IMF takeover - the Constitutional position

Podolski1.5

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Once again we are hearing dire warnings that the International Monetary Fund will take over the running of our economy if the government doesn't institute even more vicious austerity measures than already in place.

Dr. Death himself, Colm McCarthy, is quoted in today's Sunday Independent as saying that the IMF will be running the country by February if the government doesn't get its house in order, i.e. screw the people even more.

McCarthy warning: IMF is at our door - National News, Frontpage - Independent.ie

Leaving aside the financial implications for a while I wish to raise the Constitutional positon if a foreign based elite is to take power in some form over the Republic of Ireland.

This country is governed by a Constitution which clearly states:


Article 5


Ireland is a sovereign, independent, democratic state.

Article 6


1. All powers of government, legislative, executive and judicial, derive, under God, from the people, whose right it is to designate the rulers of the State and, in final appeal, to decide all questions of national policy, according to the requirements of the common good.

2. These powers of government are exercisable only by or on the authority of the organs of State established by this Constitution.
So, would an IMF takeover be a flagrant breach of our Constitution, indeed would it amount to a coup d'etat? In my view it would.

No doubt we will be told that the IMF wouldn't be taking over directly, that it would merely dictate the terms to an Irish Finance Minister (which is already happening from the EU). However it would still amount to a usurpation of power.
 


wombat

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No doubt we will be told that the IMF wouldn't be taking over directly, that it would merely dictate the terms to an Irish Finance Minister (which is already happening from the EU). However it would still amount to a usurpation of power.
If no one else will loan the govt. money and the govt. needs to borrow, it will be on terms dictated by the IMF. We will still fly the Tricolour over Leinster House, we will still have the trappings of independence but the govt. will implement the policies that the lender wants. He who pays the piper will call the tune
 

orbit

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It's got nothing to do with the constitution. The IMF would just be offering us a deal which we could take or leave. Say the government chooses to leave the deal, but then runs out of money - teachers, gardai, nurses, retireees etc. would find that their salary/pensions don't get paid, simply because the state doesn't have the money.
 

blinding

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Honestly we may see this come to pass. It may be dressed up as something else.

The FFail party must have the stake driven throuh the place that a heart would be if it had one.

If we have one iota of respect for ourselves as a country or a people we must rid ourselves of this corruption infested cabal.
 

greengoose2

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It's got nothing to do with the constitution. The IMF would just be offering us a deal which we could take or leave. Say the government chooses to leave the deal, but then runs out of money - teachers, gardai, nurses, retireees etc. would find that their salary/pensions don't get paid, simply because the state doesn't have the money.
Thank God for that. So it's only the PS which would suffer? Did you figure that one out on your own or did some drunken barfly help you?

According to the MoS "Ireland owes the ECD 260bn! Perhaps that figure would be more credible if it was published in the Sindo under the name of O'Connor , O'Dea of Cecelia Ahern. ;)
 

atlantic

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ireland sign away its sovereignty when it handed over the issuing of its currency to the Bankster puppets in the ECB and Europe.Whoever controls the money supply and price of money controls Ireland we are finding that out to late.
The IMF and ECB are a bankster gangster outfits ,given three letter titles but are worse than any mafia.
 

Tomas Mor

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Maybe we will need another referendum if the IMF come in !!
 

Expatriot

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Deal or no deal, I am not sure that any TD has the legal right to sign such a deal. We would all have to vote on it. I know how I would vote.
 

Mister men

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We've had two years to get rid of FF now and we as a people have failed. We will see the IMF come in i'd say early in the new year and the PS is going to be obliterated. They'll be lucky to get away with a 20% reduction in staffing numbers and 20% pay cut across the board.
 

bormotello

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Government can reduce spending by 30Bn and then it will be no need for IMF
Why markets should subsidize left wing populists in Ireland?
 

atlantic

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Everyone would suffer ,these gangsters would want taxation at mad levels and reduce people to serfdom, it wouldn't surprise me if they tried to get the government hijack private pensions in some way.
They'd suffer the most, and social welfare recipients - no question about that.
 

cry freedom

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The IMF and the ECB don't give a flying f*ck about our Humpty Dumpty constitution.
They won't even need to come here it implement their policies.
They can just turn off a few taps in Bonn or Berlin or New York to have their way.
When a household is in hock to a moneylender it loses a large part ot its independence and dignity. Same with a nation state.
Maybe we should rename ourselves as the "State of Chassis"
 

Expatriot

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They'd suffer the most, and social welfare recipients - no question about that.

They wont even be close to the worst affected, try 50 euro dole or being sick. Or emigration with no cash in your pocket. If you retain any job you are winning, and most PS workers will be retained.

If you do an essential job you will retain it. Its about survival if the IMF take over. Many PS workers would fair better than most. Your average Guard might take a hit but will have to be kept sweet to some extent. They could not care less what a small business in Shannon thinks or wants.

Taxes will sky rocket and all supports for private industry would be removed.
We must have more quangos to support private industry than any other country in the world.

We have various supports such as enterprise Ireland, bord bia, Bord Failte, Fas etc etc. They would all go. Business will be invited to pay tax at EU levels and fund their own PR, HR and training requirements.

SW would be slashed. Bank jobs would be slashed also. There is a a lot of people making a living from the State that are not involved in core functions of the state as the IMF would see it. The IMF is not going to be funding PR campaigns to eat cheese or holiday in Donegal.

It is not going to be supporting 6 or 7 bank branches on every high street in the country. I think a lot of private sector people are living in a fools paradise as regards what and who will be affected. What the markets think will not come into it. Slash costs as quickly as possible, that is all that matters.

Capital program? forget it

Funding to private health care?

Tax breaks for hotels?

Private pension tax break?

Professional fees for tribunals and other professionals?

NAMA? A ten year plan is a joke. They will sell all the property now for whatever they can get and end the game of musical chairs. Property will go down a lot more.

Funding for third level?

All the semi states would be sold and the price of those things will sky rocket.

Maternity pay for private sector workers?

There are no winners from an IMF take over, they are a debt collection agency and they hit anyone and everyone. They are there to make sure you pay your debt not to bring in some right wing dream of slashing the PS. The first thing that will go is private sector indirect supports.
 
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gijoe

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With the IMF knocking at the door you can only laugh at the CPSU and their resistance to the ending of the 'half-hour' cheque cashing wheeze. What will CPSU tell their members when the IMF tells to government to take 20% off their pay?
 

darkhorse

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The target of the IMF will be the annual €20billion overspend on the PS, social welfare and health services. Once that is down to reasonable levels then the problem is solved.
They wont be agonising about the fairness of any of their measures.
 

Gemlarkin

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Part of this is conditioning the people to swallow a harsh budget

Part of this is conditioning the people to swallow a harsh budget.

The reality is we need cuts similar to the UK
 

Expatriot

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The target of the IMF will be the annual €20billion overspend on the PS, social welfare and health services. Once that is down to reasonable levels then the problem is solved.
They wont be agonising about the fairness of any of their measures.
Ok you cut PS pay bill by 50%. (not that you could).


That nets between 5 and 6 billion at most.


Where is the other 13 billion coming from?

The elite in this county are finished, the water is at their feet. There is no cavalry coming for them. The rest of us are used to surviving or leaving, we can do so again. The rats don't know how to swim though.
 


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