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Insane salary expectations of Irish Undergraduates

General Urko

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Oct 24, 2012
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Firstly, sorry I cannot post a link but, it has been widely reported on Newstalk today, including an interview with a recruitment consultant that male undergraduates in our great little country have a starting salary expectation of €44 K per year while the ladies are a little bit more reserved expecting a mere €40 K per year as a staring salary!
The reality is they will get, if they get anything, between €18 K - € 23 K per year!
This beggars a lot of questions:

1 scum employers rule the roost?
2 What do you expect for what is now really a 1980s Junior cert level qualification i.e. a primary degree?
3 How arrogant are our undergraduates? Is their drinking and drug taking diminishing their perception of reality?
4 Do they all hope to join our public sector (may be on the basis on contacts) and continue the very real apartheid we have here?
 


Mercurial

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How much of this is attributable to undergrads just not having a very good sense of money in general? It can take a while for kids to become aware of the real value of money and to set their expectations accordingly.
 

Hibee

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Yip : utter insane to look for a living wage in a dear city .

The bastirts !!!
 

Trainwreck

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Firstly, sorry I cannot post a link but, it has been widely reported on Newstalk today, including an interview with a recruitment consultant that male undergraduates in our great little country have a starting salary expectation of €44 K per year while the ladies are a little bit more reserved expecting a mere €40 K per year as a staring salary!
The reality is they will get, if they get anything, between €18 K - € 23 K per year!
This beggars a lot of questions:

1 scum employers rule the roost?
2 What do you expect for what is now really a 1980s Junior cert level qualification i.e. a primary degree?
3 How arrogant are our undergraduates? Is their drinking and drug taking diminishing their perception of reality?
4 Do they all hope to join our public sector (may be on the basis on contacts) and continue the very real apartheid we have here?
The general sense of entitlement is now out of control among this cohort. You only have to look at the delusional nonsense in campuses in the US and UK recently.
 

General Urko

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How much of this is attributable to undergrads just not having a very good sense of money in general? It can take a while for kids to become aware of the real value of money and to set their expectations accordingly.
Middle class arse holes surprisingly not living in the real world!
 

Accidental sock

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Who do they think are? LUAS drivers?
 

General Urko

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Yip : utter insane to look for a living wage in a dear city .

The bastirts !!!
Wasn't it the president of UCC who said some time ago that it was very difficult to live on well over €200 K per year!:mad:
 

General Urko

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Don't get me started!

Who do they think are? LUAS drivers?
I think those absolutely greedy fooking clowns are looking for about €48 K per year, in a job for which the primary qualification is a full driving licence, no not a special one, just a regullar one!
 

Watcher2

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The general sense of entitlement is now out of control among this cohort. You only have to look at the delusional nonsense in campuses in the US and UK recently.
Not just that cohort. I give you Luas Drivers as Exhibit A.
 

General Urko

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Such lack of touch with reality among our privileged undergrads really underpins how shyte our educational system is and how useless they are!
 

Henry94.

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Why are we condemning our young people for coming to the table with high expectations? They are dead right. The biggest problem the world economy is facing is the fact that the wealthy are hoovering up an increasingly large proportion of the wealth. And we want our best and brightest to doff their caps and take what they are given?
 

ShinnerBot No.32564844524

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Such lack of touch with reality among our privileged undergrads really underpins how shyte our educational system is and how useless they are!
I'm not a fan of entitlement, but let's temper this a little.

First of all, the source being a soundbite on DinnyTalk doesn't sound the most scientific, some recruitment head looking for media attention can say anything they want. What college, what grads, what industry etc...

Second of all, do we have a grip on what it really costs to live in this country? We have minimum wage on barely 14-16K a year, we have grads on internships, cops and nurses on 23K a year so it looks that if you're under 25K a year, you're hardly living the high life, in fact you're more than likely scraping by. 44K probably isn't that far of a standard of living that previous generations during economic growth in decades past were used to, so given that the younger working generations didn't bankrupt this country, it's a bit rich calling them entitled for expecting the standard of living that the previous generation rejected in favor of avarice and selfishness enough to throw the country and future generations in to decades of debt.

Third of all, the truth of the matter is that all our grads probably really expect in terms of starting salary expectations is a ticket out of this country as fast as they can before their career is ruined by exploitation, jobspath, jobsbridge and the jobsworths who can't even run this society to a standard where said grads can even hope of a future once regarded as normal where you might afford a house, car, and education for your kids.

So probably time to take a step back and breath, we won't have much breathing room when all those privileged undergrads are abroad while the aging population here rushes headlong in to the medical care and pension crisis. Tir na nÓg was a foreign land for a reason given the attitudes of the present Irish senior generations.
 

VHF

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Undergrads expectations are completely out of touch with reality.

1. they enter the workforce with largely no meaningful and relevant work experience or expertise

2. said work experience and expertise is accumulated over years

3. as a direct result of #2 plus CPD you improve your value to an employer who in turn rewards through fair and representative remuneration for the role responsibility and accountability

Too many grads (not all of them btw) come to interviews with inflated views of themselves. They skills and expertise they need to develop a chosen career is built up over a period of time. Priority #1 land a job. Priority #2 pursue professional qualifications. Priority #3 get on the job relevant experience to the role you want to pursue.

No point rocking up with a flaky generalist business degree if you want to work as a hedgie for example. Or some flaky humanity degree. Our grads are pricing themselves out of the competitive shake down against other grads for jobs in Ireland or the UK or Europe. Look at the starting salaries for those coming of the grad schemes at any of the big 4 or actuarial posts or fund management. Or look at the basic starting salary for a trainee commercial pilot at Cityjet or Ryanair, it's remarkably modest in those early career years. As you become more experienced clearly salary tracks accordingly.
 

stakerwallace

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Undergrads expectations are completely out of touch with reality.

1. they enter the workforce with largely no meaningful and relevant work experience or expertise

2. said work experience and expertise is accumulated over years

3. as a direct result of #2 plus CPD you improve your value to an employer who in turn rewards through fair and representative remuneration for the role responsibility and accountability

Too many grads (not all of them btw) come to interviews with inflated views of themselves. They skills and expertise they need to develop a chosen career is built up over a period of time. Priority #1 land a job. Priority #2 pursue professional qualifications. Priority #3 get on the job relevant experience to the role you want to pursue.

No point rocking up with a flaky generalist business degree if you want to work as a hedgie for example. Or some flaky humanity degree. Our grads are pricing themselves out of the competitive shake down against other grads for jobs in Ireland or the UK or Europe. Look at the starting salaries for those coming of the grad schemes at any of the big 4 or actuarial posts or fund management. Or look at the basic starting salary for a trainee commercial pilot at Cityjet or Ryanair, it's remarkably modest in those early career years. As you become more experienced clearly salary tracks accordingly.
Not convinced by this report. The evidence of my own eyes tells me that I see plenty of graduates working in bars, cafes, shops and they are not on big money. They may aspire to it but have sufficient grasp of reality to see it as a dream rather than an actuality.
 

VHF

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If a grad can't get work in their preferred chosen field of interest in Ireland then they should consider gaining broader life experiences through pursuing their chosen field with employers beyond Ireland. Gain a different perspective. I do not understand grads who decide to compromise on their career building. Not all are driven, some just go through the motions cause parents pushed them but there are hundreds of grads finding work overseas in their chosen career path in the UK, Brussels, Frankfurt, Madrid, or Paris, etc. You don't need to shoot over to NYC or Boston or Canada or Australia. There are jobs in Europe for the 'right' candidates. But you need to want the job and put the hard work in and study professional exams and often for years.
 

Sister Mercedes

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I'm not surprised kids have high salary expectations when they see how expensive everything is here. You'd need a high salary to have the same lifestyle that someone in the rest of Europe has on a modest income.

We need to shift the focus from salary increases to reducing the crazy cost of living here.
 

DaveM

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I'm not a fan of entitlement, but let's temper this a little.

First of all, the source being a soundbite on DinnyTalk doesn't sound the most scientific, some recruitment head looking for media attention can say anything they want. What college, what grads, what industry etc...

Second of all, do we have a grip on what it really costs to live in this country? We have minimum wage on barely 14-16K a year, we have grads on internships, cops and nurses on 23K a year so it looks that if you're under 25K a year, you're hardly living the high life, in fact you're more than likely scraping by. 44K probably isn't that far of a standard of living that previous generations during economic growth in decades past were used to, so given that the younger working generations didn't bankrupt this country, it's a bit rich calling them entitled for expecting the standard of living that the previous generation rejected in favor of avarice and selfishness enough to throw the country and future generations in to decades of debt.

Third of all, the truth of the matter is that all our grads probably really expect in terms of starting salary expectations is a ticket out of this country as fast as they can before their career is ruined by exploitation, jobspath, jobsbridge and the jobsworths who can't even run this society to a standard where said grads can even hope of a future once regarded as normal where you might afford a house, car, and education for your kids.

So probably time to take a step back and breath, we won't have much breathing room when all those privileged undergrads are abroad while the aging population here rushes headlong in to the medical care and pension crisis. Tir na nÓg was a foreign land for a reason given the attitudes of the present Irish senior generations.
The problem with graduates expecting €44K a year is what the employer gets in return. Most graduates are about as useful as a chocolate teapot for the first 12-18 months after they are hired. As they become more useful their earning capacity rises rapidly as employers seek to retain their services.

When it comes to third level graduates most of my experience is in recruiting engineers (civil, mechanical and electrical). For €44K/annum I'd want a minimum of 3 years directly applicable experience. Someone a wet week off campus asking for that much might raise a bit of a giggle before being politely shown the door.
 

VHF

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I'm not surprised kids have high salary expectations when they see how expensive everything is here. You'd need a high salary to have the same lifestyle that someone in the rest of Europe has on a modest income.

We need to shift the focus from salary increases to reducing the crazy cost of living here.
That's precisely what's needed. My place won't expand or hire at our ops in the IFSC for that reason. We hire and expand into continental Europe because we can find good quality grads with good English and who are very happy to gain a position on a good starting salary which goes a longer distance in countries which have cheaper cost of living than Ireland.

I think Ireland Inc is in trouble longterm unless the cost of living is addressed.
 

ShinnerBot No.32564844524

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The problem with graduates expecting €44K a year is what the employer gets in return. Most graduates are about as useful as a chocolate teapot for the first 12-18 months after they are hired. As they become more useful their earning capacity rises rapidly as employers seek to retain their services.

When it comes to third level graduates most of my experience is in recruiting engineers (civil, mechanical and electrical). For €44K/annum I'd want a minimum of 3 years directly applicable experience. Someone a wet week off campus asking for that much might raise a bit of a giggle before being politely shown the door.
Ay, but I'm not saying they should have 44K starting expectations, I'm just pointing out the holes in the OP. Some HR/Recruitment talking head went on Dinnytalk and spouts crap about graduates expecting €44K and all of a sudden graduates are the new Luas drivers to be vilified and shot down. When that's the love your country has for you, why hang around? Ireland's a basket case in how it treats its young.
 

DaveM

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Ay, but I'm not saying they should have 44K starting expectations, I'm just pointing out the holes in the OP. Some HR/Recruitment talking head went on Dinnytalk and spouts crap about graduates expecting €44K and all of a sudden graduates are the new Luas drivers to be vilified and shot down. When that's the love your country has for you, why hang around? Ireland's a basket case in how it treats its young.
Didn't hear the interview but at the same time I have come across graduate interviewees with bizarrely inflated senses of their own self worth. That said I've come across many more with no such issues. It's less common now than it was before the recession.

In my experience attitude is the single most valuable trait in a perspective graduate employee. Silly salary expectations are indicative of someone lacking in good judgment and set my eejit warning alarms off straight away.
 

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