Hungary: Resistance to the Orban far-right regime emerges into the open ....


APettigrew92

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And remember, you are talking about a party that has complete control of the national media. The voters were subject to a vicious propaganda campaign, and had no access to any balancing commentary.

European leaders congratulated Orban on his "victory", but the truth is plain - Hungary is only a fake democracy.
This is the same Europe where France has been run by compromise candidates since 2002, Spain is gripped with a secession crisis, Italy has elected a populist Government and where Ireland and Britain have been ruled by an occasional shuffle of the same two parties for the last century.

What constitues democracy? A crooked system that you just so happen to agree with?

I dont see much difference between the Hungarian electoral system and that of the UK when you consider Blair won nearly two thirds of the seats on just 36% of the vote in 2005.
So, if Hungary was a democracy, Orban should be running a right wing Government with a secure majority, based on his receiving about 50% of the votes.

Meanwhile, he and his oligarchs can plunder the country. They are safe from Parliamentary oversight, police investigation, media scrutiny or judicial control. Any ordinary Hungarian who stands up to him or his cronies will be broken. Hungarians have no rights, except what Orban chooses to allow them. A tyrant's dream.
I have Hungarian family. They, being closer to the Hungarian electorate than yourself, have had mixed experiences with democracy.

The Hungarians rise up and declare a democracy towards the end of WW1. Sinec they're no longer an autocracy, they expect Wilson's points to extend to them. Mistake number 1.

The Entente divvied up ethnic Hungarian lands and gave them to their neighbours. No plebescites, no votes. Just a blatant landgrab. The Czechs, Slovaks and Romanians then embarked on a cultural cleansing of the sizeable Hungarian minorities. The democratic Government collapses and a Soviet is formed and later a reactionary fascist regime.

Then the Allies essentially left them to the rule of the Soviets after WW2. Then they revolt looking for democracy and thousands get crushed in the aftermath. Mistake number 2.

Finally they are the impetus for the fall of the Iron curtain. A huge braindrain grips the country. Hungary loses annually enough people to economic emigration to fill Galway city.

But apparently Europe should now decide for them their immigration policy. At a time when Hungary is only catching up with the West, she is expected to shoulder a proportional burden to that of Germany.

It would be the equivalent of asking Ireland in the 1970's to accept migrants.

Little wonder Hungarians are somewhat wary of the schemings of Western Europeans.
 

Dame_Enda

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At the same time as supporting Orban's immigration policies, I also have some concerns about his media freedom policies. I recall a case involving a media company that was part-German owned, and ended up purging some journalists who were anti Orban. And now he's planning to merge 500 media titles into a vast media conglomerate and make it immune from anti monopoly law. I think that might be a step too far.

Pro-Orban media giant fuels fears for press freedom in Hungary
 

owedtojoy

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This is the same Europe where France has been run by compromise candidates since 2002, Spain is gripped with a secession crisis, Italy has elected a populist Government and where Ireland and Britain have been ruled by an occasional shuffle of the same two parties for the last century.

What constitues democracy? A crooked system that you just so happen to agree with?





I have Hungarian family. They, being closer to the Hungarian electorate than yourself, have had mixed experiences with democracy.

The Hungarians rise up and declare a democracy towards the end of WW1. Sinec they're no longer an autocracy, they expect Wilson's points to extend to them. Mistake number 1.

The Entente divvied up ethnic Hungarian lands and gave them to their neighbours. No plebescites, no votes. Just a blatant landgrab. The Czechs, Slovaks and Romanians then embarked on a cultural cleansing of the sizeable Hungarian minorities. The democratic Government collapses and a Soviet is formed and later a reactionary fascist regime.

Then the Allies essentially left them to the rule of the Soviets after WW2. Then they revolt looking for democracy and thousands get crushed in the aftermath. Mistake number 2.

Finally they are the impetus for the fall of the Iron curtain. A huge braindrain grips the country. Hungary loses annually enough people to economic emigration to fill Galway city.

But apparently Europe should now decide for them their immigration policy. At a time when Hungary is only catching up with the West, she is expected to shoulder a proportional burden to that of Germany.

It would be the equivalent of asking Ireland in the 1970's to accept migrants.

Little wonder Hungarians are somewhat wary of the schemings of Western Europeans.
Strikes me that Hungarians should be more wary of Eastern Europe and Russia that of Western Europe.

Immigration has been hardly mentioned. But Hungary is still a tyranny, not a democracy, by any definition. It is a classic fascist one-party state, and will suffer the consequences of all fascist one-party states - chaos.
 

Dame_Enda

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Strikes me that Hungarians should be more wary of Eastern Europe and Russia that of Western Europe.

Immigration has been hardly mentioned. But Hungary is still a tyranny, not a democracy, by any definition. It is a classic fascist one-party state, and will suffer the consequences of all fascist one-party states - chaos.
Nope. Observers had no problems with the fairness of the count process of the elections. Yes they complained of state media bias. But Trump has to put up with a monolithic liberal media bias and the US is still a democracy.
 

owedtojoy

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Nope. Observers had no problems with the fairness of the count process of the elections. Yes they complained of state media bias. But Trump has to put up with a monolithic liberal media bias and the US is still a democracy.
Straw man.

And the usual totallt bullshyte answers we have come to expect.

If the constituencies are gerrymandered, the "fairness" of the count is not worth spit.

Boo hoo, liberal media bias, stopping Republicans for generations, except for Faux News and Brainfart News etc. etc, my heart is bleeding, sound of mournful violins in the background, nobody knows the troubles you'be seen with dose libruls ...
 

Voluntary

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Finally they opened their eyes! A bit late, but hey, better late than never. 2 years from now authoritarians like Orban or Kaczynski will be gone and forgotten. Populists movement proved they are unable to deliver on promises and only bring chaos and destruction.

Good.
 

owedtojoy

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Finally they opened their eyes! A bit late, but hey, better late than never. 2 years from now authoritarians like Orban or Kaczynski will be gone and forgotten. Populists movement proved they are unable to deliver on promises and only bring chaos and destruction.

Good.
Well, I hope Orban and Kaczinski are gone, not so sure about the chaos and destruction.

(There were rumours during year that Kaczinski was seriously ill. Not sure what has happened since. We await the new "strongman", if any)
 

owedtojoy

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A Guardian article (from last month) about resistance to fascism & corruption in Eastern Europe.

  • There are regular public protest meetings in Slovakia and the Czech Republic
  • In Poland, the opposition made big gains in local elections.
  • In Romania, crowds still gather to protest against persistent corruption.
  • There were signs then that all was not well with the Orban regime.
For all the talk about central Europe having fallen prey to mind-numbing populism in recent years, some nuances and signs of change are worth paying closer attention to. Across the region, civil society activists are pushing back hard against the cynics in power. We should beware of caving in to a simplistic narrative about the east of Europe being a homogeneous hotbed of authoritarianism with little effort put into holding it in check. There is resistance.
A new wave of dissidents in the east can turn back Europe’s populist tide | Natalie Nougayrède | Opinion | The Guardian
 

Calculusmadeeasy

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It really only started to get reported today, but demonstrations against the Viktor Orban regime have been growing in Budapest over the weekend. Tear gas was fired at demonstrators in the capital.




Since the Orban regime totally control the news media in Hungary, there was a partial occupation of the State TV station by opposition MPs. They have now been ejected.

Orban's "soft Fascism" is a new phenomenon, but this is the first time it has been challenged openly. Orban's path to power was based on undemocratic gerrymandering and court-packing for Orban's party, Fidesz.



However, Hungarians love freedom today just as much as they did in 1956. Orban may win this round, but he will eventually fall, like as Authoritarians.

How Hungary's Viktor Orban destroyed democracy - Vox
Left wing nut jobs, Vox, fake news shocker.
 

Calculusmadeeasy

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Whataloadoffascistrubbish.

There are always the usual fake claims that Trump/ Putin/ Orban/ Kim Jong Un are "adored" and "loved" by the masses. Of course, they have their supporters .... but the Adored One has to worshipped by all, otherwise he feels insecure.



It must be worrying for the fake populists to find that even the Heroic Orban has created disillusion and mass dissent.
More flags than protestors.
 

Voluntary

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A Guardian article (from last month) about resistance to fascism & corruption in Eastern Europe.

  • There are regular public protest meetings in Slovakia and the Czech Republic
  • In Poland, the opposition made big gains in local elections.
  • In Romania, crowds still gather to protest against persistent corruption.
  • There were signs then that all was not well with the Orban regime.


A new wave of dissidents in the east can turn back Europe’s populist tide | Natalie Nougayrède | Opinion | The Guardian
You see, it was much easier to manipulate people in 70s and 80s than it is today. State's propaganda machines are losing with the internet. You'd really need to cut the country off to make authoritarian country work, something like China: no internet, no google, no facebook, no news, social scoring and stuff. People who have seen FREEDOM once, will never forget.
 

Calculusmadeeasy

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You see, it was much easier to manipulate people in 70s and 80s than it is today. State's propaganda machines are losing with the internet. You'd really need to cut the country off to make authoritarian country work, something like China: no internet, no google, no facebook, no news, social scoring and stuff. People who have seen FREEDOM once, will never forget.
No, it's as easy to manipulate people today.

PR evolves too yanno.
 

flavirostris

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More flags than protestors.
Couple of hundred max. But to the euro libtards, it's like a Bolshevik revolution against Orban.

Macron had to mobilise 89,000 cops 2 weeks ago. I don't see Guy Verhofstadt talking about Macron being under seige.
 

Calculusmadeeasy

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Couple of hundred max. But to the euro libtards, it's like a Bolshevik revolution against Orban.

Macron had to mobilise 89,000 cops 2 weeks ago. I don't see Guy Verhofstadt talking about Macron being under seige.
But OP wants us to believe that it's mass dissent?

 

flavirostris

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But OP wants us to believe that it's mass dissent?

He spends all his time trawling 'librul' fake news sources for any evidence of Trump or the European populists taking a beating.

He wants globo homo to win and defeat these evil racist populists.

You have to feel sorry for the poor lad.

Bet he wears his 'Michelle 2020' jumper around the house when he's not drinking soy lattes or watching John Oliver.
 

owedtojoy

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Couple of hundred max. But to the euro libtards, it's like a Bolshevik revolution against Orban.

Macron had to mobilise 89,000 cops 2 weeks ago. I don't see Guy Verhofstadt talking about Macron being under seige.
The population of France is nearly 7 times that of Hungary (it may be more at the rate young people are fleeing the place).

So pro rata, it is not going to be the same.

These demonstrations started a week ago, and are continuing.

Says a lot about a country were everyone is supposed to a smiley-faced, happy-clappy Orban lover.

Never underestimate the people, by the way. They have a way of achieving justice, in time and with patience.
 

Calculusmadeeasy

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The population of France is nearly 7 times that of Hungary (it may be more at the rate young people are fleeing the place).

So pro rata, it is not going to be the same.

These demonstrations started a week ago, and are continuing.

Says a lot about a country were everyone is supposed to a smiley-faced, happy-clappy Orban lover.

Never underestimate the people, by the way. They have a way of achieving justice, in time and with patience.
No one's making that claim.

Post some more photos and vids of these mass demonstrations.
 

flavirostris

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No one's making that claim.

Post some more photos and vids of these mass demonstrations.
He won't because it will come off as some kind of two strange lads doing a 'down with this sort of thing' picket.

Far from the popular uprising against Orban he wants to pretend it is.
 
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