Irish Thatcher required (please attach cv)

HarshBuzz

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OK, maybe not to the point of allowing hunder strikers to die :? but I do think that the seriousness of the economic (recession) and political (Lisbon) crisis facing the country at the moment is so dire that we need an 'Irish Thatcher' who fits the following criteria:

(a) knows the policies required to put the country back on the right track (massive public sector reform, fix Govt current spending, end dependency on the housing sector, get Lisbon passed one way or another, smash the clientelist model of politics in this country, eradicate political corruption, get our infrastructure up to the required level, build a nuclear power station etc etc - add your own)

(b) has the toughness to face down all the vested interests to actually get these policies implemented - unions, CIF, clientelists etc

I look around the Dail and I don't see anyone with the required attributes. All in all, I wouldn't trust most of them to run a corner shop. It seems that we Irish don't like conviction politicans (no, not the Stroke Fahy type of convictions ;) ) but that's exactly what we will require in the coming years.

Love her or loath her, Thatcher had the necessary courage to do what it took to get the UK back on its feet. We need the same now. FF got us into this mess, I don't see them (or anyone else of the current crop) getting us out.
 


mairteenpak

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How about Michael O'Leary
 

HarshBuzz

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mairteenpak said:
How about Michael O'Leary
It may sound facetious (maybe you are being serious) but he does fit the bill in many respects
 

Tiernanator

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HarshBuzz said:
OK, maybe not to the point of allowing hunder strikers to die :? but I do think that the seriousness of the economic (recession) and political (Lisbon) crisis facing the country at the moment is so dire that we need an 'Irish Thatcher' who fits the following criteria:

(a) knows the policies required to put the country back on the right track (massive public sector reform, fix Govt current spending, end dependency on the housing sector, get Lisbon passed one way or another, smash the clientelist model of politics in this country, eradicate political corruption, get our infrastructure up to the required level, build a nuclear power station etc etc - add your own)

(b) has the toughness to face down all the vested interests to actually get these policies implemented - unions, CIF, clientelists etc

I look around the Dail and I don't see anyone with the required attributes. All in all, I wouldn't trust most of them to run a corner shop. It seems that we Irish don't like conviction politicans (no, not the Stroke Fahy type of convictions ;) ) but that's exactly what we will require in the coming years.

Love her or loath her, Thatcher had the necessary courage to do what it took to get the UK back on its feet. We need the same now. FF got us into this mess, I don't see them (or anyone else of the current crop) getting us out.
We do not now nor ever will need anything remotely like an Irish Thatcher. Mind you McDowell came a close second.
 

HarshBuzz

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Tiernanator said:
We do not now nor ever will need anything remotely like an Irish Thatcher. Mind you McDowell came a close second.
blanket statements aren't particularly enlightening unless you back them up with reasons
 

mairteenpak

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HarshBuzz said:
mairteenpak said:
How about Michael O'Leary
It may sound facetious (maybe you are being serious) but he does fit the bill in many respects
He would take the job :mrgreen:
 

st333ve

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Sure why dont you just invite another Cromwell, according to our neighbours he was also a great leader :roll:
 

HarshBuzz

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st333ve said:
Sure why dont you just invite another Cromwell, according to our neighbours he was also a great leader :roll:
again, a throwaway quip. Very enlightening. Maybe I should have said FDR instead to remove the anti-English reflex that afflicts some posters on this site.

can I ask you a question; are you happy with current standards of political leadership in this country?
 

Aindriu

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st333ve said:
Sure why dont you just invite another Cromwell, according to our neighbours he was also a great leader :roll:
I take it you haven't seen the report then about an English historian writing a new book about Cromwell's time? She says that what Cromwell did in Ireland was very wrong and could not be justified. Just because some donut put up a statue of him does not mean the English like him.
 

Tiernanator

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HarshBuzz said:
Tiernanator said:
We do not now nor ever will need anything remotely like an Irish Thatcher. Mind you McDowell came a close second.
blanket statements aren't particularly enlightening unless you back them up with reasons
A blanket statement because Ireland is not and never will be the UK. Economic conditions have always varied and the role of the trade union movement is not the same as it was in Thatchers time. What the world doesn't need at the minute or ever in my opinion is a return to failed monetarist policies. THEY DON'T WORK....BOOM AND BUST ...BOOM AND BUST. So therefore Ireland like rest of the world does not need a Thatcher/Raygun figure to put the boot into the working class. The working class already has a big enough boot in their solar plexus with personal debt, low paid foreign workers and many other factors.
 

st333ve

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Aindriu said:
st333ve said:
Sure why dont you just invite another Cromwell, according to our neighbours he was also a great leader :roll:
I take it you haven't seen the report then about an English historian writing a new book about Cromwell's time? She says that what Cromwell did in Ireland was very wrong and could not be justified. Just because some donut put up a statue of him does not mean the English like him.
I also know that some Irishman wrote a book about how he was a ' worthy enemy ' and not really that bad.

Anyway, Thatcher didnt help the economy in a long term sence.
One of the largest mistackes ever made was letting people sell their state council homes, thus giving the property developers the green light to buy them all up and sell them for 3 times the price.
Bye bye affordable available housing.
 

HarshBuzz

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Tiernanator said:
A blanket statement because Ireland is not and never will be the UK. Economic conditions have always varied and the role of the trade union movement is not the same as it was in Thatchers time. What the world doesn't need at the minute or ever in my opinion is a return to failed monetarist policies. THEY DON'T WORK....BOOM AND BUST ...BOOM AND BUST. So therefore Ireland like rest of the world does not need a Thatcher/Raygun figure to put the boot into the working class. The working class already has a big enough boot in their solar plexus with personal debt, low paid foreign workers and many other factors.
who said anything about 'putting the boot into the working class'? :?

I was talking about leadership, the kind that requires making the tough, correct decisions now that will realise long-term benefits. Those decisions will affect everyone, not just one section of the population. (There's nothing we can do about foreign (intra-EU) workers so I don't understand why you bring that up)

Do you deny that leadership is required? If no, who in the current Dail do you see providing that kind of leadership?
 

mairteenpak

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O'Leary is coming to his prime and is still alive

Think of the savings

Irish Language gone
Farm Grants and subsidies gone
Health Insurance for all with the premiums paid by the state for the poor. Health Care to become part of our Export Sector by tendering and winning work on foreign patients as well as our own, through treatment purchase schemes for other nations. Ditto dental care.

Third level education funded by loan scheme.
Second level provide for more online classes and resources.
Performance review in Education Sack the bottom 20% of teachers and increase class sizes.
Defence reduce the army by 80% train more officers on short service commissions and a 30,000 volunteer citizen army
Set up an Irish foreign Legion to be hired out for peace keeping. Staff recruited at the Circuit Courts for felonious offences.

Development aid to be expanded by 1000% but in return for concessions on natural resources, construction contracts, etc.
Abolish Stamp duty
10% CGT on sale of the principal residence
Corporation tax 5%
More cost effective prisons. Seal prisons to make them drug free.
Tendering for all local authority works

Invest some of the Pensions reserve in a proper national road network

Become self sufficient in Renewable energy

A tax on borrowed money to be increased as ECB rates fall

Build new State of the Art Cities from scratch planned for 21 century living.

A new Green card emigration system, where the talented can make a new life in Ireland. Duck out all failed asylum seekers
 

Tiernanator

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HarshBuzz said:
Tiernanator said:
A blanket statement because Ireland is not and never will be the UK. Economic conditions have always varied and the role of the trade union movement is not the same as it was in Thatchers time. What the world doesn't need at the minute or ever in my opinion is a return to failed monetarist policies. THEY DON'T WORK....BOOM AND BUST ...BOOM AND BUST. So therefore Ireland like rest of the world does not need a Thatcher/Raygun figure to put the boot into the working class. The working class already has a big enough boot in their solar plexus with personal debt, low paid foreign workers and many other factors.
who said anything about 'putting the boot into the working class'? :?

I was talking about leadership, the kind that requires making the tough, correct decisions now that will realise long-term benefits. Those decisions will affect everyone, not just one section of the population. (There's nothing we can do about foreign (intra-EU) workers so I don't understand why you bring that up)

Do you deny that leadership is required? If no, who in the current Dail do you see providing that kind of leadership?
Both Raygun and Thatcher put the boot into working class communities. Cut spending on essential services and increased spending on non-essential services such as killing people in foreign countries and propping up facist dictatorships throughout the globe. So your talking about a happy-clappy nice Thatcher for us. It would not work for Ireland. Irish people are by nature wary of extremes and a Thatcher like figure would have to be a policy extremist.
 

HarshBuzz

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Tiernanator said:
Both Raygun and Thatcher put the boot into working class communities. Cut spending on essential services and increased spending on non-essential services such as killing people in foreign countries and propping up facist dictatorships throughout the globe. So your talking about a happy-clappy nice Thatcher for us. It would not work for Ireland. Irish people are by nature wary of extremes and a Thatcher like figure would have to be a policy extremist.
I don't want an extremist (they'd never get elected anyway as you correctly point out), just a leader with the vision and balls to get the right things done for the country as a whole.

I am purely talking domestic politics here, obviously no Taoiseach is going to be invading Iraq, Nicaragua or the Falklands!

I notice you didn't answer my previous question
 

Aindriu

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What we could do with is some very successful business people going into politics. What we have at the moment is a Daíl full of school teachers and lawyers - not a business brain amongst them.
 

HarshBuzz

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Aindriu said:
What we could do with is some very successful business people going into politics. What we have at the moment is a Daíl full of school teachers and lawyers - not a business brain amongst them.
I totally agree

mind you, a very successful businessman ran for election last year in my constituency (Mr O'Briens sandwiches - can't remember his name) for FG and did poorly. The old order of gombeenery endureth.
 

mairteenpak

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We need a government based on the American model. Our taoiseach can never make tough decisions as he is reliant on back bench support.
 

Aindriu

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mairteenpak said:
We need a government based on the American model.
On no we feckin don't!!! :shock2: :shock2:
 

mairteenpak

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We need a directly elected Taoiseach with the power ,derived from the popular vote to choose a cabinet from outside the dail if necessary, (bigger talent pool)
 


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