was heterosexual.
Homosexuality isn't something that has been recently invented. Would the OP like to put any kind of arbitrary period in history on this 'once upon a time'?
 

silverharp

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Yes, maybe this is my problem, and why I can't use the third diagram easily.
The idea of repulsion towards your own sex seems to be a male heterosexual thing, to the extent that I've always suspected that it might be a defence mechanism by men who are refusing to acknowledge their own feelings.

But maybe it's really a difference between males and females. In which case IMO the third diagram doesn't suit to identify female sexuality.
ive heard the argument that women's sexuality is a more fluid but that lesbianism isnt really a thing, at most they are really just bisexual. certainly tv/movie companies seem to know that their audience is happier seeing two women kissing or having sex whereas they rarely show 2 dudes kissing.
 

petaljam

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ive heard the argument that women's sexuality is a more fluid but that lesbianism isnt really a thing, at most they are really just bisexual. certainly tv/movie companies seem to know that their audience is happier seeing two women kissing or having sex whereas they rarely show 2 dudes kissing.
Thinking about this though, if it were true that there was this huge difference in male and female sexuality, that would negate the basic claim that sexuality can be described on a sliding scale in the first place.

I guess we'll just need to wait for some more heterosexual females to come along and tell us if they or their heterosexual female friends feel or express repulsion at the idea of female homosexuality. It's something I've literally never heard. Though TBF it's not something I spend much time discussing with my female friends either!
 

Kevin Parlon

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OP, it's true that many of us grew up with the notion/received knowledge that a person was 100% hetero or was "bent". You just have to wonder that it has taken us this long to recognise people exist in a spectrum. I think the bell curve works here. Most people are mostly attracted to the opposite sex. Others range further out, either side, and for those who inhabit the hinterland, I think that happenstance plays a big role there. If there is one aspect of human being that has advanced the most in the last quarter century I think it has been social tolerance for this spectrum. That said, such tolerance has long been established in other cultures. Thai culture standing out in that respect.

Missing from this spectrum is romance. Sexual attraction and romance inhabit different orbits.
 

Notachipanoaktree

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Absolutely. I know there are a few sane ones whose first reaction will be to pile into this thread rolling their eyes and saying "Whatever" and "No-one cares". Give it a rest, folks. Just because your sexuality makes you feel deeply uncomfortable doesn't mean that the rest 'MOST' of us have to feel that way.


GET A LIFE YOU handful of FN WEIRDOS.


It's clear the nutters have take over the world and true to form they are making a bol*ox of it.

Will there be anyone left after the greatest Fu*ck up known to man? Who gives a sh*it. It's not worth the struggle anymore
 
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